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 Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?

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Balisong
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PostSubject: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 27 2013, 21:16

On the BRB it says that overwatch "uses all the normal rules for range, line of sight, cover saves and so on." (p. 21 in the Dark Vengeance Mini Book).

If you declare a charge from 10 inches away with a unit of Herlequins protected with Veil of tears, and the overwatching unit rolls 8 inches for their shooting range as per the power, does that mean that the unit being charged is unable to fire overwatch?

Based upon the fact that it uses the normal rules, I'm thinking they lose their ability to overwatch...

Any thoughts?
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 27 2013, 23:26

I've always played it as 'yes' Veil affects Overwatch.

Overwatch is handled, by definition, as a shooting attack, that means you need to target the unit you are firing at.
Veil, per the rules, affects any enemy unit targeting the Shadowseer or his unit.

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Balisong
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 29 2013, 08:37

FYI: I ran a harlie Unit (Shadowseer, Death Jester + 8 Harlies (2 Fusion Pistols) with all but the Death Jester having the Harlequin's kisses) with Archon and Farsseer vs a Farsight Enclave list on Monday evening.

The game was a tie, but it did an amazing job and wiped 2 units of crisis suits + a Riptide in CC while only losing 3 Harlequins the entire game.
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doomseer11b
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 18 2013, 03:13

Which harlies did you use? Eldar or deldar? And would deldar harlies still receive their stealth and shrouded during over watch? It would be the same logic as the eldar veil of tears correct?

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Balisong
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 18 2013, 03:43

Eldar ones, not DE.

DE ones would get Stealth + Shrouded but that's not as good as potentially preventing being shot at.

Especially vs Tau as their marketlights work during overwatch and can be used to remove cover.
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 18 2013, 05:51

I would take a consistent 2+ cover over the off chance that they roll double 1's any day of the week

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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 19 2013, 03:10

It's not consistent though.

At least in my area, the Tau have completely overtaken the tournament scene, and cover saves are a rarity...
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 19 2013, 04:28

Really? Harlequins are actually a worry to them? You shove a grot squad at them as quick as possible they should soak up a good portion of fire. If you're using harlequins you need to distract them with other stuff that can handle the fire power before charging with harlies. Tau aren't as difficult as everyone makes them out to be. If they have pathfinders, take out the pathfinders first. If they're using a support commander, move your entire army to the commander first turn or as quick as you can. You take out the support units, you take out his army. Target priority is the key. Forcing leaderships is also a pretty good tactic. Coven/ kabalite lists are great against tau. Send haywire wyches in venom to the tanks. Lists that I run consist of 5 venoms 2 of which have wyches, a raider of grots, raider of wracks, venoms with warriors and a few 3 man splinterborn squads. I haven't had too many issues with tau running these types of lists. As long as you keep them occupied with wracks and grots, it allows the rest of your army to pick apart the supporting units.

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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 19 2013, 04:46

I've tried the Wracks and Grots, but the issue with those is that they have a lot of stuff that insta kills them, so no FNP and the multiple wounds don't matter.

A Unit of Harlequins will cut through all the suits they have in Melee due to all the rending from the Kisses. Something Grots do not have.

I find the Railguns just decimate my DE vehicles, and have actually had more luck foot slogging my Harleystar at them. supported by Talos.

It's not a perfect strategy by any means, but I find it works quite well for me, and seems to wipe all the other armies I've run into off the board.

Please note that comboing the Unit with a Farseer + Archon is required for it to work. Presience/Forewarning, Fortune and Doom all make the unit extremely deadly.

Also adding the BAron at higher point levels to get that +1 to go first + and having an extra Shadowfield in the Unit is a really nice addition.

I've found using Hit and Run to jet them across the board can also be useful.
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doomseer11b
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 21 2013, 03:02

I guess that would be fun for friendly games. I don't see that being very competitive. That's an awful lot of points wrapped up in the chance your opponent can't see you. Granted He cant see you outside of 24". against tau though, you have no units to really hide in combat with,or hit and run with. my tau meta all sit as far back as possible and shoot. once you get in 24" though, your opponent should pound you into the ground. if he hasnt, then either he's dumb or he rolled horribly. I'll have to play test this. You could throw a warlock with them... Wait no you can't. Well anyway, this could be interesting. Ill post here and let you know my results.

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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch?   Eldar Veil of Tears: Can it prevent Overwatch? I_icon_minitime

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