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 Improved Athersails Tank Shock

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Aroban
Kabalite Warrior
Aroban

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PostSubject: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 28 2014, 21:39

Hello everyone, and welcome dear rules experts!

My question is how and if a tank shock can be combined with improved aethersails?

Improved sails add an additional 2d6 movement. I would play it like this: roll the 2d6 before declaring the tank shock, and then move the distance i want and shock the prey off.

My plan is to use improved aethersail, shock prow (or whatever thats called) and a terrorfex grenade launcher to get enemies off the objectives and claim them with my raider.
Eventhough this thread is intended to clarify the rules, I would also be very grateful for any feedback and resulting discussion on this idea.

Thanks in advance guys! Keep on raiding! pirat  cheers 
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Thor665
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Thor665

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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 28 2014, 23:21

Tank Shocks and Ramming gain nothing from Aethersails other than additional movement.
There is no reason I can see to disallow the additional movement granted from Aethersails to any given Tank Shock/Ram attempt.
I agree that you would roll your Aethersails first, and then be allowed to declare the Tank Shock/Ram (you could also play it the other way, but rolling Aethersails first is the wiser move)

I think most armies would tend to just shrug at this as a tactic. A lot of armies are just flat out fearless, and many of those that aren't have additional rules (Space Marines, Guard) that would allow them additional buffers to ward off the attack. Or, also quite likely, will be inside vehicles of their own - and pretty capable of withstanding the impact of a ramming Raider +d3 to armor or no.

As long as the Raider had already disembarked its troops and was just a gun platform anyway this might be an okay tactic even with the above issues, since you could still stop nearly on top of the objective to try to shove them off - but I think it's probably too expensive for what gains you get.

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Silverglade
Wych
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 29 2014, 14:23

Did you mean ramming rather than tank shock?
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Aroban
Kabalite Warrior
Aroban

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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 29 2014, 16:46

I didnt mean ramming, just tank shocking.

My thoughts were not to build my army around that, I see that more as an addon to my current list. For maelstorm missions I had games where I had my opponent sit on objectives with a troop unit. To tank shock them off the objectove was my alternative to wiping out that unit. For that they dont have to fail their morale check and flee, in many occasions it is sufficent to "push" them off.the extra movement would be really helpful for that matter I would think.

That would not only work against troops building a circle around an objective but even better against non troops as those could not deny the objective even within 3".

I currently run duke, haemi, grotesques in raider, 2 kabalite warriors in raiders, 2 venoms with haywire wyches, 2 units of reaver, 2 ravagers

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Solkre
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 07 2014, 18:42

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Raiders, Ravegers, and Venoms can tank shock or ram under 7th edition. The rules explicitly state:
7th Edition Rulebook wrote:
"When moving a vehicle with the Tank type, the player can declare that...".

This makes Shockprows kind of pointless, now. Despite it being blatantly stated, I'm hopeful that this is an oversight as I used to love slamming my Raiders into enemy vehicles and squads in 5th/6th.
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Thor665
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Thor665

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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 07 2014, 21:13

The Shock Prow grants the rule 'a vehicle with a Shock Prow can Tank Shock enemy units'
Per the rulebook any vehicle that can Tank Shock may also Ram.

I see nothing preventing a vehicle equipped with a Shock Prow from ramming or tank shocking.

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Skulnbonz
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 07 2014, 21:17

@Thor665 wrote:

Per the rulebook any vehicle that can Tank Shock may also Ram.

I don't have the rulebook in front of me, but I dont remember seeing anywhere in the new rules that says you need to be a tank to SHOCK or RAM this edition.

If that is the case, venoms, raiders and ravagers can do both...

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 07 2014, 21:37

It is in the rulebook that all tanks have the ability to tank shock or ram.
No non-tank vehicle is given this ability natively.
Dark Eldar have special vehicle wargear that grants them the ability to tank shock or ram.

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Solkre
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 07 2014, 21:42

Good catch on the wording for Shock Prow. It does allow you to tank shock. Since Ramming is a "type of tank shock" per the rulebook, we can still carve our way through stuff (or more likely die trying).

We still lost the ability to do this natively, so our Raiders and Ravagers need to spend another 5 points in order to smash into things. Since venoms don't have an option to take shock prows, they can no longer initiate a RAM or Tank Shock in 7th.

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KiriONE
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 09 2014, 18:58

Glad this question was asked. I recently was toying with the idea that Aroban had proposed with my Incubi Raider (which usually is carrying an Archon/Drazhar). I kit it out with a Disi/GTs, and sometime a TGL but was thinking of using it more offensively. Mainly because it's already so close, why not plow through a unit to inflict casualties.

My question is: Can I, with a Shock Prow/Aethersails, actually inflict casualties on a unit? I've rarely, if ever tank shocked a unit or had it happen to me as well.

My thought is after my passengers are disembarked, and with some maneuvering, I position a raider so it is perpendicular to my opponent's table edge and close enough my raider so that I declare it's going to move the full distance. Should the LD fail, and the unit fall back, since the raider is so long I figure I could crush some units under it. Additionally, if you also equip chain snares, can you inflict those hits as well?

I'm still new to DE and trying to expand my tools of the trade.
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Improved Athersails Tank Shock   Improved Athersails Tank Shock I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 09 2014, 23:03

Chains snares would cause hits normally.

It is actually incredibly difficult per the wording of the rules to actually crush anyone with a tank shock. Your best bet is if you can get them pinned near a board edge. I would generally not advocate it as a strategy.

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