THE DARK CITY
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.



 
HomeDark Eldar WikiDark Eldar ResourcesNull CityRegisterLog in

 

 What am I missing about Wyches

Go down 
+11
Panic_Puppet
Tony Spectacular
shadowseercB
MFive
False Son
kiblams
Count Adhemar
tlronin
Silverglade
Skye26
keeblerpowell
15 posters
Go to page : 1, 2  Next
AuthorMessage
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 02:14

Ok so today was my first games with DE.

I had a unit of 9 wyches with Haywires in a venom.

They charged into a Necron Character (Not remembering his name right now.)

But here is what happened.

I charged in with 9 dudes. 27 attacks (1 stat + 1 for 2 ccw + 1 for charging x 9 bodies = 27)

I ended up hitting with 12 but needed 6's to wound (str 3 VS tough 5).

I dealt 2 wounds which he saved easily. The squad then stood there and played patty cake till the end of the game with the character.



I know throwing a grenade helps.... but I just feel like i am missing something pretty obvious and I don't know.



I am a nid player but trying out a new army. Any help would be great.

Moved topic to tactics. ~TLRonin
Back to top Go down
Skye26
Hellion
Skye26


Posts : 38
Join date : 2013-01-29

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 02:41

Unfortunately wyches aren't as fabulous in combat as one would hope, especially against a high toughness characters/units.

A few things I've found help a great deal which you haven't mentioned:

Squad leader with a Venom blade, although it doesn't help much if your whacking a guy with a 2+ Sv

Combat drugs, don't forget to roll for and use them, they can make a lot of difference with the right roll, especially against high toughness

Pistols, pew pew before charging, and as you said get a plasma grenade in there too

Hope this is of some help Smile

_________________

Like a Star @ heaven Blah blah woof woof! Like a Star @ heaven
Back to top Go down
Silverglade
Wych
Silverglade


Posts : 521
Join date : 2012-12-30

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 03:43

Like skye said. The power of wyches doesn't lie in their ability to kill, particularly high toughness foes. (though they make mincemeat of opponents like guard or many inquisitors). Their potency is in staying power.

A good sized squad can tar pit an opponent for an entire game.

One thing i should point out from your post.... you can only fit 5 men in a venom (did you mean perhaps a raider?).

That said, look at it from this perspective, your wyches cost you around 100 points. And for that 100 points, you bogged his character down for the entire game! That can be a huge tactical advantage, particularly with powerful characters.
Back to top Go down
tlronin
Wych
avatar


Posts : 818
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : The Netherlands

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 09:17

Welcome to The Dark City.

Their offensive power can be underwhelming. But you have to understand the role they play (or can play) in your army.

A lot of archons use them as tarpitters because of their 4++ save in CC. With 'relative' cheap troops you can keep your enemy's most expensive elite CC unit busy for a round or 2/3. Give a Hekatrix an agoniser and you'll be actually able to pack some punches.

A lot of archons use them as throwaway tankhunters. A squad of 5 wyches, give 'm haywire grenades, put them in a Venom and flatout towards nearest tank. The tank will be destroyed, almost guaranteed.

Main thing to remember is, they are relatively cheap troops. Don't expect them to take down elite CC units.

_________________
Archon of the kabal of The Bleeding Hand.
Member of local Dutch community: http://www.sweetlakesentinels.nl
Back to top Go down
Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
Count Adhemar


Posts : 7570
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : London

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 10:15

@Skye26 wrote:
Squad leader with a Venom blade, although it doesn't help much if your whacking a guy with a 2+ Sv

At least you'll be forcing him to roll more saves and therefore more chance of failure. Weight of attacks will almost always be the most efficient way of removing something with an excellent save if you lack the ability to bypass that save.

_________________
What am I missing about Wyches YhBv3Wk
You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. In what world could you possibly beat me?
Back to top Go down
Skye26
Hellion
Skye26


Posts : 38
Join date : 2013-01-29

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 11:00

Quote :
Weight of attacks will almost always be the most efficient way of removing something with an excellent save if you lack the ability to bypass that save.

This, this is too true. It has to fail that save sometime right ^.^


I made the mistake of drastically overestimating Wyches ability to kill -
and after having a little daydream about how my super skilled chicks would duck and dive, avoiding blows like the wind, finding that small weakness to take down the foe, i would foolishly charge into things such as Tyranids and Ork nobs,
Reality - overwatch kills a couple, wyches charge and cause 3 wounds, enemy saves, retaliates, dead wyches QQ

Also on numerous occasions I've haywire'd a tank, destroyed it, and have it explode in my face killing most my poor girls lol

I'm a little more realistic now and remember their only 75pts a squad. but for 75pts they can be the biggest pain in the backside for my foe.

_________________

Like a Star @ heaven Blah blah woof woof! Like a Star @ heaven
Back to top Go down
Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
Count Adhemar


Posts : 7570
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : London

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 11:15

@Skye26 wrote:
Also on numerous occasions I've haywire'd a tank, destroyed it, and have it explode in my face killing most my poor girls lol

I've been pretty lucky with explosions as 99% of the time the vehicles are wrecked due to glances rather than exploded. I have however been completely wiped out by overwatch fire on a couple of occasions when charging a walker Sad

_________________
What am I missing about Wyches YhBv3Wk
You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. In what world could you possibly beat me?
Back to top Go down
tlronin
Wych
avatar


Posts : 818
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : The Netherlands

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 11:35

Yeah me too. Most of the time they get wrecked.

_________________
Archon of the kabal of The Bleeding Hand.
Member of local Dutch community: http://www.sweetlakesentinels.nl
Back to top Go down
Skye26
Hellion
Skye26


Posts : 38
Join date : 2013-01-29

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 11:42

Quote :
I've been pretty lucky with explosions as 99% of the time the vehicles are wrecked due to glances rather than exploded. I have however been completely wiped out by overwatch fire on a couple of occasions when charging a walker

I have to say i'm the opposite, 99% of the time mine get roasted lol

I have on two occasions had an epic moment where a Wych had her squad killed and as the sole survivor went to charge a dreadnought, threw a haywire, penetrated and destroyed it Very Happy

The other and the best was a similar scenario, squad down to one from a Ork Jet fighter fire, passed her moral got in range to throw a grenade (yep i know a long shot) and bam triple 6! Flyer goes down, my opponents face was brilliant.

I guess for wyches, in fact for DE in general, it's a darn good job we can cheat death! lol
I bet Hemonculi have weird life insurance adds on whatever kind of T.V there is in Commorragh paha!

_________________

Like a Star @ heaven Blah blah woof woof! Like a Star @ heaven
Back to top Go down
kiblams
Hellion
kiblams


Posts : 66
Join date : 2013-04-30
Location : Derby, UK

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 12:17

I have been running Wyche squads in Raiders with haemys, they have either done very well or terribly in my experience. I have had times where 9 wyches with haywires have failed to kill walkers and times where they have smashed right through.

I kinda wish that they were more predictable and i am still learning what to throw them into as I go. My experience is never put them against Daemon flesh hounds! but then nothing I put against 20 flesh hounds took them down in one of my games, they ate 2x9 wyches, 20 Kabalite Warriors, 5 Wracks and a Talos...

I have no trouble getting them into combat so long as the Raider survives turn one, especially when I put a haemy in the Raider with them. though I have completely mixed results from them once in combat.
Back to top Go down
False Son
Sybarite
False Son


Posts : 305
Join date : 2012-12-23

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 15:17

@keeblerpowell wrote:
Ok so today was my first games with DE.
I dealt 2 wounds which he saved easily. The squad then stood there and played patty cake till the end of the game with the character.
Moved topic to tactics. ~TLRonin

In my mind the Wyches have done their job perfectly by not breaking and running. Necron HQs in general are a pain, and having one bogged down not able to do anything the rest of the game is a worthy contribution.
Back to top Go down
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 16:39

another couple questions....

How many wyches can throw grenades? I thought just one.

How many can assult with grenades? I thought just one.
Can you use the grenades in the assault even if you didnt charge that turn?


Thanks again for all of the info guys.... again I am a tyranid player. Grenades are COMPLETLY new to me! lol
Back to top Go down
Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
Count Adhemar


Posts : 7570
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : London

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 16:42

@keeblerpowell wrote:
How many wyches can throw grenades? I thought just one.

Correct

Quote :
How many can assult with grenades? I thought just one.

They all can but only get 1 attack each

Quote :
Can you use the grenades in the assault even if you didnt charge that turn?

yes


_________________
What am I missing about Wyches YhBv3Wk
You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. In what world could you possibly beat me?
Back to top Go down
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 16:49

@Count Adhemar wrote:
@keeblerpowell wrote:
How many wyches can throw grenades? I thought just one.

Correct

Quote :
How many can assult with grenades? I thought just one.

They all can but only get 1 attack each

Quote :
Can you use the grenades in the assault even if you didnt charge that turn?

yes



Ok. Thanks count.

This makes things a little better. Laughing
Back to top Go down
Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
Count Adhemar


Posts : 7570
Join date : 2012-04-26
Location : London

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 16:52

Wyches are superb vehicle killers. They are not quite so good against non-vehicles but can still tarpit a unit due to their 4++ save in close combat. Outside of combat, they're made of tissue paper so be very careful!

_________________
What am I missing about Wyches YhBv3Wk
You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. In what world could you possibly beat me?
Back to top Go down
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 16:58

I still have experimenting to do. This was my first DE game.

I do like the ravagers. These seem pretty good.

Still not sure on wracks. They got shot up pretty good while trying to camp an objective. FNP doesnt help when being pelted for 3 turns with ap 2 shots!! lol


Razorwing was really cool. (My opponent had a character that allowed him to control one of my vehicles. We assumed this was a legal target. He used it to kill the rest of one of my kabilite squads and wasted the last 2 of my missles in the process. lol. It was a friendly game so I couldnt do anything but laugh, shake my fist, and drink my opponents beer!! lol)
Back to top Go down
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 16:59

Thanks for all the help everyone.

You guys are killer.
Back to top Go down
MFive
Kabalite Warrior
avatar


Posts : 139
Join date : 2013-01-23
Location : Inside You.

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 18:42

@keeblerpowell wrote:

I had a unit of 9 wyches with Haywires in a venom.

venom only can carry 5 guys, though i think you mean raider

@keeblerpowell wrote:
I do like the ravagers. These seem pretty good.


best range AT we have

@keeblerpowell wrote:
Still not sure on wracks. They got shot up pretty good while trying to camp an objective. FNP doesn't help when being pelted for 3 turns with ap 2 shots!! lol

AP2 shots no not ignore FNP in 6th, only weapons that ID them, they can be decent holding objectives if they are far enough away, and don't forget to go to ground and make that cover save(if any) better as they will not be shooting/charging anyone anyways. although i have found them better at monster hunting in CC(would wound the over-lord on a 4+ as opposed to the wyches 6+)
Back to top Go down
False Son
Sybarite
False Son


Posts : 305
Join date : 2012-12-23

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 19:08

@keeblerpowell wrote:
another couple questions....

How many wyches can throw grenades? I thought just one.

If you take any Wyches with Razorflails, Shard net or Hyrdra Gauntlets, use one of them to throw the grenade. By upgrading to those weapons they lose their Splinter Pistol.
Back to top Go down
shadowseercB
Wych
shadowseercB


Posts : 550
Join date : 2012-10-21

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 19:17

I like to tie up, lets say, terminators till my Incubi get into range or depending on the game type allow my other units to get past them or just allow my other units to focus on other targets. Terminators are nasty and can take up all your focus.

_________________
15,000 Dark Eldar
20,000 Eldar
7,000 Mechanicum
3,500 Harlequin
Back to top Go down
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 20:04

Quote :


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------









keeblerpowell wrote:




I had a unit of 9 wyches with Haywires in a venom.




venom only can carry 5 guys, though i think you mean raider




Quite correct sir.
Back to top Go down
Tony Spectacular
Kabalite Warrior
Tony Spectacular


Posts : 225
Join date : 2012-07-31
Location : Philadelphia

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 20:59

@keeblerpowell wrote:
I couldnt do anything but laugh, shake my fist, and drink my opponents beer!! lol)

cheers

Well played, sir. Well played.
Back to top Go down
Skye26
Hellion
Skye26


Posts : 38
Join date : 2013-01-29

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeTue May 28 2013, 21:20

Also if your looking to expand your army with new units i strongly recommend some reaver jetbikes with upgraded bladvanes, they rock, cause a lot of wounds and move like the wind ^.^

_________________

Like a Star @ heaven Blah blah woof woof! Like a Star @ heaven
Back to top Go down
Panic_Puppet
Wych
avatar


Posts : 506
Join date : 2012-12-30

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeWed May 29 2013, 13:00

Wyches take a while to get to grips with. I went down to throne of skulls a few weeks ago and had a unit of 5 haywire wyches in a venom. Pretty much every practice game I played they were complete and utter fail. Very disappointed, and would have swapped them for another unit if I had one to take. Then on day 1 of the tournament they went through a dreadnought, 5 killa kans and a maulerfiend, and survived every game to boot. Instant convert.

Their best use is in small squads to kill vehicles (60 points nets you 5 girls with haywires, simple suicide squad) - if you want it to do damage in combat then a hekatrix with venom blade is pretty much a must-buy; worthwhile running them 10 strong in a raider, or 9 so you can add a character.

_________________
What am I missing about Wyches TDxlYzL
Back to top Go down
keeblerpowell
Slave
keeblerpowell


Posts : 16
Join date : 2013-05-22
Location : Dayton Ohio

What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitimeWed May 29 2013, 14:05

@Skye26 wrote:
Also if your looking to expand your army with new units i strongly recommend some reaver jetbikes with upgraded bladvanes, they rock, cause a lot of wounds and move like the wind ^.^


Thanks for the recommendation skye. I really wish I liked the models for the jetbikes. I got into DE because I really like the Venom model. I saw that thing and I was like "Damn it!! there goes a weeks pay!!" lol

I just really don't like the jetbike models. I may proxy a few just to see if the effects warrent the purchas of models I dont care for. lol


Or maybe I will models some "counts as" models for the jet bikes.....
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content





What am I missing about Wyches Empty
PostSubject: Re: What am I missing about Wyches   What am I missing about Wyches I_icon_minitime

Back to top Go down
 
What am I missing about Wyches
Back to top 
Page 1 of 2Go to page : 1, 2  Next

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
THE DARK CITY :: 

COMMORRAGH TACTICA

 :: Drukhari Tactics
-
Jump to: