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 1850 For Alamo GT

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AllusiveTable
Slave
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PostSubject: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 17 2014, 22:15

Alright, so in May I will be attending a tournament for 40k. It is uncomped as far as I can tell, and looks pretty fun Very Happy My only real restriction (and this is for myself) is no special characters.

I'm debating between two current lists

List 1

Succubus -70
-Haywire Gernades

4 Hekatrix Bloodbrides -125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

3 Kabalite Trueborn - 86
-2 Dark Lance

3 Kabalite Trueborn - 86
-2 Dark Lance

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

9 Reavers - 268
-3 Cluster Caltrops
Arena Champion

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

List 2

Succubus -70
-Haywire Gernades

4 Hekatrix Bloodbrides -125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

6 Reavers - 154
- Heat Lance
Arena Champion

6 Reavers - 142
Arena Champion

6 Reavers - 142
Arena Champion

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field
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psycheer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 18 2014, 14:49

oh? The Alamo GT?! With all of those wyches… are you going to opt in for the escalation round? I've been a few times and might *might* go to this year as well. There's no comp, but there IS a bar in the gaming area! Very Happy I've had a blast every year I have gone to Alamo.

I like the second list with the 3 squads of reavers. Seems like the list would give you more control over the board compared to the first list.

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 19 2014, 21:48

Whoops, sorry for the delay, school 'n such.

Sweet :DGlad to hear it is so fun. This would be my first official tournament, so I'm hoping to do well Very Happy

Either way, the past few days I've been playing around with points distribution and am thinking something similar to list two, except closer to this:

Succubus -75
-Haywire Gernades
-Venom Blade

4 Hekatrix Bloodbrides -125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon

5 Wyches - 125
-Haywire Grenades
Venom
-Splinter Cannon
X6

5 Reavers - 145
-Caltrops
Arena Champion
-Venom Blade

5 Reavers - 145
-Caltrops
Arena Champion
-Venom Blade

5 Reavers - 145
-Caltrops
Arena Champion
-Venom Blade

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

Razorwing Jetfighter - 155
-Flicker Field

The plan being is to give the jet-bikes a bit more versatility, and giving them some more punch should they have to join in a combat. I have a practice match saturday, we will see how that goes Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 20 2014, 18:47

perhaps use 3-4 grots in raider instead of the brides? more durable and makes your opponent worry more
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psycheer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 20 2014, 19:33

Actually i'd suggest going with the 3 squads of 6 with Heatlance over clusters, though i prefer blasters and not having the Champion.

@MFive: I agree that the Grots would be more of a presence, but i think the loss of a venom and sinking the extra points would work against him.

Good god 7 venoms filled to the brim with Haywire Grenades! My only worry is your Lance support. How long have you been playing this list/list type Allusive?

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 20 2014, 19:38

my standard tactics for the grots, is turbo-boost them up, and move everything else that i need/want to move, regardless of weather it is smart for them to be there or not, then i force my opponet to chose between the grots and archon that are right on top of him and the units that he needs to kill

i.e ravagers, venoms or reaver jetbikes with wyches that also turbo boosted up, next turn either the grots kill him or the wyches do, it is his choice

EDIT: eventualy when i get my wraith knight i plan an running him up too, forcing him to choose betwean the knight, grots, wyches, all of which are in his face turn 1

or the splinter born squads with ravagers in the back field that are twinlinked due to the farseer that i take
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 20 2014, 21:16

Hmm. I can see the beneift of having grots, and hadn't actually considered them. I will toss them in for play testing soon, though even if I like 'em they may be harder to get due to funds (Still worth a shot though) :/
As for how long I've been playing this, it kinda varies. For about a year I've played lists with a heavier focus on haywire venoms, but never to the extent I am about to try. I've usually had a raider with a squad of incubi, and one or two squads of Lance-born(?). Facing mech IG and mostly mech orks, the list did fine, the only close games really being as a result of me sympathising for my opponent.
Moving onto the reavers, why is 6 with a heat lance preferable? Not to shoot down the idea, but one lance causes the entire squads shooting to be wasted, while Caltrops mean they can all do something, in mostly all the phases. Once I again I'm not shooing away the idea, just wondering the reason of the logic Very Happy
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psycheer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 21 2014, 04:04

I usually warn against using caltrops because to get the effectiveness out of the upgrade you risk overreaching and putting them in a bad way. I prefer 6 reavers with 2 blasters so that they can take a bit more damage, and can be a good harassment unit JSJing in and out of cover. They also dont have to shoot at tanks if they don't need to.

How do you deal with Tau?

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 23 2014, 05:10

@psycheer wrote:
How do you deal with Tau?

not much tau in my area, but i don't normally have a problem because he doesn't like pathfinders, so it is mostly a standard attack for me
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 25 2014, 03:28

So I played a game VS GK with my most recently posted list (I kept caltrops on the reavers just to test them) and wow it was informative

Ordo Malleus Inquisitor: Psyker (Mastery Level 1); Hammerhand; Terminator armour; Nemesis Daemon hammer; plasma pistol; 3× servo-skulls. 129
Librarian: Psyker (Mastery Level 3). 200

Vindicare Assassin 145

9 Grey Knights: Justicar (Nemesis Daemon hammer); 2× psycannon; psybolt ammunition. 250
9 Grey Knights: Justicar (Nemesis Daemon hammer); 2× psycannon; psybolt ammunition. 250
9 Grey Knights: Justicar (Nemesis Daemon hammer); 2× psycannon; psybolt ammunition. 250

Dreadnought: twin-linked autocannon; twin-linked autocannon; psybolt ammunition. 135
Dreadnought: twin-linked autocannon; twin-linked autocannon; psybolt ammunition. 135

Necron Overlord: warscythe; mindshackle scarabs. 115
• 1 Cryptek: Harbinger of the Storm; staff of light. 25
• 1 Cryptek: Harbinger of the Storm; staff of light. 25

7 Necron Warriors 91
• Night Scythe 100

1,850 points

I had just about everything in my favor, stolen iniative, night fight on first turn, life was good. His Psykers had precognition from divination and some other more useless stuff. Not the spell that gives invul saves.
The mission was Purge the Alien, and this is where the learning started. It ended a tie, 13 vp - 13 vp

So unit by unit basis:
Succubus- didn't die, but didn't excel either. His demon hammers kept her out of CC with them, and his light amount of tanks kept her haywire useless

Bloodbrides/Wiches - without vehicles to take down, the girls where actually just free VPs. Probably my mistake, I deployed spread out, so I couldn't just disgorge all my wyches to hit the two dreads he had. Getting into combat with the grey knights also sucked, their armour causing ~10 wyches to just tarpit until they all died.

Venoms - the MVP of the match, these guys pretty much wiped the knights. However, the lack of any AP across the armour (besides Razorwing Darklances) made the process painfully slow. 84 poisoned shots would maybe kill 4-7 marines a turn, and while statistical, was a tad disappointing.

Reavers- Caltrops did significantly help their blade vaning, but I was wielding them too recklessly as was forewarned ealier. One squad took out a vindicare and cryptek, so that was fine. Another took out a few marines before dying to shooting. The last squad died after a few pot shots where taken. I feel a heat lance maybe better, or remembering they can move 48' also helps.

Razorwings- took out a dread, a night scyth, and a few GK and warriors. Not too bad, but didn't overwhelm me as I hoped. It also didn't help I had a -1 to my reserves as per his Warlord Trait.

Conclusions are - the list is fun, but lacking. Terminators in any significant number would give me a hell of a time, along with anything else in armour. I think it's time to go back and look how many wyches do I really need, same with the reavers.

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psycheer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 26 2014, 13:50

oh also be aware that the rules for the GT have been updated to allow data slates and a few of the new content. might wanna glance it over. www.alamogt40k.com

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 26 2014, 17:12

Ah thank you! I've been away from hobby since November, got back into about late February. I know about the knight, but not most of the data slates. Anything game breaking I should expect in there?
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 26 2014, 19:56

Tau have one that gives 2 squads of broadsides and a riptide. there's the skyblight swarm, and Bel'lakor that i think what you're most likely to see... frequently.

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 26 2014, 22:10

This list is actually very close to the list I currently run. I splashed in some disintegrator cannons in place of a couple of venoms. Also I've been taking more nightshields. In the event your opponent doesn't have a lot of armor, the night shields allow you to out range and outmaneuver them for a couple of turns.

All in all I've had great success with the list as I learned to play it. I haven't had a chance to try it against Tau however.

I also use one less wych squad.

I did playtest some grotesques with my Succubus last week for fun, as I'm trying to keep my list cult heavy, and they cleaned house, destroying a rhino, a predator, and two tac squads while only losing one grot.

Bikes have been very underwhelming.

The razorwing is really helpful in my list, but then I use two weapon vengeance batteries, one with a battle cannon, and one with an incarus quad cannon. The razorwing, the quad cannon, and my void raven often give me air superiority. Only reason I don't use two icarus quad cannons is the battle cannon draws a lot of attention.

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 27 2014, 19:14

I've played around with the points and stuff, adding what I found was useful in my play test, and removing what was poor for me (except the Wyches, I've seen their usefulness too much)
Succubus: venom blade; splinter pistol; haywire grenades. 75

4 Hekatrix Bloodbrides: haywire grenades. 60
Venom: splinter cannon; night shields. 75

5 Wyches: haywire grenades. 60
Venom: splinter cannon; night shields. 75
5 Wyches: haywire grenades. 60
Venom: splinter cannon; night shields. 75
5 Wyches: haywire grenades. 60
Venom: splinter cannon; night shields. 75
5 Wyches: haywire grenades. 60
Venom: splinter cannon; night shields. 75
5 Wyches: haywire grenades. 60
Venom: splinter cannon; night shields. 75

9 Reavers: Arena Champion (venom blade); 3× heat lance. 249
9 Reavers: Arena Champion (venom blade); 3× heat lance. 249

Razorwing Jetfighter: flickerfield. 155
Razorwing Jetfighter: flickerfield. 155
Razorwing Jetfighter: flickerfield. 155

1,848 points

I'm still hesitant to try Grots, they look amazing on paper, and I have little doubt that they are good on the table, they just break my cult theme. :/
As for battle cannons and such, are those from the Stronghold Assualt book? I was out of the hobby when it came out, so I have no idea what anything in it does :3
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 For Alamo GT   1850 For Alamo GT I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 27 2014, 22:57

I don't blame you about the grots. Fun as they were, it didn't feel right.

The weapon vengeance batteries are out of stronghold assault. While they don't look fluffy, for as of now I use the crappy imperium versions, until I find a more dark eldary version or convert my own, they feel like a dark eldar fortification to me. For a total of 150-160 points, I get two AV14 buildings that have automated fire meaning I don't have to babysit them. The quad icarus cannon has 2 twinlinked skyfire interceptor shots and a whopping 96" range so I've shot down stormravens before they've even seen play. My particular cult has a carnival theme so it goes without saying we'd have a cannon and a laser light show. Haha. They're large, so I can use them as LOS cover if need be, and best of all, if destroyed they don't count as kill points. Needless to say I've grown really fond of them. Having someone direct melta at a building what has little in game value is helpful. Though... I have had some unfortunate mishaps where my battle cannon has take out my own vehicle once or twice.  Embarassed 

That being said, I love the list. I feel beast packs would outperform the reavers, but it still looks very solid to me.

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