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 Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators

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Nid Vicious
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PostSubject: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 14:26

I bought a lot of DE when the models came out, I have not attached the weapons to my Raiders or last Ravager. I have 5 Raiders and 2 Raiders total (my third heavy will either be a Talos or a Razorwing). The first Ravager has Dark Lances on it. My gut tells me to put Lances on the 2nd Ravager, but getting all of those nice shots off with Dissies sounds great. Any advice on that would be great.

Also, should I split the weapons on my Raiders? 3 Dark Lances, 2 Disintegrators?

I haven't played 6th Ed yet, I mainly paint and model, but our group has started playing again. I will be facing mainly MEQ, we are starting out at 1500 for now.

Thanks! Very Happy
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Murkglow
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 15:12

Obviously it depends heavily on your list and there are supporters of both but the argument that stands out to me is that you can never have too many Darklight weapons in a DE army. Popping a vehicle that you might not have been able to (or frying a MC/Toughness 4 character) seems to me a better value then the extra two shots. Also if you've got venoms then they already do Anti-infantry pretty well which lessens the need for Disintegrators.

Still I don't think you can go too wrong with either really as long as you're comfortable with your Anti-Tank situation.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 15:24

I know that my opponents are generally more concerned about my dissie ravager than the DL one. The rate of AP2 fire is enough to scare them witless as they tend to run a lot of terminators!

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kenny3760
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 15:49

I would say dark lances.
You really do not want to be wasting a ravager to deal with infantry, that is what venoms are for.
The damage output of a venom with 2 cannons is close enough to a disintegrator ravager as to be not worth bothering about, whereas lances are much better at dealing with armour than the disintegrator is.
As said above, if you face a lot of terminators then disintegrators may be worthwhile, but I find terminator heavy lists usually have a lot of storm shields in them, making the disintegrator a lot less effective.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 15:59

@kenny3760 wrote:
I would say dark lances.
The damage output of a venom with 2 cannons is close enough to a disintegrator ravager as to be not worth bothering about.

Not quite! A dual cannon Venom does 0.66 unsaved wounds against TEQ compared to the 2.66 of a dissie ravager. Granted, you could almost get 2 venoms per ravager but the raveger still does twice as much damage as 2 venoms. For me, I face a lot of terminators and a dissie ravager is the best method of dealing with them. YMMV.

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Nid Vicious
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 16:38

I've got 3 Venoms, all with dual Splinter Cannons. I have 8 Kabalite's w/ Blasters. Just know that for the most part, I'll be seeing lots of Power Armor and Terminators. If I owned 3 Ravagers I would do 2 w/ Lances and 1 w/ Dissies, but it will be a couple of months before I buy anymore models.

I haven't narrowed down a 1500 point list yet, but I've got 30 Wyches, 30 Warriors, 10 Wracks, 5 Grotesque, 5 Incubi, 5 Hellions and 6 Reavers.

HQ wise, I've got 4 Haemies, 1 Archon, Lellith, Sliscuss and a Succubus.
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mug7703
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 16:55

I think the answer can only come from play testing and seeing how your list fares. When I took Dissies on my Raiders in a 1,000point battle I REALLY missed the extra DLs to pop open transports.
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Blind_Baku
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 17:00

In my practice... the most dreaded, first shot at, and loathed contraption we can field, is time and again, the Dissie Ravager. I know the numbers say take the venoms and leave the DLs on board, but the Dissies never seem to fail me, even when I roll horribly for everything else...
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Nomic
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 17:43

With large squads of MEQ being more commen in this edition, I do think having dissies migth be a good idea. On the other hand, the Ravager is the only long range lance I have on board on the first turn, so I think I'll stick with the lances. Venoms can still kill MEQ pretty well due to sheer weight of fire.

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 17:46

Im sticking with dissies, opponents might gamble to think that DLs dont do anything, but noone yet ignored Dissie Ravager.

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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 21:58

I think for mine I'm going to have DL ravagers and use dissies on my raiders as I hate the single roll on raiders only to see it fail... seems like the rate of fire will be more evenly spread with 3 shots off each vehicle but thats just me... I like to have a nice range of things...
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 22:21

Bring one of each. Two of them gives you heaps of flexibilty against every opponent (whether its Mech, TEQ, MEQ, Horde, etc)

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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 02 2012, 23:42

I like the idea of either 3x DL Ravagers and 2 Raiders with Dissies and 2 venoms at 1,500pts.
Or DLs on the Raiders and 1 Dissie Ravager, the other two DL Ravagers.
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Tony Spectacular
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 03 2012, 00:26

I'm also in the Dissie Raider, DL Ravager camp. I feel like this spreads the pain out better. And since Dissies draw fire more than DLs (generally), I'm assured that my DLs will be on the board through turns 2/3 at least. Since I try to drop off the Raider cargo quickly to try to draw fire away from the squad that was onboard (Raiders carry assault units, Venoms carry shooty units), my assault units have a better chance of getting in. And if the Dissies survive for a second or third round of shooting all the better. But I'm guaranteed one Dissie round and two DL rounds at least. Also, if the question I brought up here plays out the way I want it to, then the Dissies get to stay on board to kill for even longer.

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baster
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 06 2012, 11:13

im with the dissi on raider and DL on ravager load out, my raiders have warriors on board and use the racks to increase effectiveness, with the NS i use them to skirt around targets minimising incoming fire whilst obliterating any type of foot type that appears. leave the ravagers to pop tanks and transports with DL, tabled a SW with GK allies sun by turn 3, after takin out transports in turn 1 he had to footslog through a rain of pain.
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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 06 2012, 14:52

dark lance 100%, splinterfire and sometimes blasterfire are good enough AI for me. Also you add in the duality of the dark lance at ID anything T4 or lower, and you have one potent weapon. Ive noticed lately that people running these all foot lists that are all the rave now tend to ignore the DL ravager, until I strip away their IC's bodyguard and ID him with it...

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Hijallo
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 14 2012, 16:58

Killing a character is not-so-big deal, imo. They aren't nearly as tough as units, just 2 or 3 wounds. And dangerous characters tend to be t5 and more, OR having strong invulnerable saves, OR being Eternal Warriors, or all this things in a box.

If you're trying to kill Lysander, dissies would do job better. They inflict slightly more wounds.

single Dissie inflict 1,(3) wounds at T4 model in average. It's ap2, so Lys will be rolling his 3++
approximately 0,(4) wounds from single fussilade.

Lance, however, only inflict 0,186 wounds at this tough guy, and coz he's EW... you've got the point.
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Archon Bruce
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PostSubject: Re: Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators   Ravager: Dark Lances vs. Disintegrators I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 14 2012, 17:32

It would be helpful to see the rest of your list. Additionally, do you see a lot of DK Termies? It should be noted that the only platform that we get cheap Lances on is the Ravager and Raider. That's why I tend to just take the DL on all vehicles. There isn't a 100% answer here though. You should probably playtest the Dissie on a Raider or two.
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