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Captain Mayhem
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The Strange Dude
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PostSubject: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 16:31

Ok so the new venom model is out (very nice it is to!) but what units are we considering it will carry?

1st lets assume everyone is going to buy the extra splintercannon (cause why wouldn't you??).


Kabalite warriors - 5 w/blaster in venom 125pts - this is already the standard troop unit for net venomspam lists. Not a bad little unit but is there better?

Wyches 5 w/haywires hekatrix w/agoniser in venom 155pts - Don't think this is gonna be seen that much as 5 is too few wyches but in smaller games may actually be a good unit.

Wracks (via haemie HQ) - 3 in venom 95pts - the cheapest way to get a venom on the table. At first glance not much use other than objective sitting. However if you start an IC with them and detach them first turn to join another unit it's a cheap way to get a pain token early.

Wracks 5 w/liquifier in venom 125pts - an interesting and quite resilliant unit same price as the kabalite venom unit and liquifiers are feared for a reason.

Wracks 3 w/athocyst and hex rifle in venom 120pts - Hex rifles are both sniper weapons and assault weapons with the same raange as a splinter cannon making this unit usefull if your expecting MC's turning stuff into glass statues is fun.

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Ecophagy
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 17:15

I think putting 5 Incbui in a Venom seems like a really fast and deadly unit.
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Saintspirit
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 17:31

I am gonna put four incubi and either my archon or drazhar in a (very pimped) venom, think it could work well as a striker unit.

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shamroll wrote:
Dang! I was hoping Tyranids followed the Pokemon naming idea. A big Carnifex running around just yelling "Carnifex! Carni-Carnifex!" followed by a squad of termagants all saying "Termagant" to each other.
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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 17:50

If You may say that 5 Clowns in stolen (from Wracks for example) Venom is Venom unit...

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Venkh
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 20:23

Does the shadowseers shrouding power work when he is in a vehicle?

That could be interesting, especially when twinned with a nasty CC unit or character.
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vharing
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 21:09

Saintspirit wrote:
I am gonna put four incubi and either my archon or drazhar in a (very pimped) venom, think it could work well as a striker unit.

Tried it in my last game. Be careful what you go after, I tried to kill Vulcan and 5 assault termis. I did 2 wounds to Vulcan with Drazhar and killed one termi with an Incubi and then got pasted with thunder hammers. THe vemon went on to kill to more and some other modals later on.
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 21:21

Venkh wrote:
Does the shadowseers shrouding power work when he is in a vehicle?

That could be interesting, especially when twinned with a nasty CC unit or character.

Sadly, no. It works only for them + ICs

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Saintspirit
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 21:21

vharing wrote:
Saintspirit wrote:
I am gonna put four incubi and either my archon or drazhar in a (very pimped) venom, think it could work well as a striker unit.
Tried it in my last game. Be careful what you go after, I tried to kill Vulcan and 5 assault termis. I did 2 wounds to Vulcan with Drazhar and killed one termi with an Incubi and then got pasted with thunder hammers. THe vemon went on to kill to more and some other modals later on.
I'll keep that in mind.

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shamroll wrote:
Dang! I was hoping Tyranids followed the Pokemon naming idea. A big Carnifex running around just yelling "Carnifex! Carni-Carnifex!" followed by a squad of termagants all saying "Termagant" to each other.
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Sky Serpent
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 21:33

I'm really intrigued as to what five Wyches with Haywires could do, surely they have more staying power and anti tank than 5 Kabalites?

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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 22:02

I could even go further - with Shardnet Bloodbrides. More attacks for You, less for enemy, kinda work like 8 or so Wytches

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 13 2011, 19:57

I think a pretty all around unit would be......Venom w/ 2x Splinter Cannon (duh!)

Kabalite Trueborn (5)
2 x Splinter Cannon
2 x Shard Carbine
1 Dracon w/ Splinter Pistol and Venom Blade
Haywire Grenades

Thats....
20 (4+ poison) shots @ 36"
26 (4+ poison) shots @ 18"
17 attacks on the charge (5 Attks wound on 2+) - prefer not to get into HtH with fresh units
5 Haywire attacks vs. vehicles


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Raneth
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 13 2011, 20:07

I suppose this is the right place to ask my question:

5 Trueborn, 3 carbines and 2 cannons in a nekkid Venom cost 150pt.
5 Scourges, 2 with cannon cost 130pt.

Which would you rather have? I'm leaning towards the Trueborn squad.
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 13 2011, 21:31

Raneth wrote:
I suppose this is the right place to ask my question:

5 Trueborn, 3 carbines and 2 cannons in a nekkid Venom cost 150pt.
5 Scourges, 2 with cannon cost 130pt.

Which would you rather have? I'm leaning towards the Trueborn squad.

Well I guess based on my previous post my answer might seem a bit slanted....I'd vote Trueborn in a nekkid Venom. More shots at longer range (i.e. 36", 14 vs 8 ), more HtH attacks (if needed) option for a cheap 10pt upgrade to 5 attacks wounding on 2s on the charge, better Leadership, ability to buy haywire.

Now to be fair you could spend the extra 20 points on the Scourges to get the upgraded squad leader giving them LD9 and something special.
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 13 2011, 21:39

Raneth wrote:
I suppose this is the right place to ask my question:

5 Trueborn, 3 carbines and 2 cannons in a nekkid Venom cost 150pt.
5 Scourges, 2 with cannon cost 130pt.

Which would you rather have? I'm leaning towards the Trueborn squad.
Could you explain your reasoning more?

To me, the naked Venom is cool, but the Scourges are cheaper, with better armor, and mobility that isn't dependent on an exceptionally fragile vehicle. All that and the Scourges are a Fast Attack slot(one I tend not to fill) and Trueborn would take up an Elite slot that is spoiled for choices that fill a role no other unit can.

If you were going for a more multi-capable unit like Fletch describes above, than you're talking about two different roles(Plasma Grenades or no, combat is not where Scourges should be). But just drowning the enemy in Poisoned Shots? Scourges seem the better choice.

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 13 2011, 22:01

@ Spanna:

I was thinking of Scourges first, for the reasons you listed. Then I reckoned I could bring a couple extra Splinter Cannons to the party for 20, 30 points more. And I REALLY like Splinter Cannons!

Though, Fast Attack deserves more love! Especially Razorwing Flocks. But that's probably for another thread. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 04:53

for 200 points, I can run a dual splintercannon nightshielded venom with a load of trueborn. Three blasters and two splintercannons just make things drop dead.
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 17:36

I have been running 5 warriors with a shredder in a venom with Dual SC & Night Sheilds.

it costs a little more, but it has frustrated the heck out of my opponents. They are often out of range for rapid fire and melta.

The shredder, love it or hate it, is usually good for 3 or 4 wounds. Pile it into a marine unit if a blown up rhino or horde bugs and it is down right brutal.

The venom with NS becomes a relatively safe delivery system so I can bring all my firepower to bear on bunched up units.

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Raneth
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 18:58

GAR wrote:
The venom with NS becomes a relatively safe delivery system

It should be; it costs more than its cargo! Nasty little package, though Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 19:02

Har har... And unlike Blaster squad, it's not "must kill" nasty lil' bugger.

How about Shiled & Cannon, with 2 Dark Lances and 3 Shard Carabines inside?

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 19:03

Indeed, I played a game with a bug player last week and the night sheilds drove him nuts. None of his termaguants could get a shot off. Complete denial of his short range shoting.

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 19:09

How about Venom with Retrofire Jets, 2 SC and 4 Shredder Trueborns? That should flush most units like Devastators...

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 19:10

Local_Ork wrote:
Har har... And unlike Blaster squad, it's not "must kill" nasty lil' bugger.

true that. Unlike the Trueblasters, which will quickly draw heavy weapon fire, the shredder warrior squad is usually going to stick around for a while since most other things "seem" to be a bigger threat.

I like the NS on venoms, I think it is the missing ingredient for a tactically flexible support option.

More on the orignal post

I'm not sold on Wyches in Venoms, but I think blood brides could be possible.

Wracks are alright, but I would rather them in a raider. I would want to have the At DL shot.

But I do love the shredder warriors on a venom, that really is a cheap effective unit.


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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 19:13

Local_Ork wrote:
How about Venom with Retrofire Jets, 2 SC and 4 Shredder Trueborns? That should flush most units like Devastators...

For trueborn I would go with Shardcarbines. You don't have to deepstrike as close and you have much greater range.

I know from using my Thunderfire cannons though that the 4 blast templates are just wrong.

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 14 2011, 19:20

GAR wrote:

I'm not sold on Wyches in Venoms, but I think blood brides could be possible.

But I do love the shredder warriors on a venom, that really is a cheap effective unit.

+1
and
+1

They should have same number of attacks as ~7-8 Wytches and Shardnet to limit enemy attacks, so that ballace.
and
I've build army around Shredder-lites. Need to find AT elsewhere tho (nothing hard actually). If enemy DON'T get close, he's Venom units I want to try Bleep
If he DO get close, he is pretty much Venom units I want to try Bleep too.

GAR wrote:
I know from using my Thunderfire cannons though that the 4 blast templates are just wrong.

How about 6 S6 AP4 templates, followed by 9 Power Klaw hits?
My killa Kans love to toy with Spammed Meat...


Venom units I want to try Bleep emoticon came from Da Waaagh forum. <3 it, since it's Orky.

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PostSubject: Re: Venom units I want to try   Venom units I want to try I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 15 2011, 07:46

Local_Ork wrote:
How about Venom with Retrofire Jets, 2 SC and 4 Shredder Trueborns? That should flush most units like Devastators...
I don't have the wording on the Retrofire Jets here, but "normal" Deep Strike is att cruising speed so passengers may not fire and I don't think they may disembark either.

The Duke's ability to let you DS also lets you disembark (I think)
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