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 First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas

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shinkageryu
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PostSubject: First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas   First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 30 2013, 03:17

This is the first time I have built a list coming over from Fenris. I know that there are a few things that I am doing wrong. So go ahead and give me an idea of what I can do differently. Please include the rational behind the decisions you made. I am looking for a different flavor and really trying (Unsuccessfully) to avoid some of the more common net builds.

190 pts-Archon armed with a husk blade, djinn blade, splinter pistol and phantasm grenade launcher wearing Kabalite Armor, combat drugs and soul trap

213 pts-4 Incubi with a Klaivex with Demi Klaives and Onslaught in a Venom with 2 Splinter Cannons and Night shields

210 pts-10 Kabalite Warriors with a Sybarite with Phantasm Grenade Launcher and a Splinter Cannon in a Raider with Night Shields and Flicker Field

210 pts-10 Wyches with a Hekatrix and Agonizer in a Raider with Night Shields and Flicker Field

172 pts-6 Reavers with 2 Cluster Caltrops

995 points 31 models 2 scoring units 3 if the scouring is rolled.

This is my first attempt to deal with my meta, the big problem being that 3/4 of the armies out there are Marine or Necrons with their nasty toughness & super save not to mention we will be back rolls or feel no pain of one flavor or another. Thn there is the resident ork player and his nasty little mob of hooligans. The Archon is equipped to deal with Marine Level characters, more specifically my Thunder Lord who so far is undefeated in hand to hand and to back him up....incubi designed to take out the lesser evils.

Where I am having problems is the low amount of scoring troops that I have floating around. Personally I am seriously contemplating ditching something to switch in smaller units of warriors. Then there is the issue of having lots of seriously CC oriented armies running around the board which leads to the 20 points tied up in Flicker Fields. Now all of you scream JINK!! Isn't that cute, cover saves mean exactly (CENSORED) in cc or when the inevitable Hell Drake makes his appearance and I am looking at the long term. The only other problem I have is with the extremely low amount of anti armor I have on the table. I was looking at heat lances on the reavers but I like more numbers and the cluster caltrops because there are a lot of foot armies I can bladevane and shoot.

There are a few things I was looking at but that would mean sacrificing something and at the moment I am hard pressed to figure out what that might be.

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas   First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 30 2013, 04:45

You are spending way too many points on toys and not enough on core units.
Both the Incubi Archon build and the RJB build are icing units, and at 1000 points it i difficult to afford both while still having a solid army.

Let's first off look at what you are doing with your list, so you understand what you're buying here;

shinkageryu wrote:
190 pts-Archon armed with a husk blade, djinn blade, splinter pistol and phantasm grenade launcher wearing Kabalite Armor, combat drugs and soul trap
A huskblade *and* a djinn blade?

I'm guessing the plan is to get Str 6 and then go running around using the Djinn Blade...at a point it has the power to ID you...and you have no way to avoid the wound since you lack an invulnerable save.

Why not just stick with the Huskblade alone - it's basically just as good (really, in many ways better), and runs no risk of killing off your HQ.

shinkageryu wrote:
213 pts-4 Incubi with a Klaivex with Demi Klaives and Onslaught in a Venom with 2 Splinter Cannons and Night shields
Onslaught is of pretty questionable quality for only 4 Incubi - it comes into its own with larger squads. I'd save the points and shave it.
Demi-Klaives are...meh...okay. You'd probably do just as well with a regular Klaive, but can keep it if you like.

shinkageryu wrote:
210 pts-10 Kabalite Warriors with a Sybarite with Phantasm Grenade Launcher and a Splinter Cannon in a Raider with Night Shields and Flicker Field
PGL is totally useless here - you shouldn't need defensive grenades, because anything that is going to choose to assault you will probably wipe you, since they already expect to survive you swinging on them first. I'd lose it and save those points in a heartbeat.

shinkageryu wrote:
210 pts-10 Wyches with a Hekatrix and Agonizer in a Raider with Night Shields and Flicker Field
This is okay.

shinkageryu wrote:
172 pts-6 Reavers with 2 Cluster Caltrops
This is okay, though I'd drop the Caltrops for Blasters or heat lances.
Also, in all honesty, if you're going to invest in bikes you should buy them the sarge for the leadership bump most of the time.

shinkageryu wrote:
the big problem being that 3/4 of the armies out there are Marine or Necrons with their nasty toughness & super save not to mention we will be back rolls or feel no pain of one flavor or another.
Toughness shouldn't bother you, you're DE, your basic gun ignores toughness.
The only way toughness matters is in assault, and anything with toughness 5+ you probably shouldn't be assaulting with anything unless it's an MC being assaulted by your Archon...and lacking the Shadow Field I'm not sure I'd do that either.

Armor saves and WBB et al is annoying, but you just need enough firepower to saw through it.


shinkageryu wrote:
Where I am having problems is the low amount of scoring troops that I have floating around.  Personally I am seriously contemplating ditching something to switch in smaller units of warriors.
I would absolutely do this. At 1000 points I typically bring 4 units of Troops.
Our Troops are *amazing* and they are real workhorses for our army. You're spending a huge amount of points on fancy units, that are mostly doing what your Troops could be doing.

shinkageryu wrote:
Then there is the issue of having lots of seriously CC oriented armies running around the board which leads to the 20 points tied up in Flicker Fields.
I don't see that as a problem.
Besides, your army is designed as a CC army - you should expect to be getting mixed up with the foe.

shinkageryu wrote:
The only other problem I have is with the extremely low amount of anti armor I have on the table. I was looking at heat lances on the reavers but I like more numbers and the cluster caltrops because there are a lot of foot armies I can bladevane and shoot.
Yeah, but conversely you have a grand total of 2 missile launchers in your army, basically.
Which means if you fight anyone bringing more than 1 vehicle that you probably don't have enough anti-mech shooting.

Even just giving the Wyches HWGs and the Warriors a Blaster would more than double your potential to damage vehicles.

shinkageryu wrote:
There are a few things I was looking at but that would mean sacrificing something and at the moment I am hard pressed to figure out what that might be.
If it was me personally I'd split the Warrior squad in two and field it in two separate vehicles, with Blasters. Pick Venoms or Raiders (or one of each) as the need suits you.

I'd also drop either the Incubi or the RJBs. Both are fine units, but each are lso a pricey investment, and you probably don't need both. I'd use those extra points to probably buy some more Troops, honestly.

To be perfectly frank, even if all you did was take out every upgrade I mentioned as unneeded you would still have enough points to buy an additional unit.

Hope some of that helps.

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shinkageryu
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PostSubject: Re: First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas   First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 02 2013, 01:55

Okay I didn't mention the Shadow Field so that is that. Yeah I designed my Archon to go character/monster hunting with the Incubi which is probably too big an investment at that level. I wanted to avoid a venom spam but I keep coming back there.

This goes against a lot of hard earned lessons from the past where I have had small units evaporate under concentrated fire but I am willing to learn how make this work.

The other problem is that is pretty much all that I own.... I just got started and have to order some of it to fill it out.... It also seemed the best buy for what I wanted.
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Darkeldar neeb
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PostSubject: Re: First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas   First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 02 2013, 10:10

Wow that archon is really expensive, mines usually tops at 150max with huskblade, shadow and grenade launcher. The incubi I'd leave with just the klievex upgrade to take challenges away from the archon. I'd also drop the flicker fields from the raiders, also drop the grenade launcher from the warriors, and switch the agoniser on the hexatrix to a venom blade it'll do a lot more damage in the long run. Reavers are lots of fun for trolling units but I'd drop them. With the points you've saved you should then be able to get 2 ravagers with night shields and your choice of dark lance or dissies
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PostSubject: Re: First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas   First Realspace Raid at 1000 points for Chaos in Christmas I_icon_minitime

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