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 BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 12 2013, 19:33

So with the new Eldar Codex out, Shadow and I are going to do a series of games (and battle reports) trying out various Eldar lists to see the Dark Eldar codex stands up to them.

Also if you haven't checked it out already we have a new Eldar subforum here at The Dark City for all your Craftworld Eldar needs. Very Happy

The Armies:

Black Buzzards (DE)

HQ
Succubus, venom blade, haywire

ELITE
4 Grotesques, aberration, venom blade
Raider

TROOPS
10 Warriors, cannon
Raider
10 Warriors, cannon
Raider
10 Warriors, cannon
Raider

FAST ATTACK
9 Reavers, 3 blasters, arena champion, venom blade
9 Reavers, 3 blasters, arena champion, venom blade

HEAVY SUPPORT
Ravager
Ravager

Craft World Eldar(CWE)

HQ
Autarch, Mantle of The Laughing God, Laser Lance, Fusion Gun, Jetbike
Warlock, Jetbike (conceal)

TROOPS
5 Dire Avengers
Wave Serpent, Twin linked Shuriken Cannon, Underslung Shuriken Cannon, Holo Fields
5 Dire Avengers
Wave Serpent, Twin linked Shuriken Cannon, Underslung Shuriken Cannon, Holo Fields
5 Dire Avengers
Wave Serpent, Twin linked Shuriken Cannon, Underslung Shuriken Cannon, Holo Fields
5 Windrider Jetbikes

FAST ATTACK
Crimson Hunter, Exarch

HEAVY SUPPORT
Fire Prism, Holo Fields
Fire Prism, Holo Fields
Fire Prism, Holo Fields


Mission: Big Guns Never Tire (three objectives)
Deployment: Hammer and Anvil
Night Fight on first turn: Yes
First Turn: DE
Warlord Trait DE: Divide and Conquer (-1 to enemy reserves)
Warlord Trait CWE: Princeps of Deceit (redeploy D3 units)
Combat Drugs: Painbringer  (re-roll to wound)

Objectives
There were three objectives, the Eldar (Shadow) got to place two of them. I placed my centrally as I wanted the fighting to be over the centre of the board, as the Eldar were likely to have a mobile scoring unit late in the game (as the fire prisms were scoring and resilient thanks to the their holo fields).

Deployment:
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Depl
I had first turn and night fight so I deployed very aggressively, I wasn't going to win a shooting/dancing match with the Eldar as my vehicles were a lot more fragile than their eldar counterparts. The Eldar also had a range advantage with their fire prisms and serpent shields.

The Eldar deployed as far back as possible with the fire prisms out of sight. The Autarch was deployed centrally so that he could threaten a large part of the board.

The Eldar didn't seize the initiative.

Turn 1 (DE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Deturn1
The bottommost ravager and raiders moved forward and fired into the central wave serpent glancing it to death (it had not cover save as it hadn’t moved). The Dire Avengers emergency disembarked behind the forest. Two raiders and a ravager fired into the topmost wave serpent stripping two hull points. The Raider with the Grotesques moved flat out towards the eldar. The reavers turboboosted to the top flank (they got a 2+ cover save from any shooting more than 12" away thanks to night fight).

Turn 1 (CWE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Cweturn1
The autarch moved towards the raider with the grotesques in it and destroyed it with his fusion blaster fusion gun before jumping back onto the bunker with his assault move. The explosion wounded a grotesque. The bottom prism fired into the bottom ravager but failed to do any damage (4+ cover from night fight and jink). The bottom wave serpent fired into the same ravager but again failed to do any damage. The other two prisms fired into the topmost ravager but both missed (the lance curse!). The serpent with one remaining hull point fired it's turret and shield into the closest raider scoring a single glancing hit. The dire avengers ran into the forest.

Turn 2 (DE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Deturn2
The top two raiders and ravagers moved forward an fired into the wave serpent on a single hull point managing to get a penetrating hit through, causing the serpent to explode (as it's shield were down). The bottom ravager and raider fired into the remaining wave serpent but failed to damage it. The reavers moved forward to threaten the fire prisms with their blasters but I decided it would be better to use them to bladevane the dire avengers, giving them a 3+ cover save for moving flat out and a pain token each for slaughtering the avengers. All three warriors disembarked and fired into the solitaire as they had nothing else to shoot (as they forgot their blasters in Commorragh), failing to wound him despite firing 36 shots (on average it takes 108 splinter shots to inflict a single wound on a solitaire with a 2+ re-rollable cover save). The succubus and her bodyguard stayed in their crater as from their they could defend the warriors from the autarch, and threaten two objectives.

Turn 2 (CWE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Cweturn2
The Crimson hunter failed to come in (needing a 3+ as divide and conquer countered the bonus from the autarch). The windrider jetbikes came on and fired into the reavers killing two. The two fire prisms fired large blasts into the reavers, but failed to kill any due to bad scatters, 3+ cover and FNP. The fire prism at the bottom fired into the ravager but missed (lance curse strikes again!). The wave serpent destroyed the raider near the warrior on the central objective. The autarch moved out of the ruin, losing a wound to dangerous terrain, he then failed his 7" charge with fleet leaving him in the open.

Turn 3 (DE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Deturn3
The bottommost reavers fired into the rear of the wave serpent (AV10 and unshielded), however they failed to do any damage! All the ravagers and raiders moved to get a jink save and fired into the same wave serpent, but only managed one glance between them. The other reaver squad fired into the windrider jetbikes killing two, the bike flee off the board. The three warrior squad rapid fired into the autarch but fail to wound him (66 splinter shots). The succubus and grots charge the autarch, inflicts one wound with his overwatch. The autarch challenged however the succubus refused, he failed to do any damage to the grotesques (S3 as he didn't charge). The grotesques then manage to inflict one wound. The Dark Eldar won combat, the autarch held, however he rolled a six for his hit and run, meaning he failed to get away!

Turn 3 (CWE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Cweturn3
The crimson hunter came on and wrecked a ravager. The bottom fire prism fired into the surviving ravager, but missed (LANCES THEY ARE CURSED!). The central fire prism fired a large blast into the bottom middle reavers killing two and forcing them to flee. The wave serpent fired into the raider near the central warriors making it explode, hitting the warriors who went to ground and didn't take any casualties. The last fire prism fired into the large reaver squad hitting five but only killing one (4+ cover/FNP). The autarch was cut down by the grotesques and they consolidate towards the fire prism.

Turn 4 (DE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Deturn4
The reavers rallied and fired snap shots at the prism near them to no effect. The ravager fired into the same prism to no effect. The warriors in the open moved and ran toward the crater. The warriors in the forest embarked on the raider which moved flat out towards the bottom objective. The larger reaver squad fired into the rear of the wave serpent, but it jinked the penetrating hit. The Succubus and here bodyguard charged the fire prism near them destroying it, the explosion killed a nearby warrior.

Turn 4 (CWE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Cweturn4
The crimson hunter glanced the ravager to death. The surviving fire prism at the top and the wave serpent moved away from the Dark Eldar. The fire prism at the bottom fired into the bottom reavers hitting five but failing to kill any!

Turn 5 (DE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Deturn5
The warriors in the crater moved up to secured the top objective. The warriors in the forest disembarked to secure the bottom objective. Their raider spun round and fired into the fire prism immobilising it. The small squad of reavers fired into the same prism destroying it. The large squad of reaver turboboosted to the other side of the board. The Succubus and here grots moved towards the fire prism at the top near the forest, but failed their charge.

Turn 5 (CWE):
BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Cweturn5
The crimson hunter destroyed a raider. The wave serpent fired into the reavers killing two. Finally the fire prism, which was scoring/denial thanks to the mission, contested the bottom objective. The game ended. Dark Eldar Victory!

DE VPs: 11 (2 objectives, slay the warlord, line breaker, first blood, 2 big guns silenced) TE VPs: 2(2 big guns silenced)

Overview
A good game that would have been a lot closer had Shadow not had so many dud rolls at key moments: crimson hunter not coming on, autarch failing his charge, and failing his hit and run. Any of those three rolls could have changed the landscape of the game significantly. I also had a great first turn with my lances doing really well. Had I gone second, or not had night fight the game could have been very different. Especially seeing as I didn't have blasters in my warrior squad my AT could have evaporated very quickly (I'm  definitely reconsidering them after this game). Anyway on to the Eldar!

Fire prisms seem great on paper, but their single shot when it comes to AT doesn't make them that reliable (they can miss, or be negated by cover), so I wouldn't count on them for AT, they definitely need guide/prescience support to fulfil that role. However they do bring flexibility and the S5 AP3 large blast is a fantastic asset to have against all the marine armies out there.

The crimson hunter was very impressive, vector dancer basically makes it a flyer without flyer restrictions and 4 BS5 S8 AP2 shots mean even if you roll badly you will most likely glance something to death or severely cripple it. That being said my list had no AA so I'm not sure how well it stands up to interceptors and other forms of AA.

The wave serpents were tough, but still die to stripping hull points, if anything it's the 4+ cover save from holo fields that make eldar tanks a royal pain to deal with. On the bright side the shield doesn't protect the rear armour which is also AV10. Although all my blaster shots whiffed splitting your forces can ensure you get shots at that vulnerable rear armour.

The Bikertaire was ridiculously resilient to shooting, but as expected folds like a wet paper bag if you manage to charge him. Ironically because he is so resilient to shooting he will probably look for a one turn combat, using hit and run at the end of his own turn, especially if he is using the laser lance, as he is a measly S3 on the second round of combat and he is far more resilient against shooting than in assault.

As for the warlock and bikes, I think the warlock only being leadership 8 is problematic for a unit that falls back 3d6".

A big thanks to everyone in The Dark City chat for giving me advice and helpful tactical/strategic banter. And of course a big thanks to Shadow for a very enjoyable game as usual.

Hope you enjoyed the report! Smile

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Last edited by Mushkilla on Tue Jun 18 2013, 22:31; edited 3 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 12 2013, 21:10

Great batrep and excellent summary and analysis at the end Mushkilla. Thanks for taking the time to share.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 12 2013, 21:26

Mush:
Top quality report as usual and thanks for sharing. The buzzards seemed the underdogs on paper but you pulled it off. I agree with your assessment of fire prisms and the solitaire and also that the first turn is key to these matchups. Lastly I like how you make multiple full warrior squads in raiders look good, while grots are in my top 2 all time favs so nuff said there. Overall it looks like you were quick to pounce on any infantry that became demeched which IMO was a hidden factor in this game.

Shadow:
Im assuming the twin shuri cannon wave serpents were due to existing models right? How much better would TLSL's have been? 

I would be interested to hear your take on the battle and your impressions of the eldar including solitaires loadout and value, the DAVU vs larger squads, battle trance, shuriken weaponry in general, etc. I would think at least 1 fire prism would be better as another wave serpent or optimally as some number of war walkers, but this is only theory on my part.

Overall your list to me looked favored to win on paper but apparently bad dice combined with mush seeming to capitalize from those opportunities proved otherwise.

I liked how you choose not to take the bait and shoot the grots btw, like many people mistakenly do. In hindsight would prioritizing the reavers with serpent shields have made a difference? 

Lastly I dont understand why you moved the prism within the grots threat range as opposed to away and onto an objective to fire from but im probably missing some details here.

Anyway cool game guys.  
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Nappen
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 12 2013, 23:07

Great report, Thanks.

off topic question-how did you make the models for the units?

Not sure there is much to add to the analysis, you did a great job covering it.
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Bibitybopitybacon
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 01:11

Interesting battle, though I think shadow must have offended the dice gods greatly in some way. It seems clear that with fire Ps you need farseer support to make their one shot reliable. Id switch out the solitaire for a farseer on a jetbike and since you can only twinlink two a turn id switch the third fire p to a nightspinner.
The hunter did amazing. Far better than I thought it would do in fact.
great report and ty for sharing.


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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 08:06

Thanks everyone.

@Brom wrote:
Lastly I like how you make multiple full warrior squads in raiders look good

That's all they were doing (looking good)! Because they sure as hell didn't do anything other than sit pretty on objectives. Smile

@Nappen wrote:
off topic question-how did you make the models for the units?

It's using a program called Vassal, with a 40k module, it's really good for writing reports (but a bit fiddly at times) a quick web search will find it.

@Bibitybopitybacon wrote:
Interesting battle, though I think shadow must have offended the dice gods greatly in some way.

Yeah, muses know what he did to the Dice God's daughters, but it can't have been pretty. You don't miss with all your lances, lose a wound to dangerous terrain, fail a charge, and fail to hit and run, without doing something seriously offensive.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 12:38

Hello Mush,

thanks for the great report, I am really interested in this as I will have to face my oldest 40k buddy with his new Eldar-Codex pretty soon ;-)

I am curious about one thing though, do you think it is an even match beween DE and Eldar when it comes to Mobility?

I am asking this because I am a firm believer that as a DE General you win (or lose) your games in the movement phase!
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 13:40

Dark Eldar are still more mobile than Eldar.

Sure the new Eldar "battle focus ability" lets their infantry move shoot move, but the catch is you have to be on foot to use it (so you are are sacrificing speed in order to use it). Their shuriken weapons also have inherently shorter range.

Dark eldar still have open topped vehicles (shoot and assault out of transports), ravagers and reavers (can do loads of damage on the move).

For example in the game above the reavers combined with control of the centre board meant I could outmanoeuvre the eldar. Also the dire avengers were unable to assault out of the wave serpents to shoot/assault the warriors and take them out because wave serpents are not assault vehicles. This meant if they jumped out to shoot they would be exposed to my shooting next turn and be unable to hide in assault.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 14:18

Well, can Shadow explain why he doesnt use those ignoring cover multiple shots from Wave Serpents shield? It would kill any DE vehicles without problem.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 17:13

Quote :
That's all they were doing (looking good)! Because they sure as hell didn't do anything other than sit pretty on objectives. BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts Icon_smile

Lol thats what I mean.

Quote :
Well, can Shadow explain why he doesnt use those ignoring cover multiple shots from Wave Serpents shield? It would kill any DE vehicles without problem.

He did use the shields but apparently his rolls were crud there as well. I do think using the cover ignoring to smoke those reavers and warriors might have helped but thats all from the rearview mirror..
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 13 2013, 17:20

The shields are AP- so warriors and reavers will still get their armour save, and FNP in the case of the reavers.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 14 2013, 15:23

Never mind, I'm an idiot.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 14 2013, 15:41

@LordSqueak wrote:
Never mind, I'm an idiot.

Mysterious post is mysterious. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 14 2013, 15:55

@Mushkilla wrote:
@LordSqueak wrote:
Never mind, I'm an idiot.

Mysterious post is mysterious. Very Happy

Yeah I was going to say that I thought that Vehicles couldn't be scoring, but you were playing big guns never tire.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 15 2013, 10:26

@LordSqueak wrote:
Yeah I was going to say that I thought that Vehicles couldn't be scoring, but you were playing big guns never tire.

Happens to all of us! Very Happy

Also for those of you waiting for Shadows Revenge's response he will make one, it's just he has had problems with the new text editor forced on us by our forum provider, so it might take a few days.

He's not hiding in shame, or anything *cough*! Wink

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 15 2013, 17:16

Haha that's brutal mush! Also maybe the txt editor change is the same one plaguing my posts as well.. Idk.

Good point on ap- I had forgotten that and the t4 of the reavers. Also I'm curious why not spend the extra 25 pts to make the succubus an archon with 2++? I've run this setup and its sufficiently killy while tanking select wounds is what I really want. I usually include a huskblade though since even the threat of it causes problems.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 15 2013, 18:36

@Brom wrote:
Also maybe the txt editor change is the same one plaguing my posts as well.. Idk.

If you are having any problems with the editor please let me know in this thread.

@Brom wrote:
Also I'm curious why not spend the extra 25 pts to make the succubus an archon with 2++? I've run this setup and its sufficiently killy while tanking select wounds is what I really want.

I just didn't have the points, the only way to include an Archon would have been to drop a grotesque, which I didn't feel was a worthwhile trade. 1500 point games are like that especially when you have so many points tied up in reavers. Similar reason why Shadow didn't have scatter lasers, he just didn't have 15pts to spare.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 15 2013, 19:49

Ah I see, ya your list is pretty tight due to your reavers from my perspective. The eldar though would benefit far more from lasers than a warlock I believe.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 16 2013, 16:44

Great report, Mush. Everything is really clear as usual. Although the Autarch picked up a fusion blaster at one point! Did he nick it from the tau?Razz

Good demonstration of how we can use nightfight to be really aggressive vs a shooty army. Lance fire was above average 1st turn for sure, but then much poorer 2nd turn actually. I also think the autarch should have been squashed by the grotesques in one turn, leaving you out in the open in the CWE turn, so that whole combat turned out very favourably.

I think the fire prisms are better vs marines, guard, tau; our light vehicles have their best chance of surviving vs single, powerful shots, rather than against multi-shot weapons (warwalkers outflanking would have been interesting).
Mind you, they're pretty difficult to take out once they get moving.

You worried about running out of lance fire, but you still seemed to have the reavers at the end, with the grotesques as a back-up.
You could consider a single wych squad with HWG to give your troops another role, aside from hiding and sniping away (which they are good at doing, admittedly). Or heat lances on one of the reaver squads to make them extra deadly vs tanks, though I know you prefer the general utility of blasters.
Blasters on the warriors is ok, but I think the reason you dropped them originally was because they hardly ever used them?

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 17 2013, 11:24

@Squierboy wrote:
Good demonstration of how we can use nightfight to be really aggressive vs a shooty army.

I don't normally go first, but when I do. I makes sure it's night fight. Very Happy

@Squierboy wrote:
Lance fire was above average 1st turn for sure, but then much poorer 2nd turn actually.

I think it was more my turn 3-4 lances that were terrible, every time I got a shot on rear armour it would whiff completely.

@Squierboy wrote:
I also think the autarch should have been squashed by the grotesques in one turn, leaving you out in the open in the CWE turn, so that whole combat turned out very favourably.

But would being in the open have been such a problem? What could threaten the grotesques that wasn't being pointed at the reavers or ravagers. It's not like the grotesques were a ranged threat or had much mobility to keep up with the Eldar. At the end of the day they were there for area denial more than anything.

I think it would have been more problematic had the autarch survived and managed to hit and run away as he probably would have gone around eating my troops.

@Squierboy wrote:
You worried about running out of lance fire, but you still seemed to have the reavers at the end, with the grotesques as a back-up.

It was fine because I went first, but I am not sure how healthy things would have looked had I gone second. That's my concern.

@Squierboy wrote:
Or heat lances on one of the reaver squads to make them extra deadly vs tanks, though I know you prefer the general utility of blasters.

I think the problem with heatlances, is the loss of 9" of effective range means things can run away from you. For a wave serpent/falcon/prism not to kite you you need to turbo boost within 9" of it (9"+12" movement being the maximum effective range of the heat lance), if you are further away the serpent/falcon/prism can just move 12" away and leave you out of range. Being 9" away from an enemy transport is not somewhere I really want to be, as that leaves you wide open to a lot of fire. With the blasters the 18" mean only a few units will be able to target you, where as 9" means most of their army can target you. Not sure if I explained that well, but that's the gist of my reasoning.

@Squierboy wrote:
Blasters on the warriors is ok, but I think the reason you dropped them originally was because they hardly ever used them?

True, and the list is already tight on points, adding the blasters back in would mean weakening the grotesque unit. I guess I'll have to see how I fare against mech guard to really judge my anti tank capacity.

Thanks for the great advice as always Squierboy! Smile

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 17 2013, 11:50

Your opinion, Mushkilla, if you don't mind. Target priority wise, which would you shoot at first as DE - TLSL Wave Serpent, or a Fire Prism? I'm thinking the serpent.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 17 2013, 12:04

@autopilot wrote:
Your opinion, Mushkilla, if you don't mind. Target priority wise, which would you shoot at first as DE - TLSL Wave Serpent, or a Fire Prism? I'm thinking the serpent.

It depends on the situation, but more often than not I would probably go for the serpents. They cause us a lot more problems, and contain squishy scoring units that are ripe for pain token harvesting. I'm really not too impress with the fire prism, at least against us the a single S9 AP1 hit isn't as effective as 7 S6 twinlinked hits (Assuming scatter lasers and shuri-cannon).

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 17 2013, 12:11

Mush wrote:
at least against us the a single S9 AP1 hit isn't as effective as 7 S6 twinlinked hits (Assuming scatter lasers and shuri-cannon).
Also the Twin-Linked Shield. Ha.
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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 17 2013, 13:33

@autopilot wrote:
Also the Twin-Linked Shield. Ha.

I really don't see Eldar players using the shield unless: they out range you and are not vulnerable to retaliation next turn, are down to 1HP, or to get a first turn alphas strike that would take out most of your anti tank.

Without the shields those wave serpents go down pretty easily considering their cost so using them as a weapon is a high risk proposition.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 17 2013, 18:07

Well here I am. Hopefully fixed from posting problems (atleast while I sit at this comp that is Wink )

First off Ill give my side of the battle, and then Ill get to answering questions.

I really think your gamble with the reavers bladevaning T2 gave me the chance to try and come back. You should of just shot those lances into my tanks and drop them, and then JSJ back out of cover. My targets were still the ravagers at that point, and your reavers would of been relatively safe. Sure, you gave me nowhere to run but towards your table edge, but you should of just ended it early. Without my tanks I had no AT, and no AT means a loss easily.

Ok, now for answers. First off the Bikertaire was just to test him out. I really like him alot, I think when used right he can be deadly (he should of just ran around and at up all of Mush's troops. Sadly the dice said no...) I knew going in that a farseer would of been a better choice due to guide/prescience on the prisms and the problem with 1 shot tanks, but I didnt really think I would need it that badly (ofc I sadly miss placed my faith in my dice rolls)

As to why I didnt use a TL scatter and shoot the shields is easy. You are paying 120pts for an AV12 tank. This is something guard get for 55 pts. Shooting the shields means that your bloated point heavy tank has a possibility of getting dropped in 1 shot. This is the same tank that is holding your fragile troops and protecting them from the army with THE most point effective anti infantry in the game. Even ignoring cover its not worth the risk. Dual Cannons puts out just as much firepower and can easily take care of tanks just as well, while still take a full 3 shots to down. The serpent shield is a trap for eldar players. You should only shoot them when its advantageous to do so (1 HP left, or they cant threaten you). In this position it was not advantageous. He had enough lances barring down on me that if I would of shot the shields T1, I would of been tabled by the end of the game.

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PostSubject: Re: BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts   BR26: The Black Buzzards VS Eldar Mech - 1500pts I_icon_minitime

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