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 Incubi and Blasterborn

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PainReaver
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PainReaver
Sybarite
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PostSubject: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 07 2012, 00:51

I just had a thought about these two units:

Incubi are an excellent retinue for the Archon, and is useful in all situations, save one- fighting Grey Knights, where even a PAGK squad will murder the entire squad and Archon without breaking a sweat. What sort of targets should they be hitting, really?

Blasterborn have a terrifying damage potential with 4 darklight weapons, can rip apart tanks and heavy infantry with aplomb, but with a range of 18" after destroying their target, they will probably receive the end of every bolter/gauss/shuriken/pulse shot the enemy has, and the venoms they're in explode and kill most of the trueborn. How do you keep these guys alive from turn 1 till end?
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Hekatrix
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 07 2012, 02:03

Target saturation, unit placement, thinking ahead and using cover

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Murkglow
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 07 2012, 03:05

While it's true Incubi will get mauled by Nemesis Halberds they still slaughter most other marine units (and most other infantry in general for that matter). Still it's a bit of waste of resources if you just send them to chop up a guardsman squad, you'd much rather send them at Terminators (non-shield ones of course).
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PainReaver
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 07 2012, 03:35

Against Grey Knights I may have to deploy a special list where i take out incubi and throw in more blasterborn (with an archon w/blaster of course).
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Massaen
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 07 2012, 06:25

I will point out that even with halberds, point for point incubi beat grey knights with the exception of purifiers if the incubi charge.

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Archon Bruce
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 07 2012, 20:37

I think Blasterborn have lost their edge in 6th. Better to run a Splinterborn squad and give them haywire. Much cheaper, and much more of a dual threat.
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 00:30

Splinterborn as in 2x Splinter Cannon/Shardcarbine?
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Massaen
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 02:07

I have to disagree. Now, more than ever, blasterborn fill a vital 'hard target' killer role. Terminators, monsters vehicles and when desperate flyers all make excellent targets. Splinterborn limit themselves to models with T values only... And venoms do that better

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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 02:38

I agree on flyers i guess. You can still throw a Hail Haywire though. What are the chances that 4 Blasters will blow up a Landraider? What are the chances that 5 Trueborn with Haywire will wreck a Landraider? The only compelling arguement against is that they are disembarked and more vulnerable to return fire. As far as Trueborn equipping, I get the 2 Splintercannons and just keep the splinter rifles on the others. It keeps them cheap, and rifles let you stay a bit further back and still shoot, if you want to stay within 24" for a few extra shots. If you are charging a vehicle, you wont be shooting rapid fire poison anyways.
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Murkglow
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 03:38

On the other hand Wyches do the suicidal haywire grenade charge cheaper and better while Trueborn should be doing what they're good at, taking alot of special weapons. I also agree with Massaen, Blasters are not simply replaced by massed splinter fire. S8 AP2 Lance is still very useful in its own right to kill high armor targets and the ability to pop vehicles from range still has value. I'm not saying don't go Splinterborn if they are what fits your meta but I don't agree that Blasters lost their edge either.
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Archon Bruce
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 12:18

I guess what I'm trying to say is that Splinterborn with Haywire is more of a dual threat. In an army of highly specialized units, it is nice to have an elite unit that can handle infantry as well as vehicles. Point for point, Splinterborn are more efficient at both roles. I concede that depending on your army composition, you may have a need for Blasterborn. Remember that against infantry in cover, volume of fire will be more effective.
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Massaen
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 12:27

Huh??? Point for point against what???

Your using an elite choice to do what you can access as a transport

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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 08 2012, 14:41

I don't really consider Splinterborn to be all that much of a "dual" threat though. It's really an Anti-Infantry unit that, if you're willing to get them all killed could take out a tank before being turned into red mist. Blasterborn can kill both Infantry (especially with help from their venom) and Vehicles each turn thus I would consider them more of a "dual" threat. Note again i'm not saying Splinterborn are bad but they seem to me to be very much specialized in one enemy type with a desperation option for the other to use when all else fails not balanced between the two.
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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 09 2012, 03:39

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PostSubject: Re: Incubi and Blasterborn   Incubi and Blasterborn I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 12 2012, 02:17

Archon Bruce wrote:
I think Blasterborn have lost their edge in 6th. Better to run a Splinterborn squad and give them haywire. Much cheaper, and much more of a dual threat.

I like the idea for only 2 points per model having access to haywire grenades. However, I run the Duke in 90% of my games and I typically DS the blasterborn in so they cant assault.

If im running them as splinterborn then I keep them far away from any kind of armor, so charging with the grenades or throwing 1 is pointless.
If I run them as blasterborn, well they all have blasters and I try to stay over 12" away from what im shooting at.

I guess it could be some nice redundancy if you stick em on blasterborn and find yourself in charge range and your blasters fizzled out.
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