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kevbot66
Slave
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Join date : 2013-05-21

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PostSubject: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeTue May 21 2013, 02:43

So i used to play DE a little back in the 4th edition and haven't played in a while. I was thinking of getting back into it with this army list. Please let me know what you think

HQ: Archon with venom blade and combat drugs (would ride with wyches)-75
Haemonculi with stinger pistol (would ride with true born on raider)- 55

Elites: 2 squads of Trueborn X 4 with 4 blasters in a venom with an additional splinter cannon-173 each
Trueborn X7 with shardbines on a raider with a flicker field -184

Troops: 2 squads of wracks X5 with acothyst, liquefier gun, both riding in venoms with an additional splinter cannon -135

wyches X9 with a hexatrix, hydra gauntlets, riding in a raider (no upgrades)- 170

Heavy: 2X ravagers with night shields (all DLs') -115 each
Razorwing with 2 disintegrators, splinter cannon and a night shield -165

total points: 1495

For tactics I think I would hold my assault squads and blaster born back for a turn or 2 while my ravagers attack their armour and shardborn move just into range to fire. Then, when my razorwing enters, I advance my assault teams and blasterborns and really tear into one side of their forces with the rest of my shooty people helping to thin their squads before everything assaults. Following that, I would sweep across the field and try and out manoeuvre the counter attack. Or something to that effect. Anyways questions, thoughts, concerns?
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Spiney Norman
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Spiney Norman

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeWed May 22 2013, 15:23

Not sure about the trueborn, if its splinter shooting you want you can get that from Warriors without paying for the extra CC attack, you could easily get a full squad of warriors in a raider with special weapons of your choice for the same price as those 7.

Also if you are bringing a haemy to hand out pain tokens, give it to the Wyches, they will get a lot more use out of it. Lastly, drop the stinger pistol and take a Liquifier gun instead, its far more destructive and IMHO the stinger isn't good enough over a splinter pistol to justify its points increase.

Also, having assembled my Razorwing with disintegrators when it first came out (before the flyer rules were published) I now massively regret it, I would definitely give them DLs since they are the only thing you have capable of bringing down an enemy flyer.

I'd also question the value of drugs on the archon, the venom blade is good, but several of the drug results are a bit irrelevant (reroll to wound, increased str) so I wouldn't bother. Also when you talk about "assault teams" do you mean the wracks? Obviously there is a wych squad there, but I don't see any Incubi so how are you proposing to deal with power armour since every character that can take a CC weapon with an ap value seems to have left it behind. In reality there isn't an awful lot a squad of 5 wracks can kill in combat, I mainly use mine for grabbing objectives.

Otherwise you have lots of venoms and 2 DL ravagers so the list is, IMHO, pretty sound.
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Ben_S
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeWed May 22 2013, 15:55

@Spiney Norman wrote:
Lastly, drop the stinger pistol and take a Liquifier gun instead, its far more destructive and IMHO the stinger isn't good enough over a splinter pistol to justify its points increase.

You may be right that a Liquifier is the better option - it's certainly what I was told when I posted a list with a Stinger pistol - but I'm still keen to try the Stinger pistol. Remember, he can replace his CCW and then he can use both pistols.
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Noodle-j
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeWed May 22 2013, 15:58

The Archon would greatly benefit from some defensive upgrades such as the shadow field as T3 and 5+ armour isn't going to stop a whole lot. As he is equipped at the moment a Succubus would serve you better as she would be cheaper with the same upgrades and a built in 4+ invulnerable save in close combat.

I agree with Norman about the haemonculus riding with the wyches, they really would put the first pain token to a lot of good use. Also you can split the haemy from the squad before charging to absorb overwatch fire whilst the wyches keep the pain token.

Blasterborn are well loved here but I've never used them so I wont make a comment.

The shardcarbine trueborn I think suffer greatly from the range of their weapons. Especially if they are the only team out in front at turn 1. Good use of line of sight blocking cover might be able to save them but with only 18" range and only being able to shoot accurately form their raider when moving 6" or less, expect them to die very quickly. Another trueborn variant you might like is 3x trueborn with 2 splinter cannons each in a venom with extra splinter cannon. These guys can pump out 24 poisoned shots at a much safer 36".
Personally I'd go with 10 warriors in a raider with a splinter cannon and splinter racks if points allow it. Lovely lovely troops.

Not sure how much damage 5 wracks can realistically do on their own, but venoms are a good choice. Don't expect each 5 man squad to be winning combats unsupported. Liquifiers can be hilarious watching 2/3+ armour models melt.

As Norman and I have said, wyches will be happier with the haemy's pain token. I'd switch hydra gauntlets to a venom blade on the hekatrix for a little bit more reliability and the potential to really upset someone in a challenge.

Ravagers are cool.

Norman is bang on with the razorwing, dark lances are pretty much essential as dark eldar are woefully under-equipped to deal with fliers.
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kevbot66
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeThu May 23 2013, 03:20

Taking parts of all of your advise, I think ill drop my archon, give the hermy a liquefier gun, drop the disintegrators on my razorwing and possibly it's night shield. I'm not sure if it is worth it, or should it have a FF instead?

Drop the shardborn and replace it with 10 warriors in a raider with a splinter cannon, FF, and splinter racks.

Reduce the wrack squads to 3 per venom, dropping their upgrades, add another 2 of those 3 man squads (so I have 4) for grabbing objectives and getting me some more splinter cannons. And lastly, due to points, down the wych squad to 7 with a hexatix and venom blade. New total would be 1501.

I'm not sure if this list now is too shooting heavy, in the sense that the 1 wych squad and 4 small wrack squads are going to be slaughtered cause of their lack of CC assistance. I mean I would be able to cover them and be able to barrage any enemy squad that wants to shoot em, but is having 1 CC focused squad even worth fielding with this much range? or should I add a bit of CC or just drop the wychs and add more range?
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kevbot66
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeThu May 23 2013, 03:36

Also for convenience purposes, my army would now be:

HQ: Hermy liquefier gun (goes with wyches) -60

Elites: 2X 4 trueborn with 4 blasters on venoms with the additional splinter cannon -173 each

Heavy: razor wing with either FF or nightshield (i'v factored in points for 1) DL -155
2X ravagers using DLs' with night shields -115 each

Troops: 7 wyches with a hexatix using a venom blade, on a raider -145
10 warriors with a splinter cannon on a raider with FF and splinter racks -180
4X 3 wrack on venoms with the additional splinter cannon -95 each

new total is 1496
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Noodle-j
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeThu May 23 2013, 15:27

Looking good.

Supposedly 7 is the optimum number of wyches in a squad for leadership checks anyway. As long as they assault a unit that has previously been shot up a bit they should be ok with 4+ inv and 5+ FnP. Wyches are safest in assault so as long as you can finish a unit off in your opponent's turn, you'll be fighting on your terms with them.

Its a toss up between the flicker and night shields, someone with more experience with fliers could probably give you a definitive answer. Test them both out and see which you prefer.
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Ben_S
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeSat May 25 2013, 12:42

@Noodle-j wrote:
Supposedly 7 is the optimum number of wyches in a squad for leadership checks anyway.

On what basis? Two casualties still represent 25%, but that's true for five as well - and if you go up to nine then you need three casualties.

Is the point simply that you have some ablative wounds before getting down to four models? (Because, if so, it's no reason not to go up to eight or nine.)
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Noodle-j
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PostSubject: Re: 1500 point army   1500 point army I_icon_minitimeSat May 25 2013, 17:47

I'm not entirely sure haha sorry, I just remember reading something about it on a topic on this forum. Something to do with vehicles exploding I think.

All I was trying to say here though is that 7 wyches are still an effective unit.
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