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 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy

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aurynn
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PostSubject: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 26 2014, 22:10

Hey guys. I know this perhaps should not be here, but I was trying to kill some time waiting on our new dex. So I decided to try and make a fluffy TS list. I like TS. I like their background. And I like Ahzek Ahriman. I know there is not much to work with regarding TS, but the better the challenge was. So here it is:

HQ
- Ahriman

TROOPS
- 8x TS + 1 Aspiring Sorc (as 9 is a sacred number for TS), Rhino - combi
- 8x TS + 1 Aspiring Sorc (as 9 is a sacred number for TS), Rhino - combi

ELITES
- Chaos Contemptor Dread with 2x Butcher Cannon (total 8x S8 AP4 36'') and Tzeentch Dedication (reroll invul saves of 1) - contemptor can easily be rubric as he does not go nuts
- 4x Chaos Termies with combi-melta (or flamer) and either PwrAxe or PwrMaul, +1 Champion with combi and Chainfist, Land Raider with combi (can easily be rubric)

HEAVY SUPPORT
- Relic Predator with 2x Las, 1x TL Las

FORMATION - HELLBRUTES MAYHEM PACK (surviving dreads from the pre-heresy age thus their madness)
3x Hellbrute, Multimelta, PwrFist w. Heavy Flamer

My goal was to create as fluffy list as possible without it being useless. :-) So as little mech as possible, no dinobots, hellturkeys, oblits, mutils, preferrably as many units that may be taken as rubrics or remnants of pre-heresy era. Thus "relic" predator and three dreads that work as a single unit.
I have means to open vehicle, even LRs and monoliths, some flamers and some CC potential. Some anti 3+ and anti 2+ and some pretty tough units.

I would like to hear your comments and critique.


Last edited by aurynn on Sat Sep 27 2014, 06:13; edited 1 time in total
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Mr Believer
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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 27 2014, 02:28

There's a lot of stuff in this list I'm not too sure of the rules on, and a quick google (wahey) isn't proving that helpful regarding some of them, specifically the Butcher Cannon (is it really Str 8 Ap 4 Hvy 4 36"?), Relic Predator (it just looks like a normal Predator Annihilator loadout to me), Tzeentch dedication and things being the Rubric. Some clarification of those things would be good before making too many assessments, but here are some thoughts. Those Helbrutes are a pretty cheap and tempting option on ebay. It's almost like GW created the dataslates just because there were so many Helbrutes kicking around from the Dark Vengeance set. But I'd go with monstrous creatures over walkers every time. Monstrous creatures have wounds, whereas walkers have hull points. If a monstrous creature loses a wound, it doesn't flail around pathetically for a turn, or stand there crying about it. Walkers do. Don't get me wrong, I love walkers, I have a Deff Dread converted from a Sentinel in my Ork army, with plans to add Killa Kans and all sorts, but monstrous creatures just knock them out of the park. If you're looking to compete, 300 points worth of walkers isn't the way to go (I'm assuming the formation costs Helbrutex3, never, having bought the dataslate). I know CSM lack access to monstrous creatures compared to other armies, but they do get one of the big nasties - the Daemon Prince. Whilst he's not the BIG nasty he was when 6th dropped before the CSM codex, he's still a beast kitted out right. A DP with power armour and wings isn't that pricey, and you can throw all sorts of extra stuff on him to add oomph to your list, like mastery levels and relics.

Ahriman is very, VERY expensive. I know you want to be fluffy, but you can save a lot of points by switching him out for a generic Tzeentch sorcerer. If Sons as troops is your big thing, I'd heartily recommend it. Although, everything scores now, so really you could take any generic HQ (such as a Warpsmith, which I personally think are hugely underrated) and a couple of tiny cultist units to fulfill your requirements, then go nuts picking from the rest of the codex. Of course, Objective Secured is always useful, so the Sorcerer route is more recommended!

Terminators piling out of a Land Raider with enough gear to do their jobs I approve of. I hate the idea of Termicide squads. They seem totally contrary to the whole idea of Terminators to me, especially traitor ones, where tactical dreadnought armour is in even scarcer supply. It looks like this lot can disembark, have their vehicle shoot at a transport, double tap it if necessary, then charge the occupants. Stick some Dirge Casters on the Land Raider on the off chance that it gets in range to use them and job's a good'un. I very much approve of this unit!

The list isn't very fast. That's my overriding concern. Some bikes or even Raptors might help it cover objectives a bit quicker, as would transportation for the Thousand Sons. The only cult troops that hate being put in Rhinos are Berzerkers, because they need to get the charge off - Plague Marines love getting charged because it gives them a chance to sweep in the opposing turn and their opponent doesn't get extra attacks for charging anyway, and Thousand Sons and Noise Marines absolutely HAVE to be shooting to even come close to doing the job you bought them for. Sons can tool about in a Rhino, with little to no impact on their overall combat effectiveness, depending on how well you time their disembarkation - if you're sitting them still waiting for the enemy to come into boltgun range, things are not going to go well for you Wink

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aurynn
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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 27 2014, 06:40

Wow, thanks for the large comment. Okay. I added some info to the list that was missing. :-)

Now for the comments. "Being Rubric" is a fluff thing. As you may know, most of TS are now just souls bound to armours and are automatons under the sorcerers' command - they are called "rubrics". Only sorcerers are alive. There is no mentioning of Dreads, but I guess they will be also just souls bound to Dread shell. BUT... those rubric marines cannot with good conscience use hellbrutes "go crazy" rules. Thats why the Hellbrute formation is made of very old (and potentionally crazy) non-rubric dreadnoughts from pre-heresy era. They survived by working together as a single unit.

Relic Predator is just a normal predator with expensive FW model. But its fluffy, coz its relic. TS very rarely use any mechs. Even using rhinos is stretching the fluff, so I went for the Relic variant even though its the same as normal predator.

Hellbrutes cost - I would use FW Thousand Sons Dread models, so dont care for cheap. I care for fluff and beauty. :-)

Formation - I know that Hellbrutes are not exactly used and for good reason, but this formation gives them Deep Strike (must start in reserve) and IWND... better, no? :-) And fluffy. 3 ancient dreads probably have their own means of transportation and surviving 10K years does tell something about that they will friggin' not die... :-D and they have some right to be nuts after such a time.

DP - the only daemon in Ahriman's army? Ahriman does not like daemons much. And he will really stand out as weird in this kind of list anyway. And in addition I find DPs very easy to kill and much nerfed under the 7th edition. It costs as much as that hellbrute formation, does not give me what I need (means to open LRs, instagib T5 units - like DPs, flamers for hordes and immunity to S5 and lower).

Ahriman expensive? I beg to differ... Try to build a ML3 sorcerer with similar equip and abilities and you will find he is around 180 pts. For 50 more pts I am getting a ML4 (!) psyker, who can cast 3 same witchfire powers each magic phase (!!!). Ahriman is a brutal beast of a psyker. For example - 3x Psychic Shriek every phase? Hell yea! He is not expensive IMHO. :-)

I dont have pts for Dirge Caster on LR, but I will stick it on if I find the points somewhere.

I forgot to put Rhinos in the list for TS, but they are there. Just my mistake in writing. :-) But yea, the list is not "fast", but has good range and I dont really see this list chasing anything around. But if I need something dead, I will just drop the three Hellbrutes on top of it. Raptors, Bikers... they work fine for all the other chaos gods, but I want them marked and 6++ is nothing to write home about. TS have 4++, Termies have 4++, Contemptor has 4++ against glances and 6++ against pene  rerolling 1s on both, Hellbrutes have IWND, Landraider is a Landraider. The most vulnerable thing in the list are Rhinos and if enemy shoots them, I will be happy happy happy. And there is always some room in Rhinos for Ahriman to cast invisibility and such dickery if it suits me. And lastly, even TS can footslog their way towards some objective. :-) Its really hard to pick targets in this list I think. I also have only 1 HS and no FA. :-)

The only thing I would really like is a no-scatter DS. But the Brand is not a good thing to use. I cannot be sure I will be able to get a kill in CC on T1 and the brutes can come T2. So I will just have to live with it. :-)

Anyway, I think this list will be fun to build, paint and learn to play. I love using units other people scorn. :-) OFC I will not be able to beat some dickish uber-pwr lists, but thats not the point. :-)
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Mr Believer
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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 27 2014, 09:32

Hmmm, I should really have read the title of this thread properly! This list is very fluffy, so I appreciate some of your choices a bit more. About the only way you can almost guarantee a deep strike that doesn't scatter is with Huron AND a lord with the key, which is a shame for any of those players who want to use fluffy lists that aren't Red Corsairs. And that still relies on you going second so you can charge. Why do they put these awesome yet impossible to use things in the codex?!

Make sure to post some pictures up when you've got some paint on them!

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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 27 2014, 09:45

I dont even have the army yet. And since I got impatient waiting for DE dex, I started thinking of this... :-D Its a project i would like to do after I finish my standing DE army. Unless the BA armybook comes out good. Then I will probably go BA first (as they are supposed to be released with new marine models) and then go for TS. DE, TS and BA are my armies of choice. All with completely different playstyles.

Maybe TS will get a sup by then, maybe they will get 30K rules from FW... and as TS army will be the most expensive one and will require a lot of work as I want it to be perfect with egyptian-gods marine helmets (not those GW fly-swatter-helmets), their armour showing their coven isignia - corvidae, raptora, etc. All these little details to make it perfect. :-) I know. I am probably nuts, but hey... we all do have our tendencies out of the normal ways of thinking, dont we? :-)
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeMon Sep 29 2014, 21:28

I have a question here: Why not equip Chaos-Terminators with a pair of Powerclaws, and give them Tzeench dedication?
Maybe a heavy flamer? That would be a really threat to, well, almost everything in CloseCombat...

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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 03 2014, 14:32

i love playing CSM, they were my very first faction Very Happy although ive been looking all over the internet for a chaos space marine equivalent to Darkcity ( a faction specific forum not a general forum for all faction) I usually run noise marines in rhinos with blastmasters and sonic blasters

- Ahriman is fantastic though Very Happy
- man i wish Khorne Berzerkers were actually playable without having to pay for a land raider to make them work. Sad
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Vasara
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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 03 2014, 15:54

moved topic as it is not DE related.  ///Vasara

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PostSubject: Re: 2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy   2000 Thousand Sons Fluffy I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 03 2014, 17:29

@Zenotaph wrote:
I have a question here: Why not equip Chaos-Terminators with a pair of Powerclaws, and give them Tzeench dedication?
Maybe a heavy flamer? That would be a really threat to, well, almost everything in CloseCombat...
The list is in no way lacking AP3, so I feel no need to add up to it. On the other hand it is lacking AP2. Thats what they are there for. And where needed they are there to guard Ahriman.
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