Dark eldar and assault FINISHED
Posts : 133
Join date : 2012-02-12
|Subject: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Sun Jun 02 2013, 19:03|| |
Dark Eldar and assault.
Dark Eldar may not have all the strength of a raging Ork, or be as armoured as the mighty SMurf, but the DE are still a potent close combat army. With an above average WS, un-godly I and access to some deadly wargear, DE can cleave a path through the heart of the enemy force while the shooting elements of the army get all they can out of the distraction.
Dark Eldar and the charge.
Get it. With open topped transports, fleet and just the inherent DE mobility you have no excuse not to with the exception of rolling a double 1, but no! with fleet you will never have that again. The point of getting the charge is less you getting an extra attack, but denying it to the opponent. But the things that extra attack can do are not to be under-estimated. Beasts can put out an un-holy amount of attacks already, the charge is just dandy. Incubi on the charge can be a bit too killy, but it sure is fun!
Hellions get hammer of wrath, which isn't that good, which is great! It is the same as two extra attacks on a marine but you still wound on 5s. It’s something that en masse can put a dent in quite a few things before you even swing. The Charge. Get it. No Excuses.
**NOTE** HoW only works in you don’t use jetpack movement, so you can only move 6'' and use hammer of wrath. Am I right in thinking bikers always get it?
Dark Eldar and drugs.
Drugs are bad...Mmmmkay? *SPLAT*. *Holsters splinter pistol* Drugs are great! Drugs are what make our mediocre Wyches and Hellions actually quite offensive. Don't forget them. While Hypex does absolutely nothing, there isn't a bad roll apart from 1.
2:Serpentin: +1 WS. Not the best at your disposal, possibly getting you more hits and making MEQ hit the Succubae on 5s. if you have the duke with you, skip it for the above mostly but it’s not terribad. It statistically isn't much worse then +1 str and is better for V.blades and Agonisers (if you still use them...)
3:Grave Lotus:+1 strength. YES! Very helpful for all our units, making wounding that much easier. It used to be not the best because it never helped the Agonisers, but who uses that any more? I’d much rather re-roll that 2+ venom blade or have my Hellion swarm glance that tank to death with strength 5 hits.
4:Painbringer: re-roll to wound. Bring the pain! it is statistically better then Grave Lotus. Helps Agonisers if you still use them. Overall one of the best for our basic troops (Wyches) but the +1 str is better for Hellions if only for utility. The sheer amount of str 5 hits will wreck most things, even vehicles.
*NOTE* Does this effect HoW because it happens before the game starts? If so that is amazing!
5:Adrenalight:+1 attack. Good, not the best, but good. Blood Brides getting 5 attacks each is nothing to be sniffed at and that non assault unit of Reavers isn't bad with 4 attacks +HoW will shred those Shoota's/Guardsmen/Tau/ even Kroot. Helpful, not game changing.
6:Splintermind.:PAIN TOKEN. Game changing. Feel no pain with infantry will help your chances against shooting, and FC off the bat from a Haemonculus unit. Get this.
**NOTE** If you, like me, always start a Haemonculus with your Wyches then you already have FnP. And if its a choice between FC and +1 str/re-roll I’d go with that one instead.
Dark Eldar assault units.
Wyches. Great tar-pits if they make it into combat, which is no easy feat. With an armour save that might as well not be there, if you’re found out of cover (which is easier to find this edition), pray to the muses they offended the dice god. But in combat they are stupidly survivable with a 4++ usually followed by a 5+++, they can hold their own indefinitely. Don't send against swarms, send against specialist of combat like terminators, Khorne berserkers and such to make full use of the 4++. Not incredibly killy, but don't underestimate these girls. But to be fair I am obscenely lucky with my gals who can boast the heads of almost any prized unit out there but that’s not the point. Wych weapons aren't amazing and usually aren't worth the points. But if you have a habit of your raiders exploding, WW keep the unit effective despite casualties. Razorflails are my preference but Hydragauntlets keep the unit dishing out a LOT of attacks. But remember no amount of str 3 hits makes it a good assault unit, even with re-rolls. Shardnet is in a whole different ball park. Being the only defensive weapon it has its uses in limiting the amount of power fist hits coming your way. People like to use them in conjunction with an escorting IC to help him survive in combat. If being used as a tarpit (which they should be) then limiting the amount of attacks can only be a good thing. The only WW which its effect can’t be done with another body. Always get the Hekatrix unless you’re using them as a haywire delivery. She has access to weapons that ARE the punch of the unit. A simple power weapon can do its part for cheap, but wounding on 5s is a problem, hitting last isn't thinkable and as a tarpit we are going to be in combat for more than 1 turn. The Agoniser is too many points on such a fragile character.
On that note I'd also advise use of the venom blade, cheap and brutally effective, that marine can't out run those 1's and 2's forever. This makes her a great cheap challenge winner and remember, some MC are in fact challengeable. You never know, the Hekatrix might really win!
*NOTE* Haywire grenades are now awesome, with the ability to G-2-D any vehicle in the game even in tiny units. Many people now use 5 with just haywire grenades in a venom as a cheap AV and a free venom which never hurts, will most likely slip past that marines’ notice to get close to the land raider the first time but don't count on it after the first game.
Hellions: Hellions bring the swarm factor. Wyches just don't have power to deliver the amount of wounds needed to get through most units while still being cheap. Hellions do this very well. First off lets start with the most basic thing about them, they are fast! Moving 12 inches thanks to the sky bored plus running meaning they can be where they want turn one, up for an assault turn two. This brings us to the next part, being where you want, cover! Sporting a save matched by a GEQ they need to be in cover whenever possible to survive any shooting at all. All considered they even have a decent shooting attack! 2 shots with 4+ poison before an assault per hellion from 20 hellions will put a dent in anything, but you don't buy them for shooting. In assault they have that insane initiative symbolic of dark eldar with strength four meaning they are putting out a respectable number of wounds. But with hellions the charge is more important then any other dark eldar unit, then they get access to hammer of wrath and an extra attack which is needed to swamp even power armour in wounds.
Helliarch is a matter of opinion, I would take him for a cheap Agoniser to keep some punch vs. power armour, but his leadership is wasted if you take the singular thing that makes hellion a premier assault unit. The Baron! First off he is cheap, second he makes hit and run a guarantee and third he gives the unit he is with stealth, so your cover is all the better. Not good enough? He makes hellions troops!!!! Not to mention giving out grenades out to every hellion and comes with the coveted shadowfield to keep these benefits alive. All in all a decent assault unit that is very fast, but lacks AP and is HIGHLY dependent on drugs rolls to make it better. Every roll save one makes them alot better in assault, DONT FORGET!
Incubi: Super awesome bad asses of the dark city with big ass swords of ugly death. in short. Killy. 3+ armour is the best you’re going to get, live with it. But that 5+++ will come soon enough as you will slaughter anything in your way short of terminators, scrap that thanks to an FAQ even terminators!*Still don't go for SS/TH ones though*. I always take the Klaivex with demi-klaives making him a beast in challenges but most people see this as too expensive. I do this because since I don’t run an IC with the unit it means he will win most challenges against non characters.
Stone is too expensive to me but another flame template never hurt. An expensive but brutal unit . Unit of 5, venom. No grenades though, take care with that. If taken with Archon makes it really too killy, don't bother unless you REALLY want grenades but a single high strength blast will make you extremely unhappy.
Beastmasters: Now considered one of the best assault units in the game. They are super fast being beasts and are remarkably cheap for what you get ( in points only, a full unit will cost you an arm and a leg using GW models!). There is so much to this unit i will have to brake it down.
Beastmasters:- Needed, you can't take a unit with out them. Each Beastmasters is a Wych on a sky bored, but instead of being jump troops they count as beasts. They have access to most of the goodies sergeants get, but i would advise against them. With only a single attack base its simply not worth it, especially when thinking what those points would buy the unit. each Beastmasters can take some beasts in 0-5 Khymerae per master, 0-2 Razorwings or 1 clawed fiend. these are the real punch (or should i say claw?)
Khymerae:- With a solid stat-line of that rare strength four and that familiar Imitative 6 along with 3 attacks they are a good buy for 12 points. They add quite a bit of punch but that's not what they are bought for. They are bought for an all valuable 4+ invulnerable save afforded by being half daemon (strangely better then mandrakes who are the same...) which is used for protecting other members of the unit from high strength weaponry. These are your ablative wounds, but few meat shields are as good at it or pack half as much punch!
Clawed fiend:- With a scary stat-line of 5's and 4's all around they pack a real punch. They also have a nifty ability to gain an extra attack for each wound done to them so on your last wound that single model puts out 7 strength 5 attacks. The reason these monsters aren't taken more are less obvious, but incredibly crippling. First is price, 40 points is a lot of points for a unit that can get 10 wounds and more attacks for 30. Second is that the unit is going to have majority toughness 3, so his high toughness is wasted. third is that he wants to take wounds, but can't TAKE them. With no save of meaning it isn't hard to wipe him out before the extra attacks come into use.
Razorwing flock:- NOW WE ARE TALKING! With a great stat-line (sensing a pattern?) of 5 attacks and 5 wounds all for the tiny price of 15 points. These are your damage dealers and what your Khymerae are there to protect. Why you ask? 5 strength 3 attacks isn't scary is it? No, course not, but 5 strength 3 RENDING attacks is. With 5 wounds they can take a beating while losing none of those attacks. You can take 2 per Beastmasters meaning for 30 points you are getting 10 rending attacks and 10 wounds. Take at least 5-6 in a good sized pack, there only weakness is low toughness which means instant death takes all 5 wounds in 1 hit. But that's what Khymerae are for!
Reavers: While I wouldn't call it an assault unit when they gets their first pain token they can do well against undedicated melee units. They, unlike other stupid bikers, remembered to bring their knives and pistols, giving them 3 attacks on the charge + HoW allowing them to swamp shootas in wounds hopefully. Drugs help a lot though, with a good drug roll they can become a good assault unit but remember that’s not their goal. Reavers are fast AV, nifty in the movement phase, line breakers, contesters and good AI shooting and they CAN assault. They are a jack of all trades but they are certainly not the masters of assault. Take a look at Mushkilla's reports.
*NOTE* Bikers are relentless meaning they can fire there splinter rifles before they charge reliably. This could be the difference between beating those marines or not.
Wracks: Wracks are not elites, your codex lies to you! Well, by that I mean you wont be taking them in elites unless you REALLY want to spam venoms, as they are the cheapest minimum unit you can have in a venom. But this is dark eldar and assault, not dark eldar and venomspam. Taking a Haemonculi makes these guys troops where they work as good objective campers *well, by DE standards*, being toughness 4 and having feel no pain they can survive a few bolter rounds if they are in cover. In assault they are...well I'm not exactly sure. weapon skill 4 means they hit on 4's or 3's, strength 3 it mitigated by 4+ poison weapons and easy access to furious charge. But lack of fleet is troubling and a *Low* I of 4 means they don't strike before most things. A great upgrade which I have already touched on is getting a liquefier gun to soften up what they charge. or more to there roll, give them a boost against charging units trying to knock them of an objective. Acothyst can take a large variety of largely useless upgrades, so like always stick with venom blade. Scissor hands are interesting, but they are also 3 times the price for 1 more attack and to wound on 3s, so I wouldn't go for it. They are ok for what they do, camp. They can reliably fight off most non dedicated close combat unit trying to push them off an objective, but will fold in combat against something stronger, good job they are cheap!
*NOTE* Wracks are surprisingly good against tyranids (Urien seemed to have the right idea after all) because against the big beasties they usually strike first and wound on 4's, and also because of toughness 4 the tyranid monsters need to smash to remove FnP, meaning at most 2 dead wracks a turn.
**NOTE** Don't forget that you get to re-roll to wound if your strength is equal or higher then your opponents toughness. This means that against T 3 you re-roll all the time, and against T 4 you re-roll first turn with furious charge.
Grotesques: These big beasties are on a whole different scale to anything else in your arsenal. High toughness and FnP means they can shrug off a lot of small arms fire and high strength means they can dish out a lot of wounds. Strong and tough, there must be some downsides? Firstly they are 35 pts each for a fairly average WS and I of 4 *beats Ogryns by far though*, an abysmal Leadership of 3, no way to penetrate any armour save what so ever and the fact that if you don't babysit them with a character they go batgak crazy and dish out damage to every unit close to them, then die...
So to an initiated eye they may not look to good, but there are ways around there short comings. The biggest of these is the leadership of 3, meaning that any test forced will obliterate leave them falling back. By adding a character to the unit you mitigate most of there short comings by bringing leadership up to at least 9, the character can get through power armour and you can use their usually massive initiative to make sweeping advances. A favoured tactic is to stick 3/4 in a raider with a Succubus and sweep up the field. Expensive but sure does draw attention. The Aberration has access to some of the same upgrades as the acothyst but on a statline of a grotesque, they become slightly less useless. But I find anything worth instant deathing with a flesh gauntlet has to good a save to go down to a few saves, and might well kill the aberration before it strikes. So once again I call upon the humble venom blade for 4 attacks which wound on 2s with re-rolls. Scissor hands MAY be worth it, but I just can't justify the price compared to the venom blade.
*NOTE* Think dark eldar can do anything in apocalypse? Why not have 6 Urien grots in a tantalus and Vect, all made invisible by Eldrad, cause why not?
Talos: The Talos, like most coven dwellers, is a weird contraption. Its is big and imposing and puts out a fair few attacks on a good roll (D6 attacks, I'm not sure if I like that or not) and with toughness 7 and a 3+ save he can take a hit well. For 100pts you get a base Talos which will make an impact on the game. WS 5 is better the norm so hitting on 3's is the usual, and wounding on 2's is also the usual. So if he gets into combat he is undoubtedly a force to be reckoned with. But as always with dark eldar, that was a big IF. The Talos is slow, especially when compared to the lightning quickness of the rest of the assault force. Without fleet he is stuck with what he rolls when running, so the most he can move a turn is 12 inches, with an average of 9/10 inches a turn. So he usually makes it into combat by turn 3/4 if he lives. Which in itself isn't guaranteed, toughness 7 may help against small arms fire, it wont help a pittance against a las cannon or missile launcher, both ignore his save and wound on 2s. It only takes 3 shots to kill a Talos unless he has a Pain token, which is so vital so get him early. The best way to do this is to whittle a squad down to the last few men they fire the Talos's splinter cannon to get the token. Other ranged options include a haywire blaster and a heat lance, but I think most of the time he should be running so I'd be loathed to spend much on his shooting. Stinger pods are a possibility, but they don't have the range to get the Talos that pain token. If coming out of a webway portal * An advised method of getting a Talos to the field, as he wont have to take any fire..+ a Talos in your face is very scary to some armies!* then go for it, because the range matters much less.
Close combat upgrades amount to making your d6 attacks more reliable. Chain-flails let you roll and extra dice and pick highest Duke style, but are relatively expensive, but you will thank it for when you get the choice between a 6 and a 1. Ichor injectors are pointless to the extreme. Being a monstrous creature the Talos can smash for strength 10, instant killing most things, and anything it can't wont be likely to fail a toughness test would they? An extra CC weapon is interesting, but very expensive. With it on the charge you COULD get 8 attacks or 5 smash attacks *Bonus attacks happen after you half your attacks* but I'd find unless you know you will be smashing a lot *nob bikers getting you down?* then its to expensive.
*Note* Just to say that strength 7 is the worst monstrous creature strength in the game. You gain little by smashing but are not strong enough to threaten some vehicles. So smash with care, and know when to smash or not.
Archon: The head honcho, the big man, the demolisher, is strength 3 . Not surprising but we as dark eldar have some workarounds for his bad stats and make them useable with his godly stats of I and WS. Venomblade works well and reliably but you might as well take a Succi for that. You take an Archon for his special gear that no-one else can get such as the shadowfield giving him the best, if most unforgiving, save in the game. You take him for a Djin blade and for 8 attacks on the charge. You take him as an ultimate for the instant deathing goodness of a huskblade, especially with a soultrap as I know it is the secret desire to get a strength 10 Archon and then punch a landraider in. I for one can boast this accomplishment. All these special weapons with a stat line only dark eldar can justify for under 100 points basic is what you take an Archon for but he's not our cheapest HQ to make the obligatory slot and he isn't the best combat character HQ until the points go considerably up but he has the best defence, kinda...
*NOTE* Alternatively you can give him a blaster and stick him with your blasterborn for a shot that will ALWAYS hit.
Succubus: The original dark eldar hell-cat. With a frankly unholy stat line for a tiny amount of points you get what you paid for and more! While she has no armour out of combat when she gets in she benefits from a nifty 4++ dodge which is more reliable then the shadowfield the Archon can take. She can take Wych weapons, but forget about them. She can *read WILL* take either a venomblade, power weapon or Agoniser to make use of the unholy WS and A. Fully upgraded she is hard pressed to go over 100pts and out of our HQs she's got best point-to-kill ratio. A statistic from Mush says that when not on the charge and with nothing more then a venom blade she does as much damage as 6.666 Wyches and this means Wyches will still be effective despite casualties and also means that the Wyches survive better in a crashed raider by allocating some wounds onto her as those wounds rarely matter being T 3 an all. Taking a blast pistol to make use of her BS seems good but if you’re close enough to shoot with it you could charge it with HWG and finish it with less chance of an explosion. On that note always take HWG as you can throw it using that BS to almost guarantee a glance.
*NOTE* Use you BS to throw the units grenade and you'll be hard pressed to miss by to much even if you roll over 10 on the scatter.
Haemonculus: Our utility character. He is needed to give units pain tokens (WYCHES, HELLIONS!!!!) and is no slouch in combat either. Note he is *only* I4 meaning he strikes last in most of our units making him ideal for a power axe, as he is not losing much. His main job done (transporting pain tokens) then you have to decide what to do with him. Many delegate him to drive-bys with the amazing liquefier (best flamer in the game!) while some keep him with the Wyches on the charge. Remember he is without fleet, so the whole unit is. The weapons he can get in CC are mainly poisoned, but that's not a bad thing. Even if you’re only giving him a liquefier give him a venom blade, those 5 pts means he can assault a unit of guardsmen and have a good chance to win after the liquefier has done its work. Scissor hands are better than the venom blade but x3 more expensive (15pts, still not much) and not as good as a V.blade on the ancient. A simple power weapon is ok, you get what you pay for. This is how to describe the Haemonculi best. You Get What You Pay For.
*Ancient* With better stats across the line (notably wounds, attacks and I) he makes a better carrier for the better weapons. The Agoniser is worth it on him with his better I and the amount of wounds he dishes out with a V.blade will even scare a terminator.
*NOTE* In the movement phase before a charge, detach the Haemonculus from the wyches and charge him in separately taking the overwatch for your fragile Wyches. But note if he fails his charge he will be a sitting duck.
**NOTE** With their immense cheapness, their utility and the ability to take 3 in a single HQ slot, every army can use a Haemonculus if you have an assault element.
Posts : 8
Join date : 2013-03-02
Location : Oak Park, IL
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Sun Jun 02 2013, 20:46|| |
Well done, thanks.
A Succubus carrying either a power sword or venom blade with a Wych escort and a PGL Hekatrix with similar weaponry can chew through a big swarmy unit or a blob of marines with painful heavy weapons. Make sure she throws a plasma grenade before the charge! The Wyches are just there to make sure the Succubus survives overwatch to get into combat, once she's mixing it up even strong CC stuff will be in dire straits unless they've brought something that can take down her initiative. The only thing I won't sic her on are SS Terminators or Tyranid warriors with lash whips, but that's what massed splinter fire is for.
The Succubus with Wych escort has turned into one of my favorite units of the game. I use the Lilith model because she's so damn gorgeous and the Wyches look great, and boy do they bring the pain.
Posts : 103
Join date : 2012-12-09
Location : Perth, Australia
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Mon Jun 03 2013, 01:28|| |
One very minor editorial criticism: A spell check won't tell you that you're using 'there' when you should be using 'their'.
Posts : 304
Join date : 2012-10-09
Location : South Carolina
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Mon Jun 03 2013, 04:00|| |
- @Dra'al Nacht wrote:
- One very minor editorial criticism: A spell check won't tell you that you're using 'there' when you should be using 'their'.
Really necessary???? I think it's safe to say that quality of info provided supersedes minor grammatical errors. Don ya thynk?
"... get me the holy hand grenade!!!! .... 1..2.....5, 3 SIR 3!!!!"
Posts : 86
Join date : 2012-05-03
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Tue Jun 04 2013, 11:07|| |
Great post, thank you so much. I kind of gave up on DE in CC but now you make me want to use my Incubi once more!
Posts : 506
Join date : 2012-12-30
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Tue Jun 04 2013, 16:35|| |
Good read overall - but some points that sprang to mind whilst I was reading it/answers to questions you asked.
#1 - Sadly Hammer of Wrath doesn't benefit from the effects of Grave Lotus as the hammer of wrath rules specify unmodified strength (i.e. the number on their profile).
#2 - Jetbikes will always get the Hammer of Wrath hit. Jump Infantry that choose to use their jump packs in the assault phase simply gain the rule for the rest of the turn, they don't have it as standard. Bikes/jetbikes do.
#3 - Succubus with haywire grenades - the haywire shot that you throw isn't a blast grenade, its a single shot. Means you're hitting on a 2+/6+ rather than rolling a blast template with scatter.
#4 - General point on combat drugs - hypex is rubbish for combat, yes. But if you're using it with scoring things (wyches, hellions if baron is kicking around) it can be godly to get to an objective. 3d6 pick the highest, with a re-roll for fleet? You can expect to roll that 6. Don't discount it out of hand, I've had it save me on more than one occasion (got to get to cover, need that last objective contested, oh-so-close to linebreaker)
#5 - Possibly worth mentioning the Stunclaw when talking about Hellions. Completely unique effect, can be used to pick on weaker characters not necessarily designed for combat that tend to bunker in a unit (non-termy librarian with 2 wounds will probably go down to a hail of attacks, farseers are fair game, ethereals will not like this even remotely). Also can be used to chain hit and run attempts - charge a unit, then hit-and-run out in your turn, stunclawing a character with you. If he doesn't die in the opponent's assault phase, hit and run AGAIN, getting you effectively 6d6 extra distance around the table, and leaving a character on his own exposed to shooting.
And a stylistic point - it might be worth breaking it up into a couple of different posts, or at least having it set out with headings/subheadings in different colours. As it stands it's good content, but wall-o'-text can sometimes make the best of things seem off-putting to read.
Great work overall!
Posts : 127
Join date : 2013-05-14
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Wed Jun 05 2013, 06:32|| |
Id write something about the fact you need to deal with T3, A lot of new large templates and burst templates which are S6.. And Baleflamer and Doomweaver are especially troubling ..
Lastly no DE in 6th can succeed without softening the enemy up at range eg take out the above ...
And if your relying on a transport plan for it to be shot out.. so plan for it eg spam lots ( many targets) , or have lots of long range fire to shut them down..
Posts : 25
Join date : 2013-05-08
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED Wed Jun 05 2013, 14:20|| |
Cracking read, hadn't considered a succubus until now! Mote points for venoms woohoo!
|Subject: Re: Dark eldar and assault FINISHED || |
Dark eldar and assault FINISHED