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 2k campaign battle. Please help

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doomseer11b
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doomseer11b

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PostSubject: 2k campaign battle. Please help   2k campaign battle.  Please help I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 03 2013, 17:10

This 2k will hurt bad if I don't win. I have 3k requisition and won't receive any more till Sunday. Here is my list for right now. I didn't bring eldar as I am finding it hard to synergize with them.

Urien

3grots S6

3x3 man trueborn squads with 2SC

2x5 warrior squads

10 wrack squad

2 haywire wych squads 5 man in venoms

9 reavers with caltrops

2 ravagers and a voidraven with 2 implosion missiles.

5 venoms total and 3 raiders

I'm playing against nurgle. Grots play as distraction unit. Wracks are back up / obj holders. And everything else seems self explanatory. Advice please. I have no beasts available. Eldar are just so expensive.

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: 2k campaign battle. Please help   2k campaign battle.  Please help I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 03 2013, 17:39

[pet peeve]Why do so many people not include the dedicated transport with the unit purchasing it so the list is more easily legible? It's not a separate item, it's an upgrade to a squad - it should be listed with the squad buying the upgrade, just like if you buy a Blaster or something.[/pet peeve]

You have 9 squads and 8 vehicles, so someone is walking...the Wracks? I'm guessing the Wracks. i dunno. I'll presume them since it's silly to walk the Grots as that will waste time, and the Wracks are the only other singular unit.

Are you really running the Warriors with no Blasters? And the Wyches with only HWGs?
No Raiders or Ravager with NS or FF?
I'm guessing that your event has a special rule that allows you to field 4x Elite slots?
Can you run any extra slots besides Elites?
Or is that an error and you can't?
How many caltrops in the RJB squad, 1, 2, 3?

Okay, now I'm going to have to punch up these points, hold on a moment...

Okay...so assuming 3x Caltrops and that every Venom took 2x S.Cannons...I still have you as almost 100 points short.
So I'm guessing you spent that somewhere...where? You're functionally asking us to look at a 1900 point list and asking us how we think it will do at 2000.
Also, seriously, how many caltrops?
And are you allowed to field 4x Elites? If so, can you field 4x Heavy or Fast?
If not, then you're even more short on points.

-------------------------------------less pet peevish line----------------------------------

Okay, I think I dragged you over the coals on that one enough.
Since you're short almost 100 points let's first off free up a few more.

Implosion Missiles - I do not recommend them. You are paying a premium for those Void Lances, you want to be shooting Void Lances, Void Lances are best shot at mech. Implosion Missiles are useless versus mech. Also, honestly, Implosion Missiles best use is to eat up MCs and blobs of high toughness models. You know what else does that really, really well?

Generic splinter fire. i.e. your Venoms, and Trueborn.

Nurgle is not likely to be able to afford too many blobs, and what blobs it does have you ought to still be able to whittle down with just splinter fire. Yes, the Implosion Missiles will help versus FNP, yes they will ignore the 3+ armor saves (but not cover saves, y'know, if the Nurgle player like basically any Marine player crawls into area terrain). I'm just really not sure I see much value in you spending 60 points for that.

Just shoot Void Lances, I'd say.

Also, I'll admit, I don't think Urien is that solid of an HQ nor are he and his Grots going to exactly shine versus Nurgle. Now, if he is your HQ of choice and/or you're locked into him for the campaign, or, even, if you're just really unfamiliar with other HQs - stick with him. It's better to play something suboptimal you're good with than play something good you've never played before.

That said, Urien is not really helping here and he's eating up a lot of points so your Grots wound on a 3+ instead of a 4+ vs. Plaguemarines. Ehhhhh...

Another immediate thought is, if the Wracks are objective grabbers and lack a ride, why have a 10 man squad? Save some points, make it smaller, leave them in reserve, and just wander out as late as possible to grab a point and then hug the ground and pray.

Now, as far as spending points - my immediate thought is Blasters on the Warrior squads (to drastically increase their threat capability. If you don't want to do this and are just trying to buy the Venom, maybe save points and use 3 man Wrack squads instead? It will fit your theme, be cheaper, and be basically just as good) Or get a Blaster for them Wink

I'd also probably want to slap FFs on my Raiders, Ravagers, and Void Raven. Especially fighting chaos if he has a hell turkey or two.

My immediate thoughts beyond confusion about your build Wink

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2k campaign battle.  Please help K93hWhs
2k campaign battle.  Please help L1RsnGX
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doomseer11b
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doomseer11b

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PostSubject: Re: 2k campaign battle. Please help   2k campaign battle.  Please help I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 03 2013, 19:45

ill write this again to clarify and i appreciate your tips: specially on Urien as in this campaign, when he is dead he is dead for the rest of the campaign, and he is one of my favorite HQ's when put with grots.

Urien - will prolly change which means i prolly will change the grots as well but ill keep writing

grots- S6 in a raider
Splinter born- 3 man squad with 2 SC (stationary unit) venom used will be empty
Splinterborn- same as above

warrior squad- 2X5 man unupgraded ( i like the anti infantry boost, i feel double designating a unit usually fails) but i will think about how to add a blaster in there. in venoms

wyches- 2X5 woman haywire sqauds (i felt i was lacking AT) and it gives me more venoms

10 man wrack squad with 2 LG in a raider

Reavers- 9 with 3 caltrops and one blaster. I know the one blaster is off the wall but i usually dont shoot with these guys at all, i just zoom around causing wounds and i had 15 points i didnt know what to do with.

2X ravagers

1 voidraven bomber with implosion missiles. I see your point on this as well. I will probably remove this.



I always have at least 2 stationary 3 man trueborn squads to either die so my venoms can still shoot or vise versa. and it opens up venoms

I dont have enough models to field EXACTLY what i would like but usually what i do, and has worked really well in the past, is immediately launch the grots in there face as a diversionary tactic. While they are focused on getting rid of them, i just hail them with splinter fire from everything usually focusing on the easiest targets first obviously. However, since in this campaign, IC that are named such as Urien or Asdrubael and so on, it might not be a great idea to take them against Nurgle. I only have 5 incubi at my disposal as of right now (tight budget). I have 30 wyches but i have had nothing but horrible luck with them unless i field them in 5 man less threatening squads with haywire grenades. So i do have SOME eldar models. I just havent used them since 5th and am a little worried to test them out in a campaign. I would like to lose the grots but that means my biggest distraction is gone. and unless im playing an army i know has ignore cover, i usually dont waste the points on FF for my ravagers, i just keep them moving. It all depends really. But i do know they have saved me quite a few times.

I may take out the grots and urien and bring 14 hellions and baron (only have 14). However, still begs the question of what to replace them with. I dont like either of the flyers we have as the razorwing goes down so dang easy and the void raven lacks some of the stuff i like on the razorwing. Either way, i may take both out, only problem is i only have 2 ravagers.

And yes this is 2k, and at 2k we can field a double force org correct?

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: 2k campaign battle. Please help   2k campaign battle.  Please help I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 03 2013, 20:41

As far as fielding a double force org...the answer is 'yes, unless your campaign has alternate rules'

I will defend Blaster Warriors over non-Blaster Warriors all day long, and am happy you used the 'split usage' defense because it allows me to expound on how awesome my build is versus alternate builds. Wink

Okay, so let's compare 5 Warriors w. Blaster vs. 5 Warriors w. no upgrades shooting MEQ.

5 Warriors - in a perfect world they are within 12" for double tap.
10 shots.
6.66 hits.
3.33 wounds.
1.11 wounds after armor saves. So your 'anti-infantry' build does 1.11 wounds to most Marines.

5 Warriors w. Blaster - also within 12"
8 s.rifile shots and 1 Blaster shot.
5.33 hits and .66 hits
2.66 wounds and .55 wounds
.88 after armor and .55 after armor = 1.43 wounds.

Against anything that allows an armor save versus a splinter rifle (which is - anything that isn't an Ork or Imperial Guardsman, pretty much) the Blaster is actually a better anti-infantry weapon than the splinter rifle. Even if the enemy is in cover - it's still more likely to cause wounds for you.

Also, as a random option - your unit can now also shoot tanks and possibly kill them too.

So it's better versus infantry *and* better versus tanks.
And that's why I always take Blasters.

The Void Raven is not a bad Heavy Slot choice...just the missiles. If you have no other Heavy Slot options, I'd still take a Void Raven sans missiles, and it will be sort of like fielding a Ravager and also gives you a decent ability to battle any solo enemy flying units, though you'll still be boned versus any flyer spam lists.

As currently stands your list is lacking 200 points.
Before you worry about cutting anything, maybe you should consider what you could do with those extra 200 points? Heck, with a bit of trimming of your current points, you could basically field Baron Sathypants and 14 Hellions without actually cutting anything out of your list, really. Let's see...

Yeah, if you drop the missiles and drop Urien you could take; 1 Haemon w. some upgrades, Baron Sathy, 14 Hellions, +2 Blasters for the Warrior squads, and still have points left to put FFs on the Raiders, Ravagers, and VR, or extra points to add in some sarge upgrades (like, frankly, I'd take that for your bike unit simply because you're spending so many points on it you really don't want to be counting on only Ld 8 if the enemy forces you to take a leadership test for morale)

There are lots of other things you could do if you want to keep Urien instead.

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2k campaign battle.  Please help K93hWhs
2k campaign battle.  Please help L1RsnGX
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doomseer11b
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doomseer11b

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PostSubject: Re: 2k campaign battle. Please help   2k campaign battle.  Please help I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 04 2013, 07:03

so here is my revised list:

HAEMY
-LG
-VB
-CASKET OF FLENSING

SUCCUBUS
-VB




TRUEBORN: FIRST THREE SQUADS ARE EXACTLY THE SAME
3 man squads with 2 splinter cannons and a dark lance

4th squad has 2 splinter cannons only  (these squads will be stationary and grant the venoms)



WARRIORS
2x5 man squads with 1 blaster each in venoms

WRACKS
9 man with a LG  RAIDER FF

WYCHES
10 man squad with hydra gauntlets and haywire grenades  RAIDER FF AETHERSAILS

WYCHES
9 man squad with 1 razor flail (succubus is with them)  RAIDER FF AETHERSAILS



REAVERS
Caltrops- 3
heat lance- 2


RAVAGERSX2 FF NS

comes out to 1999.  this has turned into a shoot everything to death list.  Normally i like to run the distraction units, however, there is just so much shooty i am hoping my opponent just doesnt know what to target first. My wyches will definitely be somewhat of a distraction, just i HATE seeing a raider go down and bring half or all a squad with them.  However, they are kind of there to die so i guess its ok. lemme know what you think of the changes.

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doomseer11b
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doomseer11b

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PostSubject: Re: 2k campaign battle. Please help   2k campaign battle.  Please help I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 08 2013, 04:52

Well, no feedback, but I can give a quick batrep.  I wiped 1400 of his, he got 1700 of mine.  Had one obj.  He deep struck 5 obliterators squads.....  It was a nightmare.  And since we know who we are fighting he had nothing but Flamers, twin linked Flamers.....  Tons of fire power.  I inflicted an I sane amount of damage but he made almost all of his FNP rolls.  I definitely give this loss to the dice gods.  For they were very much in his favor.

I will say, lesson learned. Bring more wyches against nurgle. Obliterators need to be locked up ASAP.

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