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Hekatrix
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PostSubject: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 04:45

What are some effective ways of keeping our Allied Farseer alive?

I'm thinking that he/she should ride on a jetbike to keep up with our speed. I'm then thinking that the Farseer should join a unit of Reavers. If we give the Reavers (or if they roll it through Combat Drugs) a Pain Token, we're talking 3+ cover followed by FnP, and the Farseer can LoS wounds (like Flamer hits etc) to other bikes. Maybe a squad of 8 bikes....?

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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 07:39

wraithguard/grots...'nough said

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Nomic
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 08:04

A bike Seer should probably run with Reavers or other fast units (a big blob of Hellions would be fine too). A foot Seer should probably stay backfield in a tough unit like Wraithguard or Warlocks (who have may have t3, but all have a 4++ save and can get multiple heavy flamers incase somebody want to charge them). Eldrad might also consider a big Kabalite blob, since with him getting 4 out of 6 powers you have a very good chanse of getting the 4++ save or overwatch with you own bs power, or both. Those make the 20man Warrior blob quite resilient.

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 08:07

I would say 'rangers'.

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:05

I deployed mine in a large squad of warriors on an objective, within 12" of the Pathfinders on another objective, so he could cast on both. Giving a BS4 lance the ability to ignore cover, with re-rolls to hit, is not something your opponent will thank you for! They're not terribly mobile though, so I had to use quite a lot of stuff around them to make sure nothing got too close to them, that's the main problem. I'd have loved the overwatch on ballistic skill power, but it didn't come up for me. I wouldn't have worried so much about them then.

My thinking with putting him in the warriors was that his shooting buffing abilities would be most effective with one of the shootiest squads, and I couldn't see him lasting too long in combat. I decided he needed a large squad too, as holding an objective seemed like the best use of the squad, and I didn't want them taking a couple of casualties and running off the board (I fail leadership tests like it's going out of fashion). So it was a squad of fifteen, with a dark lance and blaster. I contemplated putting a sybarite with agoniser in there, but decided against it, as it just made them too expensive. They were in ruins, and lost two or three in the whole game I think. I was pleased with how they did but I wouldn't expect it to work against a really fast or very aggressive list. Turn one night fight and hammer and anvil deployment also favoured me heavily that game.

If they release a farseer on jetbike model, he goes with the reavers, no question. I don't want to try slicing up a finecast model to make one, so fingers crossed!

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:08

@Chaeril wrote:
I would say 'rangers'.

I would too, or probably Pathfinders for the added AP1 lols. 2+ rerollable cover save is going to take a while to get through until/unless someone gets really close!

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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:20

abfp tau cmd, dsing twin flamer crisis suicide squad, sisters of battle, stuff with crack shot sr. its not all that hard Wink

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:26

Deep striking within template range is pretty tricky so if someone can pull that off then fair enough. I tend to spread out far enough that template weapons rarely get more than 2-3 models. I never play against Sisters so no idea what they can do.

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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:29

does melta/flamer/h.bolter spam mean anything? Very Happy thats what sisters do Very Happy

3 models w tl flamer...i think its good. Especially with pos relay+landing beacon

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:37

As I say, I never fight Sisters so it doesn't crop up. I honestly don't know anyone who plays or who has ever played them!

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 09:42

well, iduno, i would bring one of their HS choices, preferably the Exorcist for s8 ap1 heavy d6 XD or a retributor squad with heavy bolters.
you dont? well now you do, for i have 2k of them XD just dont use them often

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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 15:23

put him on a jetbike and put him in either reavers or GJB

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Cavash
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 15:30

I agree with the Guardian Jetbike idea. I vastly prefer it to the thought of having a Farseer with Rangers/Pathfinders.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 15:47

@Cavash wrote:
I agree with the Guardian Jetbike idea. I vastly prefer it to the thought of having a Farseer with Rangers/Pathfinders.

I don't like GJB. They seem like a poor man's Reaver to me, although they do have the benefit of being scoring. The idea of 10 scoring BS4 snipers sitting in cover with 2+ rerollable cover saves, giving AP1 on any (rerollable) hit roll of 5+, precision on any 6, and rending on any (rerollable) to wound of 6 is absolute gravy. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 15:57

I think I like the GJB idea over our Reavers, simply because I play Reavers super agressive....and I don't plan on playing my Farseer as aggressive......

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 16:53

Adhemar, take in to consideration, that cwe still have a 4th ed dex. Compared to that, they are pretty good.

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeFri Sep 07 2012, 17:30

Adhemar, if that works then I wouldn't drop it, but I like my Eldar to be fast as I run a flying circuss style army. I do see the merits of AP1 snipers of awesomeness but I don't feel that they have a place in my army.

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 08 2012, 08:20

Why is it that every post i make is a giant wall of text? XD


Dark Eldar are a highly mobile army. Jetseers, Jetlocks, and Guardian jetbikes are some of the only units in other codexes that can match our raw speed and mobility, and we have them as battle brothers. Snipers are a stationary target in an army that is otherwise able to outrun assault marines, making the 250+ point marine unit worthless. Unless you really, REALLY need a fortification for something (like to get a quadgun) then skip the snipers and take the GJB's.


Remember, the fact that they are battle brothers and scoring makes "The Relic" missions almost an auto-win. Fortuned jetbikes will move 12 inches forward and grab that objective, shoot at any nearby enemy unit trying to nab the relic for themselves, and then 2d6 assault move (to a maximum of 6 inches due to the rules for carrying the relic) back towards your deployment zone. And tell your opponent to pray to his god emperor if hes going to try and shoot down T4 3+ rerollable save bikes with anything other then long-range anti-tank weaponry (which means that the anti-tank weaponry shooting at your bikes ISNT SHOOTING AT YOUR RAIDERS. Remember, the only weakness of raiders is getting shot.)

My basic loadout:

Farseer w/ Jetbike, Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing, Doom, Fortune

3 Guardian Jetbikes w/ 1 Shuriken Cannon

1 Warlock w/ Jetbike and Embolden


Totals at 311 points. A little expensive, but nothing too unmanageable in a game higher then 1500 points. And its significantly cheaper then taking a jetbike seer council. You can always add 3 more jetbikes and another shuriken cannon to the squad to make it beefier and more threatening for another 76 points if you feel that 5 models isnt enough.



This unit is cable of moving across the board to capture objectives at the end of the game,and is able to debuff enemy units with doom (People debate whether guide and fortune can effect dark eldar units since the craftworld codex specifically states "Eldar" units, but Doom makes no such distinction and as such is GUARANTEED to work. Your opponent cant make you D6 it to see if it counts as legal). While the units Dooms stuff, its darting out from behind buildings, shooting its shuriken cannon at anything close by (light vehicles and infantry), and then 2d6 moving back behind the building so the enemy cant return fire. The psychic tests are on a rerollable leadership 10 (leadership test is 3d6 discard the highest) due to the embolden warlock in the group and runes of witnessing, and ghosthelm means that you nullify perils on a 3+ still. So this is probably the most stable psyker unit in the whole game in terms of making sure your powers go off, and you dont take wounds from perils. Also, RUNES OF WARDING. Enemy has a Mephiston or a bunch of zoanthropes and tervigons? Or greyknights with hammerhand? TROLLFACE ENGAGE. (:<


And if the GJB and the warlock die? Just have your farseer join a squad of reavers (since the eldar jetbikes rule counts for both craftworlders AND dark eldar). You lose some Psychic stability and fortune might not work on the reavers, but you can keep Dooming enemy units and the Jetseer doesn't interfere with bladevanes.


The synergy between the jetseer, GJB's and RJB's is so amazingly good that unless your playing a super low points game, you would have to be insane (or a hardcore fluff player) not to include a jetseer, GJB's, and at least 1 squad of reavers in your army. Remember, scoring units and the warlord are the two most important types of units in the game since they are ultimately the ones that descide the victory point count at the end (in every mission but kill points, which is rare now). Do you want a unit that can ONLY capture an objective next to where they deploy (snipers), or do you want a unit that can capture an objective ANYWHERE due to their high mobility (GJB's)? The choice is yours.
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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 08 2012, 09:14

ever heard of s10 ap1 large blast ignore cover shots? IG has'em.
fortune: you do it on the farseer, and the whole squad gets it. You cant CAST it on a non eldar unite, but the effects still go for them to, for the "whole squad" gets to reroll Wink

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 08 2012, 09:33

Except if the farseer is in a DE unit he can't cast on himself...

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 08 2012, 09:41

I appreciate all the good tactical reasons why the GJB are excellent choices but the facts are that in my meta the snipers are a better option as GJB can and will be shot off the table with ease. If I can do it to a squad of T6 Nurgle Bikers then I can damn sure do it to a squad of T4 GJBs! Then there's the fact that I simply do not like GJB models. They look awful, especially when placed next to the gorgeous Reavers.

I also like to use allies to plug gaps in my army. I don't really have any scoring units that can sit on an objective in the backfield all game whilst still contributing something offensively. The Pathfinders provide exactly that and they also seem to act as an almost irresistible magnet to my opponents who, after losing an entire Terminator Squad to sniper fire, feel the need to exact revenge, which draws fire from my other elements.

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 08 2012, 09:43

yup, forgot that...well then fortune seers arent the way to go then...well, unless you go with a sustainable enough unite of eldar...like wraithlords ^^ or jetseer council

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeSat Sep 08 2012, 12:46

Thanks for your insight Smile

@grandlordzero wrote:
People debate whether guide and fortune can effect dark eldar units since the craftworld codex specifically states "Eldar" units

Debate over, FAQ'd no

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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeMon Sep 10 2012, 07:39

The first and easiest way to guard an allied farseer is to take a farseer who doesn't need much guarding. Eldrad says hi! And his four rolls on the Divination table often are the difference between victory and defeat. Not only does Eldrad afford you the ability to give Prescience to two different units (including those oh-so-critical Venoms and Ravagers) he can also Misfortune up to two units a turn, which makes killing those pesky Paladins a breeze!

While thematic lists are fine and dandy, the best way to protect your farseer is to put him in with a large squad of footsloggers that are going to carve up everything near them. Preferably, this is an extra-large helping of Warriors or Similar shooters--Dire Avengers can also do in a pinch. Keep him away from (or at least comfortably screened behind) any assault elements of your army to prevent your opponents from wrapping him up out of his element. Prescience is critical for any allied detachment that relies on hitting things. So for most players, it is FAR BETTER TO TRADE YOUR POWERS FOR ROLLS ON THE DIVINATION TABLE. Not only do you get a chance at a number of excellent options, but there are some real stinkers for many matchups that are easy candidates for trade.

As for biker Seers, all I can say is: When was the last time *you* had trouble killing three Space Marines from a single unit in one turn? A false sense of security and constant need to move towards danger means that your average Biker Farseer is not long for this current plane of existence.
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PostSubject: Re: Escorting our Allied Farseer   Escorting our Allied Farseer I_icon_minitimeMon Sep 10 2012, 08:27

I agree. Eldrad especially, due to getting 4 rolls, has a good chanse of giving the Warrior/DA blob eighter the power that gives them 4++ saves or ability to overwatch at their own bs. And nothing aside from Terminators wants to charge 20 Warriors overwatching you at bs4 (especially since with PGL they lose any bonus attacks, and while Warriors are only s3, 20 guys hitting the already depleted group before they hit will probably lower their number further).

Wraithgurad would also be a good choise (although expensive, points and model wise). They have powerful, if short-ranged, guns and high enough toughness to make them extremely durable.

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