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Sky Serpent
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PostSubject: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 01:57

Or what some people may call cheating within the rules. What tactics have you discovered that shouldn't necessarily work? I'm not asking people to discuss power gaming rules lawyering, more like ideas that are slightly cheeky and verging on ingenius.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 02:00

Having whole turn and not counting as moved when your ride explode during tank shock. Yes, in Poland it's 100% legal.

Note that you die when Your transport get wasted and You did move over 12".



WWP blocking (it's 3" impassible circle). There was gimmick called WWP-warpgate (wipe out enemy under WWP due to beeing impass) but it was FAQued.

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Torpedo Vegas
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 02:12

Flat Out! 24" First Turn Ramming into Assaults. On turn one.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 03:27

Well I have used a Webway Portal to prevent some Assault Terminators from charging me. I had forgotten I had bought the upgrade until turn 4. Threw down the Portal and the route required to go around the portal caused them to be exactly 7" away at the end of their movement phase Very Happy.

Also, Ramming only really works with Wave Serpents due to them being more durable. If you ram with a Raider, you are probably going to die, and by extent, anyone inside will die to. You both will be taking a str 9 hit at the minimum, str 10 on average. Raiders cant survive that >.<. You can suicide Ram, but I don't suggest turn 1

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 03:32

The point of suicide ramming is to exploit a loophole. If the vehicle explodes they can disembark, and then assault. Pack a punch of wyches in a bunch of cheap o raiders and hurl them at the nearest vehicle. Hopefully they'll both pop and you can now assault, or do it near a foot slogging unit and assault them. You'll lose some wyches but it can work if you need to tie something up (Hydras I'm looking at you) turn one.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 05:46

@Rangrok1k wrote:
You both will be taking a str 9 hit at the minimum, str 10 on average. Raiders cant survive that >.<. You can suicide Ram, but I don't suggest turn 1

Ohhhhh... they can. Prow give You d3 front armour (Ramming is type of TS) and You also may pick 5++ inv save (yes, inv save. Which (nearly) always apply.) So actually You have bigger chance than Chimera, Rhino etc.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 07:04

@Torpedo Vegas wrote:
The point of suicide ramming is to exploit a loophole.

Except that you need to go Flat Out to do so, and by the latest BRB FAQ getting your ride destroyed in the same player turn as going Flat Out means EVERYONE in the transport is automatically killed.

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Torpedo Vegas
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 07:08

I thought that it was only destroyed if you immobilized it in your turn. Like if I flat out ram-> immobilized Then everyone dies but if I Flat Out ram ->Wrecked or Explodes they bail out. Unless I'm misinterpreting it.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 07:16

Q: If a transport vehicle is destroyed in the same turn as it
moved flat out what happens to any embarked models? (p70)
A: They are removed as casualties.


That would end the lives of lots of Wyches.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 07:19

Well then the Wych Suicide Ram technique is out the window, thanks for clearing it up.

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The Strange Dude
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 07:41

Surrounding vehicles for fun and profit!

When charging a transport vehicle (usually with haywire grenades)I'll often charge it with additional units that have no way of hurting the target just to surround it completely. This has 2 benefits if you stun it then the unit inside is neutralised for a turn; and if you can wreck the vehicle then all those embarked are destroyed (vehicle wreck rules state you disembark and only then does the vehicle become a wreck - so no disembarking onto the top of it). Oh and yes occasionaly I'll explode the vehicle I'm attacking (though statistcally it is far more likely you will wreck it with haywires by ripping off all the weapons and immobilising it then getting another immobilise or weapon destroyed hit) and yues it does hurt but the reward outweighs the risk I've killed BA butt squads, Cannoness and retinue, Termies and guard with this tactic.

The final bonus to this is you force your opponent to act he has to take action against the squads surrounding the vehicle which takes fire away from your other units.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 04 2011, 08:31

@The Strange Dude wrote:
lots of words of wisdom

That's exactly what I do as well. And opponents REALLY hate it when they lose Belial + Chaplain + Terminators, or a whole bunch of Orks + Warboss etc etc.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 10:28

Hey all, new here. Cant you take Empty Raiders and ram spam to disrupt enemy tanks/troop transports?
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 10:46

@adesapere wrote:
Hey all, new here. Cant you take Empty Raiders and ram spam to disrupt enemy tanks/troop transports?

You can but you'd be using a 75pt (minimum Raider, shock prow flicker) transport to attempt to kill an opponents vehicle seems like a desperation move rather than a tactical descision.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 11:20

@adesapere wrote:
Hey all, new here. Cant you take Empty Raiders and ram spam to disrupt enemy tanks/troop transports?

If you mean: can you buy an empty raider the answer is: no, you can't.
If you mean: can you buy a raider for a squad but leave them out and use the raider to suicide ram the opposition? Yes, you can. But I wouldn't recommend it (better use the Darklance to kill stuff).

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSun Jun 05 2011, 21:41

Well sure, you're not gonna utilize a 75 point transport as a the sole purpose of taking down transports in a competitive game but for the sake of the "out of the box" tactics it would definitely catch an opponent off guard to have your raider crammed into the side their dreadnought or hydra.
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 09 2011, 15:56

It's funny, I was thinking of raider bombs the other day. Not that I would start out with this tatic. However, if palying two objectives and reserving everything...

reserve everything and set your troops outside of the transport. Huge distraction and contesting tool while you come on from reserve and secure your own objective.

If it takes 4-8 raider shots to kill one mech, then sacraficing a few may not be a bad return on investment. It would require FF, TGL, and Shock Prow. If you already FF your raiders, the extra 10 points (say 60-80 for a fleet), could be a fun destraction. You could even throw Enhanced aethersails on for some extra range.

There could even be some practial uses of the equitment in regular scenarios...
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 09 2011, 18:15

As much fun as the kamikazi Raider is, I've also had success using the raiders to block.

Flat out right up to 1" away from an enemy vehicle, turn sideways. Most non-fast vehicles have to either spend the time going around you, or try to go through you. The 4+ cover makes shooting at you tougher, and if they try and ram you, 3+ dodge for a skimmer, and if you make it they stop dead. Vehicle neutralized.

I've used this on landraiders a couple times, and a rhino line. You will loose raiders, but it really messes with opponents.
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeThu Jun 09 2011, 18:49

Bring your hot girlfriend. Works every time.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 10 2011, 01:37

I've been experimenting with shooty Dark Eldar in Vassal (my most regular opponent is Tau, and I can't seem to get close enough to kill his face in assault, so I'm trying something new), and so far I like it, but it'll take some getting used to.

Running 3+ Blaster Warrior squads on Venoms with twin Splinter Cannons and a Night Shield each, at least one Ravager with Flickerfield and Night Shield, supported by a Blaster Archon and his Blaster Trueborn bodyguard (mounted in a Venom identical to the Warriors') and some Reavers to divide his fire and just cause their usual chaos, my plan is to sit at the edge of his pulse rifle range and force him to come to me, all the while spraying him with splinter fire and slagging his tanks and battlesuits with my darklights. Every time he gets close enough to shoot next turn, I just duck outside of his range and continue hosing, and only assault when I'm all but assured a kill.

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 10 2011, 18:34

@Hashmal wrote:
Bring your hot girlfriend. Works every time.
This is the best tactical advice yet! Psychological warfare works my friends.

I've had a girlfriend show up at a tournament (not with me, this was done on purpose) in a low cut top. She proceeds to walk over to my table and ogle my opponents models and fawn over how cute they are. She bends over the table at some point and asks if she can see that model waaaay over there... It was beautiful. After fawning over some other cute toy soldiers, she leaves and meets up with me later. Epic.

Was it dirty? Yes. Underhanded? Maybe? Did I win? Of course.
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adesapere
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 10 2011, 23:21

Yeah anyway to get a typical wargamer distracted is bring your busty girlfriend into a tournament. Most wargaming guys have never seen boobs except in pixels.
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 10 2011, 23:40

@adesapere wrote:
Yeah anyway to get a typical wargamer distracted is bring your busty girlfriend into a tournament. Most wargaming guys have never seen boobs except in pixels.

Lol, but of course dark Eldar players are different
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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 11 2011, 00:25

@Xelkireth wrote:
@Hashmal wrote:
Bring your hot girlfriend. Works every time.
This is the best tactical advice yet! Psychological warfare works my friends.

I've had a girlfriend show up at a tournament (not with me, this was done on purpose) in a low cut top. She proceeds to walk over to my table and ogle my opponents models and fawn over how cute they are. She bends over the table at some point and asks if she can see that model waaaay over there... It was beautiful. After fawning over some other cute toy soldiers, she leaves and meets up with me later. Epic.

Was it dirty? Yes. Underhanded? Maybe? Did I win? Of course.

It's only a short jump to slipping something in their drink or tazing them in the toilets from here ^

other than that , well played sir, a true archon will use all the tools at his disposal...

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PostSubject: Re: Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics   Advanced/Outside of the box Tactics I_icon_minitimeSat Jun 11 2011, 00:35

Do what you want, 'cause a pirate is free, and all that.
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