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Deamon
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Deamon

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PostSubject: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 11:57

For a while the dreaded beastpack + baron + something to make them fearless has been one of our most dreaded units. I had a lot of success with them and when eldar codex came out, I switched vect for a jetseer with the shard of anaris. This unit still does good in my meta (mostly vs necrons, daemons, csm, dark angels and IG). However I'm getting ready for two tournaments where I expect to see much more Eldar and Tau. Both have plenty of ignore cover and I hesitate to put that many points in a beastpack units that would need to roll forewarning to survive any of these armies (which would most likely mean I can forget about twin-linking 2 ravagers).

What are your thoughts on beatpacks theses days?
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Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
Count Adhemar

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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 12:00

Forewarning seems pointless as Khymaerae have a 4++ save, as does the Jetseer. Just use the Khymerae to shield any Razorwing Flocks. What you really want is Fortune...

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Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks YhBv3Wk
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 13:34

I strongly endorse the above.

I think Beastpacks are still quite strong in the game at this point due to their mobility, survivability, and threat bubble.

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FullDE
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 20:45

@Deamon wrote:
For a while the dreaded beastpack + baron + something to make them fearless has been one of our most dreaded units.  I had a lot of success with them and when eldar codex came out, I switched vect for a jetseer with the shard of anaris.  This unit still does good in my meta (mostly vs necrons, daemons, csm, dark angels and IG).  However I'm getting ready for two tournaments where I expect to see much more Eldar and Tau.  Both have plenty of ignore cover and I hesitate to put that many points in a beastpack units that would need to roll forewarning to survive any of these armies (which would most likely mean I can forget about twin-linking 2 ravagers).

What are your thoughts on beatpacks theses days?
What do you guys use to make the beastpacks fearless? Wouldn't any independant char besides the Baron slow them down?
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 20:59

Pain tokens - at the third one they become fearless.
It's bone simple to start the game with two tokens on them.

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Count Adhemar
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Count Adhemar

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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 22:08

Personally I use a Jetseer with the Shard of Anaris but I don't have any means of starting with pain tokens in my current list so it's easier that way. Plus the Jetseer actually becomes a bit of a beast in challenges with the shard. Killed a Tervigon the other week!

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 18 2013, 23:29

I tend to mantle, but that's certainly not a bad option.

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DEfan
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 19 2013, 08:16

!! Come again? Can the beasts themselves be buffed by Power from pain? I had been playing it that this rule only applied to the beastmasters ....

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 19 2013, 08:20

Fearless applies if any model in the unit has the rule.

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Bugs_N_Orks
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 19 2013, 14:44

With so much S6+ coming from tau and eldar I've been switching for more khymera over flocks. Right now I'm running 15/4. Having that many invuls to get through is very nice and if you happen to roll up fortune the unit becomes seriously tough to deal with.
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Hijallo
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 19 2013, 15:39

Jetseer with Mantle... in the world where are many Tau and Eldar with WS - are you guys serious?

Anaris and large beastpack is probably the best protection Farseer can get. Squad of wraithblades is the second best, but it limits mobility.
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Balisong
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 20 2013, 00:59

I play with a mantle'd Jetseer vs Tau all the time. He's never been shot at yet by them as I tend to put other more pressing threats in their face.

Important thing to note is that you shouldn't take the Shard on a character with the Mantle of the Laughing God as it removes their status as a character and therefore can't engage in challenges.
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 20 2013, 06:26

@Hijallo wrote:
Jetseer with Mantle... in the world where are many Tau and Eldar with WS - are you guys serious?
Yes?

@Hijallo wrote:
Anaris and large beastpack is probably the best protection Farseer can get. Squad of wraithblades is the second best, but it limits mobility.
By the time you want to stick him with Wraithblades why not stick him with Grots or something?
I'll agree that Beastmasters are his best combo.

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Count Adhemar
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Count Adhemar

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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 20 2013, 14:51

@Balisong wrote:
I play with a mantle'd Jetseer vs Tau all the time. He's never been shot at yet by them as I tend to put other more pressing threats in their face.

Important thing to note is that you shouldn't take the Shard on a character with the Mantle of the Laughing God as it removes their status as a character and therefore can't engage in challenges.
Actually it only removes IC status. They are still characters though and can therefore be engaged in challenges.

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jbwms713
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 21 2013, 21:11

@Count Adhemar wrote:
only removes IC status. They are still characters though and can therefore be engaged in challenges.
But they only have the IC rule, not the Character tag... unless I'm missing something that would strip them completely.
If I'm wrong, I won't even be sad, because I've toyed with the idea of building a proper Solitaire for funsies (although I'm not sure it's legal to take all the Relic's he'd need...).
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 21 2013, 21:42

Farseers and Autarchs are Unit Type: Infantry (Character). Independent Character is a Special Rule which they have and it is this that is removed by the Mantle. They are still Infantry (Character) though and can still be engaged in challenges.

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 21 2013, 21:55

Specifically for both you could look on page 27 and 28 respectively.
Also, compare and contrast with the Avatar, which is unit type Monstrous Creature (character).
Also, in the core rulebook note that there is no unit type known as 'Independant Character' and also that it is only a special rule, and therefore all its removal does is affect those abilities granted by being a special character.
Which challenges are assuredly not part of, since Sarge characters can partake of them.

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FullDE
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 21 2013, 22:16

@Thor665 wrote:
Pain tokens - at the third one they become fearless.
It's bone simple to start the game with two tokens on them.
But adding two hammys to the squad would slow down it's movement which is one of their strengths.
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 21 2013, 23:59

Which is why you don't have the Haems in it by the end of Turn 1.
Functionally you only have 1 Haem in it, and he leaves.

The common recipe is;

Unit of Wracks
Haem
Baron Sathypants
Hellions

Haem joins Hellions.
Baron joins Wracks.
At start of Turn 1 the Haem departs the Hellions, leaving his token behind.
The Baron departs the Wracks, taking the token - and joins the Beasts.
Usually the Wracks and Haem end up together inside a vehicle.

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PostSubject: Re: Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks   Post Eldar/Tau Bestpacks I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 22 2013, 00:48

Never thought of that. That's kinda neat.
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