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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 18 2012, 15:40

I wouldn't mind using Eldar for all the aforementioned benefits.

I was also thinking about using CSM with the current codex.

1 Daemon Prince w/ Wings, MoN (Use the BRB Powers maybe pyro)
1 x 5 Noise Marine w/ Blastermaster in Rhino
1 x 3 Obliterators
1 x 5 Chaos Terminators w/ 3x PF and 2x PW or 2x LC(Dual or Single), MoN or MoT (Optional Squad)

I know you have to take One Eye Open (OEO) test, but smart deployment and movement should prevent your units from being 6" from each other. Only other negative is see is the Noise Marines won't be able to score, and all the allies can't deny.

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Skulnbonz
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 18 2012, 19:44

The swooping hawk exarch and our hellions caught my eye a bit... the fearless is a great boon. A large (15-20) man hellion unit with this guy is a beast of a problem for a lot of opponents!

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Starstrider
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 18 2012, 20:01

A swooping hawk exarch making a unit fearless? Never heard about that one in all my time of playing Eldar, unless you mean the Phoenix Lord Baharroth?

Yes, like all Phoenix Lords, Baharroth has Fearless and can confer that to a unit in 6th ed that is not his Aspect but all Phoenix Lords generally work better in a squad of their own Aspect (although that can be debated with Maugan Ra) as some of their rules are wasted if not with such a squad.

Also, although Phoenix Lords generally have gone from very overpriced and pretty bad to actually quite decent, Baharroth is usually considered the worst Phoenix Lord and, imo, rightly so. Of course, that was partly down to Swooping Hawks being rather bad last edition whereas they're ok now so Baharroth may have also improved. 200pts is a lot though simply to give a unit of Hellions Fearless, a large blast if they deep strike, a boost in close combat and some limited anti-tank capabilities. I guess he could also be used to take incoming shots but for his points cost, you could get another unit of Hellions.

Phoenix Lords are a lot better but still slightly overpriced and work best with their own Aspect Warriors.
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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeWed Jul 18 2012, 22:36

we dont have shining spears and warp spider PLs Razz

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HERO
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 02:16

@Ruke wrote:
How did you set them up? put the 'seer on a bike and keep him hidden behind the raider?

Yes, with another Raider in the front of that. Cascading cover under the cover of night + good angle on the approach = really hard to deal with.

As for FW Eldar allies, there are some really good options in there.

Troop War Walkers w/ 2x Shuriken Cannons
Corsair Prince for Night Fighting on any given turn
Warp Hunter is a fantastic Heavy slot choice
and of course, the CWE's Jetseer w/ 3x scoring Jetbikes for <200 points.

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Ruke
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 08:02

About corsairs, are they tournament legal? Can you use a corsair army in a game without IA?

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 09:06

A lot of people are suggesting small units of Guardian Jetbikes but I seem to be missing the point of this. What is so good about them?

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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 09:07

22 pts, t4, 3+ armor, jb movement, scoring

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 09:10

@Enfernux wrote:
22 pts, t4, 3+ armor, jb movement, scoring

Maybe my meta is a bit different to some others here but in our games a small unit of those would be blown off the table as soon as it got anywhere near the enemy.

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Nomic
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 14:07

They can do ok by hanging at the back, shooting at things with the shuriken cannon and ducking behind terrain with the assault move, then turboboosting to an objective on the last turn. They're ultimately pretty fragile, tho (even if tough by Eldar standards), but as they won't really contribute much to the game except last turn objective grab, they're pretty low on target priority. If you have about 100 points left and want another troop unit, you could do worse.

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Eldur
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 14:45

I had the idea of a Soulstorm Dark Eldar themed army using IG as a slave-allied army. The psychic powers would represent the Soul powers available for the army.

HQ: Soul-fueled Uber Haemonculus (counts as Primaris Psyker with Pyromancy or Telekinesis)

Troops: Old Mandrakes!! .. like those from the game..(counts as Penal Legion haha!!)

Elite: Tortured slaves (counts as Combat Psyker squad)

And fortifications..

Tower of Loathing (counts as quad gun in Aegis defence line)

or

Slave chambers (counts as Bastions)


hell yeah!!! I will do it!!

Also, I already have an Eldar army (which was my main army ), and I will do A LOT of different combinations for armies (specially DE allies for them).

Double post merged. Please use the 'Edit' function, thanks - Cavash.


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Starstrider
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeThu Jul 19 2012, 15:50

Eldar Guardian Jetbikes are actually quite useful for The Relic mission as it states you can only move up to 6" with it in a single phase, not turn. Therefore, you could grab it in the movement phase, shoot in the shooting phase at anyone trying to grab it off you, then use the assault move to put some distance between them and enemy units, heading for the relative safety of your deployment zone. Obviously you'd want a decent sized unit for this (or two) and make sure to give them plenty of support so they don't get blown off the board.

And, as has already been mentioned, they're rather useful for jump-shoot-jumping from behind cover with shuriken cannons and are just as fast as our Reavers, making them great last turn objective grabbers.
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succorax
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 21 2012, 20:48

guys ive skimmed over this discussion and ive been reading my m8s eldar codex back to forth to work out the chinks and the sweet treasure. first thing he said after i said can i look for allies he simple said platforms dire avengers and either eldrad or a farseer.... i corrected his avengers with pathfinders cause that is the only thing my army is lacking and the others sound sooo much fun for the De to use in 6th ed. my only problem is this.

if you read the page on warlords ( pg 111 if i recall correct sorry if im wrong and correct it please) but it says the highest leadership hq choice will become your warlord. now my list encompases sliscus and maybe lelith cause she says nope to saves.... hello termis. and Eldrad is leadership 10 whom i will propabbly take. i havent seen anything that states my warlord cannot be an ally. Can you and if not does this mean i need to take a cheap archon instead to take eldrad? please reply with your thoughs and comments.

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 21 2012, 20:56

@succorax wrote:
I havent seen anything that states my warlord cannot be an ally. Can you and if not does this mean i need to take a cheap archon instead to take eldrad? please reply with your thoughs and comments.

"Furthermore your warlord must be chosen from your primary detachment" - BRB page 109

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Enfernux
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 21 2012, 23:47

@succorax i wouldnt use eldrad to much, for in 4th ed it was written, that he would..."die"...so to speak. If you get used to him and then bam, hes out, its hard to use bad gear, once you get the hang of the good, but on the reverse, the effect is to Smile
anyway, overpowerdrad has no fleet Razz no jetbike
pathfinders mmm...well...not bad.

sry bout the attitude for the idea, but i just got to used to fast models, mobility, speed and mayhem that i just cant imagine a space-elf without fleet, or for that reason, not being able to disembark and assault the same turn Very Happy

if you really want to surprise your opponent, try stormguardians with a destro lock from a serpent...3 flamer templates are nothing to bad i think Smile
or meltas and a singing spear against vehicles, its your call.

hmm...idea: how bout a doomseer with the stormguards and a lock. Doomed targets can get eradicated very fast Very Happy

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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 22 2012, 07:24

eldrad is sweet, except if you want a biker farseer, which personally I prefer the extra movement. its not like you can cast two fortunes a turn anyway on your DE units, pretty much the only reason to get Eldrad

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 22 2012, 11:30

You cant cast Fortune at all with Eldrad on DE units, if i understand rules right.
Only new fancy Divination stuff.

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succorax
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 22 2012, 11:48

@Azdrubael wrote:
You cant cast Fortune at all with Eldrad on DE units, if i understand rules right.
Only new fancy Divination stuff.

umm you can as eldar and dark eldar are battle brothers... meaning they can cast beneficial pysker powers on each other.

i personally dont own a serpent or any eldar vechiles so im atm limited by that to what i use as i have a game on monday and if u want i can post my list

this is a try out 6th list so its not toooo competetive

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Lord Clazaryn
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 22 2012, 12:09

This debate has already been waged however l'll repeat. The wording of fortune says that it only applies to Eldar units so some say that it doesn't work on Dark Eldar because they are not Eldar but Dark Eldar. The contrary is that Dark Eldar are still the same race and could then be called Eldar. What backs that up is that the Space Marine faqs all changed theirs to Codex: Space Marines when talking about psychic powers but the Eldar faqs did not do this indicating that Gw meant it to be this way. I think it can be read either way...

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 22 2012, 12:19

That debate has nothing to do with background and races.
Eldar codex does not state that its psychic power can be used on members of eldar race, it states that some powers can be used on "Eldar Units". Eldar Units can only be found in Eldar Codex, and not anywhere else.

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Lord Clazaryn
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeSun Jul 22 2012, 12:33

I'm not really sure I'm qualified to argue this point as I don't have the Eldar Codex, I was just repeating what I had heard other people say. But your probably right, GW has been horribly lazy with the Eldar faqs, especially with the Harlequin stuff up so it's probably an oversight that they didn't word it that way....

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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 23 2012, 14:16

I know that, my arguement is what is the point of taking eldrad unless you really need that 2 fortunes a turn?

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mukslinger
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 23 2012, 15:30

In regards to furtune: can the farseer target himself, an eldar unit, therefore giving himself and the unit he is attached to fortune?

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Starstrider
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 23 2012, 16:16

Indeed you can. So, you could have the Farseer and the Archon join a unit such as Wyches or Incubi, have the Farseer cast Fortune on him/herself and confer Fortune to the entire unit, allowing the Archon to benefit from it.
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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: Dark Eldar and Allies   Dark Eldar and Allies - Page 4 I_icon_minitimeMon Jul 23 2012, 16:57

You can. But you cant cast it on model basis if i understand it correct, only on units.

SO the only way of doing this will be to cast fortune on Farseer while he isnt part of the unit, then join the unit.

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