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 1850 pure DE, Very competitive

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Exort1
DominicJ
facelessabsalom
Mushkilla
Eldritchwarmaster84
El_Jairo
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colinsherlow
SOlyer
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SOlyer
Hellion
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PostSubject: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeFri Jul 26 2013, 23:57

I am trying to make a VERY competitive list right now out of pure DE. I am also trying to have fun with the list and have decided I want to be extra fast with this list.

Kabal of the Worped speed (just made that up on the fly, haha ill have to come up with something cooler than that later.)


1850 - 1195

Baron - 105
+2 St on the charge and +1 attack and +1 st for the hellglaive.

Fast Attack
4 Beastmasters, 10 kymera, 4 razorwing flocks - 204
9 Reaver Jetbikes, 3 heatlances, 3 cluster caltrops, 1 Arena Champion with venom blade - 309
9 Reaver Jetbikes, 3 heatlances, 3 cluster caltrops, 1 Arena Champion with venom blade - 309


Troops
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, (no blaster) in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 110


Heavy Support
Ravager - 105

Ravager - 105

Ravager - 105


That brings me to 2 points over, which shouldnt be a problem. What do you all think? Now remember, I'm going for really really competitive here. I want to smash some kids up in a huge tournament later. I will have a few smaller tournaments in between and should have plenty of time to make sure this list is solid. Any flaws off the bat? PS, I'll be learning tactics on how to use those 9 man reaver teams by reviewing all of mushkilla's batreps. Mushkilla any advice to get me started there?
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 00:28

Remove a blaster and take grisly trophies on 2venoms. To help keep the beast pack and bikes from breaking too early.

Nice list!

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Maximullis
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 00:56

I'd wanna get more under than over though, it may be different where you are but for my group, 1 point over is 1 point too many. Very very nice list though, I like it.
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El_Jairo
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 01:34

Thank you SOlyer for your nice list.

I must agree with colin on the grisleys. They really can make a difference. And I feel 2 sacrificial Venoms don't sound bad if they provide cover for others.

You could even loose the extra SC on those two venoms and get some more upgrades like NS on the Ravagers. You would still need to cut more point to equip all three but two isn't a bad start.

I might choose blasters over heat-lances. Those can keep the reavers outside charging distance.
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Eldritchwarmaster84
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 17:18

If you wana be a little more competitive, bring a flyer for that 2+ poisoned large blast goodness
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Eldritchwarmaster84
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 17:21

Good that your bringing reavers for what they do best and caltrops can be super competitive against T3 or T4 troops. I would say this list has a potential to being top tier competitive in major torunaments
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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 19:09

The list looks solid.

@SOlyer wrote:
Mushkilla any advice to get me started there?

Patients, you need a lot of patients to get the most out of reavers, if your too eager to spur them on into the enemy you will only get disappointed. You would have thought with a 3+ cover save and T4 reavers would be more survivable than most Dark Eldar units, that's not really the case as with a 48" movement range they can get in all kinds of trouble, and if you make a mistake they will be taking a lot more fire than your average T3 5+ cover save unit of warriors in a bush, meaning they'll drop just as fast.

The other thing to watch out for is power from pain, large squads of reavers probably thrive of pain tokens more then any other dark eldar unit. Getting them an early pain token (before they take any fire), will make them that bit more resilient, and open up assault as a viable option (sometimes you want to assault with reavers in order to keep them safe from shooting).

Personally I'm not a fan of caltrops. Sure they can be devastating. But they encourage you to bladevane unnecessarily, unnecessary bladevaning is a surefire way to get your reavers slaughtered and when your not bladevaning you have 60pts per squad doing nothing. If you drop the caltrops you would save 120 points and would be able to get another venom and another troop choice.

Hope that helps. Smile



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SOlyer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 27 2013, 21:24

@Mushkilla
So don't be too hasty with them. Make smart moves so they don't end up right in the middle of enemy fire. Keep assault in mind in order to keep them out of too much trouble if need be. (I especially think of hell drakes for this one.) You also think I should lose the caltrops? I don't have another venom so i can't put another venom with warriors in it. How ever, if you can think of something even better, maybe ill consider it. Maybe a raider with 5 warriors and a blaster instead? Hmmmm, i might have to test out the caltrops since i plan on using them to bladevane early on and put pressure on any tanks early on.

@El_Jairo, I have plenty of blasters in my list, and was hoping to get a little extra ooomph in their tank busting ability in order to really threaten them.

@all

The idea with this list is to move my reavers in an x like formation at the start to go corner to corner and bladevane early on. Hopefully landing close but not TOO close to some tanks that are in the back field. My beastmasters will be flying up the middle with baron and running turn 1 to threaten a charge on turn 2. Then my Ravager's will spread out and do what they do best. The venoms will do the same thing. Hopefully they will wittle down an infantry unit for me in order for my bladevaning reavers to pick up a quick pain token. This will give the enemy so many people to deal with that it should keep from any one unit taking too much heat, and if they do, oh well. The rest of my army will be destroying them next turn then.
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facelessabsalom
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 09:33

About the caltrops,

Drop a few of them then you can equip one warr squd with blaster. And get upgrades for your ravagers.

About your strategy/plan. Well, be careful not to put them behind enemy lines w/o if you're not sure that:
They'll survive shooting or can get into close combat
Otherwise I like the plan. With the idea with caltrops and early bladevaning, if you can get a good round of early bladevaning I will probably force so many dice rolls your opponent will loose alot of stuff, regardless of T and saves :p
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DominicJ
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 11:03

Over is over in my book.
It not "2 points", its blaster, or a venom blade, or a heat lance.

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SOlyer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 13:44

I'm brain storming what I could use the points i gain by getting rid of the caltrops right now. I'm not sure, if i want to keep them or not. I have a few chances to try them out in a few games and see what I like with this list.

Also, for the people who cant get past the 2 points issue, when I got to a game with someone who actually cared that much I would just get rid of a caltrop and add a blaster to the last squad and vuala. It really wouldnt hurt me any and in some cases would probably help instead. I just wanted to keep both the squads the same but its all good.

Maybe I'll get rid of the caltrops from one unit and keep them with the other. Add the blaster and then use the last 40 points to get some upgrades like NS or FF for my Ravagers or maybe those grisley trophies for my venoms. Speaking of the trophies, not sure if they will do all that much for the reaver's since they probably won't be all that close to them early on. I plan on using my range to my advantage for them. Keep my troops mostly safe.
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 17:47

Grisly trophies are more for the beasts. Failing an early LD test sucks with the beasts. And getting to reroll it if you lose combat is great. Trophies also help with pinning and LD tests for units getting knocked out of vehicles. The 5-10 points I spend on trophies is never wasted.

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SOlyer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 18:55

Ok so this puts me just under 1850 now. Here is the new list. I added some grisley trophies, and took the caltrops away from one unit of bikes.

HQ
Baron - 105

Fast Attack
4 Beastmasters, 10 kymera, 4 razorwing flocks - 204
9 Reaver Jetbikes, 3 heatlances, 3 cluster caltrops, 1 Arena Champion with venom blade - 309
9 Reaver Jetbikes, 3 heatlances, 1 Arena Champion with venom blade - 249


Troops
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons Grisley Trophies - 130
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons Grisley Trophies - 130
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125


Heavy Support
Ravager NS - 115

Ravager NS - 115

Ravager NS - 115
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 20:02

Looks better to me.

I like this list alot. Simple and awesome

What would you change for 1750? Drop the other caltrops and a few blasters?

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SOlyer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 28 2013, 20:06

So I was just thinking. If I got rid of the caltrops on the last unit their I thought it might be worth while getting a razorwing in my list with a flicker field. Any thoughts on that gentlemen? 3 Ravagers seems to be the best option out there in terms of getting an early jump on killing the enemies heavies, but im positive ill see some flyers at 1850 pts. Not sure how long a razorwing will really last though Sad
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El_Jairo
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 02:30

I'm not really a fan of the raozrwing. If it shows up before enemy flyers. It'S easily toasted. And if you are playing vs mech, there could be few infantry targets in turn 2.
If they would give it vector dancer, as they should, it would have a chance at dogfights.

I like the voidraven better because it's better equipped, sadly at a high cost.
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Exort1
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 09:13

@SOlyer wrote:
Ok so this puts me just under 1850 now. Here is the new list. I added some grisley trophies, and took the caltrops away from one unit of bikes.

HQ
Baron - 105

Fast Attack
4 Beastmasters, 10 kymera, 4 razorwing flocks - 204
9 Reaver Jetbikes, 3 heatlances, 3 cluster caltrops, 1 Arena Champion with venom blade - 309
9 Reaver Jetbikes, 3 heatlances, 1 Arena Champion with venom blade - 249


Troops
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons Grisley Trophies - 130
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons Grisley Trophies - 130
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125
5 warriors, blaster in a venom with duel splinter cannons - 125


Heavy Support
Ravager NS - 115

Ravager NS - 115

Ravager NS - 115

I'd like to point out that your beastpack is 228 pts, not 204.
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SOlyer
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 20:18

oh boy, looks like i made a calculator error my first time figuring that unit out. I guess I'll take the sheilds off of the Ravagers then and give another venom a trophie.
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 20:21

or keep the NS's on them and take away the rest of the caltrops and put NS's on the venoms except for 2 and put a trophie on another one as well. Hmmm, will NS's really help this list though. The reavers would be taking all the hits then.
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colinsherlow
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 20:48

Remove the caltrops. Night shields are nice to have around.

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 22:20

with the new changes I can switch one of my warrior squads to wyches with HWG instead. What do you guys think of that option? have that as another anti tank avenue?
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Vasara
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 22:45

It works against noobs but not usually against more experienced players. Wyches need to be two or even three squads.

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 29 2013, 23:34

Im really not sure what the NS's would really do for me in a list where not everything has NS's on it. So I came up with the idea of adding a unit of splinter cannon true born and keeping the trophies. not sure how long they would last with no boat to carry them.
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Hannibal.Lictor
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeTue Jul 30 2013, 06:21

If you are going to a competitive tournie, you will be facing multiple hellturkies. Any air is goin to really hurt that list. It's the one hole I see. There are several lists floating around with a lot of aerial silliness: Crons, Cd, csm and the like. Not sure exactly what changes I might make as the DE dex isn't stacked with AA. I play a DEldar list myself.
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 pure DE, Very competitive    1850 pure DE, Very competitive  I_icon_minitimeTue Jul 30 2013, 10:52

I am not making a deldar list. I only have DE. I have only been playing for less than a year and so I don't have more than 1 army to work with right now. I was worried about anti air as well but I'm hoping with all the blasters, lances, and heat lances in the list I'll hit with one or two and blow up air support. Not sure if it will work. I'm open to other suggestions to make the DE able to deal with air. I was thinking of taking razorwing or bomber to help but I'm worried it will be a waste if it comes on before the turkey.
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