Greetings and welcome to Battle 13 of Old vs. New.
Asdrubael Vect since the early days of the codex (even before we were allowed vehicle upgrades) there has always been one dude, the original space pimp (check yo'self Calgar) who rode into battle atop his mystical pimp ship and pimp slapped all the other races while snickering 'just as planned' under his breath.
Asdrubael went through some...drastic changes in the new codex, and that really makes me wonder. Who is the better Space pimp? Is it the hyper Raider with fully kitted bodyguard? Or is it the odd skimmer/fast/walker/wtf-are-the-rules-for-this-thing? mo'fo original?
Let's find out!Slot and Cost
As usual, the first basic question is - did they change the cost of the model, and is the model still in the same slot of the codex?
Both Old and New are HQ options, as well Vect should be.
Now, Old came in at 277 points.
Not to be outdone, New costs 240...on foot, he comes out to 440 with his ride, and that's not even counting the obligatory crew who has to join him.
The 440 versus 277 is really a no brainer. I guess we could talk about just the 240 versus 277...but if we did that, I *really* wouldn't like Vect's chances when they started fighting.Advantage? - Old!Stats
This should be an easy one to compare. Did they take away or add to the stat line?
Now, this will be an odd one to look at because...well, Old Vect was...not a NORMAL sort of model. You see, he was a fast open topped skimmer that could assault like a Walker and was treated like a Walker in h2h combat. (yeah, I know, awesome and wtf in equal amounts, right there)
|WS ||BS ||S ||Front ||Side ||Rear ||I ||A ||Sv |
|6 ||6 ||4 ||14/11 ||14/11 ||14/10 ||7 ||5 ||- |
|WS ||BS ||S ||T ||W ||I ||A ||Ld ||Sv |
|8 ||8 ||3 ||3 ||4 ||8 ||5 ||10 ||4+ |
Okay, so let me clarify that in shooting the Old Vect was AV 14, but in assault it was AV 11.
So how do we compare these two things?
Well, obviously new has the advantage of better WS and Init (though not much matters between a 7 and an 8 in init).
Old has the advantage of no fear of insta-death and also being a vehicle so no morale or leadership shenanigans ever (and, indeed, would be immune to a lot of that stuff straight up...like, y'know, force weapons insta-killing the eternal lord of the Dark City like a chump.)
They both have equal attacks, and the Str advantage on Old really doesn't matter due to Vect's wargear (though I suppose theoretically it is an advantage in certain odd situations). Um...yeah, the BS of 6 on Old, though less than new, mattered more because it was a BS 6 *Ravager* (who wouldn't kill for that?)
Yeah, I don't even really know how to compare them other than that.Advantage? - Tie!Wargear
What good are stats without awesome weapons to use them with? New
New Vect almost comes with so much wargear and tools that it's easy to forget some of them. Let's try to sort this all out.
Dais - for 200 points he gets the Dais, and that's an okay little upgrade as it's an AV 13 (because 14 was OP, natch) Raider...though overall less customized than any other Raider out there. Meh. Still, a 3 lance Raider is nothing to sneeze at.
Orbs - he has janky little blast templates that wound on leadership in a way assured to annoy your opponent as you muddle out what the rolls need to be
Scepter - he has a power weapon that wounds on 3+
Shadowfield - 2++ saves? Yes, please!
Also, Haywire grenades, a splinter pistol, Ghostplate armor (because he'll still be alive after the first failed Shadowfield roll...) has preferred enemy on everything and can seize initiative on a 4+ (also has all the usual DE powers of Fleet, Power from Pain, Nightfighting, ect. ect. ect.)
Not too damn shabby.Old
Old keeps it simple because its basic rules are complicated enough.
AV14 all around from shooting.
A Dark Lance and 2 Dissies (the good plasma cannon Dissies) all at BS 6 so your opponent will weep.
And all its attacks are power weapons and it will be AV 11 in h2h combat making it pretty much assured death for any unit not packing a power fist or grenades and some luck.
Also, all the advantages (moving flat out) and disadvantages (1 lascannon hit can equal death!) of a fast, skimmer, vehicle.
This is not an easy one because, again, this is kind of an apples and oranges sort of deal. Still, at the core, I think New Vect brings more to the table.Advantage? - New!Face to Face in Battle!
This is not an easy matchup to do. Shooting at each other from their Dais the Old Vect is harder to hurt, the new Vect is better able to cause hurt. Both are stuck to moving 6" and shooting since New Vect lacks Aerial Assault and Old Vect will want to use full power Dissies (Str 7 versus AV 13? yes, yes we shall).
I'd probably say the advantage there goes to New Vect as his ride is the one equipped to kill vehicles and the Dark Lance treats AV 14 and 13 the same.
In assault it's kind of the other way around - New Vect is *not* built to handle a Walker, even an AV 11 Walker, in combat. He would sit there wuss slapping with his Haywire grenade and hoping, while Old Vect swung away with 5 power weapon attacks a turn, hoping to pop the Shadowfield and skrag the young punk.
I'd say Old will win that one more often than not.Advantage? - Tie!
So that's my breakdown.
What do we have from this though? Face to face this was NOT an easy comparison. New Vect is probably an overall better army multiplier...but has a distinct disadvantage of sucking up 500+ points to field in all his glory. Old was actually a rather incredible (if expensive still) Ravager that also had assault capability in a pinch.
Now, Old Vect saw play a lot in higher point games, and was usually dropped in as an extra Ravager and played as such (and it worked great like that, again - BS 6, AV 14 Ravager, it was amazing)
New clearly sees more play, but almost totally as a foot unit joined to something where he serves as a beatstick.
So, i think my real call would be;
Better Dais? - Old.
Better Vect? - New.
Also, you do see Vect fielded more often now, and that has to count for something.
That's my call - what's yours?