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 Wyches suck?

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Sambomaster
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duckduckgoose
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PostSubject: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 23 2021, 20:38

I’ve been really disappointed in wyches my last several games. All they tend to do is maybe get one round of combat, kill a guy or 2 and then die.

I tend to run 2x5 to ride along with 2x5 incubi, for ablative wounds when the transport gets blown up, and for additional melee threat, but they have only been effective in achieving the former.

I guess I’m just considering dropping them entirely, or just taking 1x5 for realspace raids, but maybe I am just using them wrong. Would a squad of 10 accompanying my succubus be more effective? 5 just really don’t have enough attacks to do much.

It probably doesn’t help that I often go up against marines, necrons and orks, so generally good armor saves and/or high toughness. Against marines their AP-1 D1 just bounces off.

What are others thoughts on wyches? I realize the points hike didn’t help them any, but their stats are the same, and I know a lot of people really like them, so maybe I am just misusing them. Would love to hear where you find them effective


Last edited by duckduckgoose on Fri Jan 07 2022, 20:33; edited 1 time in total
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Patayou
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 23 2021, 21:06

wyches are here for GeQ killing and tarpiting. send them against weak/shooty objective holders and watch them kill and maybe win the roll to forbid your opponent to retreat and stay in combat, where they'll have a chance to survive.

A CB wych with adrenalight will kill almost 2 GeQ by herself. CoS wyches are even better, but maily because of all the stratagems they get.

They are not as good against MeQ but you'll still kill half a marine per wych on average (with the same CB wych as above) and you can give the hekatrix a power sword if you're expecting armor.

I like to keep my wyches in units of 5, but the special weapons really give them options for every opponents.

As for basic strategies :

-throw them at expensive but fragile shooty units (tau, eldar shooty infantry, ...) and they'll make their points back in a turn

-let them deal with big tarpit units (orks, necrons, nids, ...). you're bound to kill more points than your opponent, and with a little luck you'll forbid your opponent to fall back and might even survive the fighting phase with your 4++.

-make them fight hyper expensive high ap melee units. If your 60 pts wych unit can tie up a 150 pts terminator unit, or a dreadknight for a turn or two, they've done their job protecting your incubi/talos/whatever else they were going to target. And with a 4++, their ap is wasted and the wyches might take longer than you think to die
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Sambomaster
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 23 2021, 22:41

I love wyches but spamming them nowadays is rough on points when Incubi hit harder but paired with the Succubus they will delete any squad with 1W T4 or less. Against Marines or tougher they still can kill enough of them to survive the turn. Cult of Strife they get to fight first if they're still locked in combat after your other charges.

Keeping nonobsec units in combat with them for multiple turns on TOP of primary objectives is the best thing for them. 5 imo just isn't enough. It's easy to lose 5 in the first fight but not lose the other 5 for another turn or two.

If I take just 5 wyches, I use them to support my backline in venoms late game or to hunt down cultists/scouts doing ROD, engage, or clearing annoying units off my board edge for Herd.

I dont really see ppl supporting wyches with a Realspace Archon with Ancient Evil. This opens up Incubi to operate independently or with Drazhar while succubus can buff Hellions. Im also tempted to take Vexxator mask and pair Haemonculus with Cursed Blade Wyches.

Pairing wyches with fight last mechanic while MSU Incubi for Tormentors is always interesting to me. If played right can completely shut down counter offensive and take away any effective shooting your opponent could have. Of course I can never pull it off regularly but that's cuz I suck at positioning.
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commandersasha
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 27 2021, 11:10

10 Bloodbrides at Strength 5 in a Raider with a Hekatrix, hiding for a turn or two then bouncing into mid table so Succ wipes one unit and the ladies wipe the other has seen me turn a game from the opponent thinking they're winning, to suddenly realising they're lost and tabled. TBH I think they're overkill.

5 Wyches without those boosts (as my Crusade girls are finding) get roflstomped. Get more girls, they're better in big groups!
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Gelmir
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 27 2021, 21:34

The amount of "umph" added when going from 5 to 10 wyches does more then reflect the extra points needed for it I guess. They really should go in 10-model squads.

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Soulless Samurai
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 27 2021, 23:19

Is it the Wych weapons that tip them over the edge or just the numbers?

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Gelmir
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 28 2021, 00:04

I think mostly the numbers. The sheer bucketload of attacks they throw at your opponent. I only add special weapons if I have points left at the end of my list.

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Soulless Samurai
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 28 2021, 01:07

Gelmir wrote:
I think mostly the numbers. The sheer bucketload of attacks they throw at your opponent. I only add special weapons if I have points left at the end of my list.

Okay, cool. Thanks for the input.

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commandersasha
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 30 2021, 11:11

Yup, I've never added a Wych weapon.
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duckduckgoose
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeFri Jan 07 2022, 20:34

Thanks for the tips all. I think I've been using them incorrectly, in that units of 5 are way too squishy, as most of you have said, and that wyches aren't necessarily expected to kill a bunch of things (though they often will), but there value is more as a unit that can tie-up higher value units in combat, or contest an objective.

I'm going to try running a squad of 10 in a raider with my succubus, and probably using them as one of my initial push units along with haemoxytes and court.
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Gelmir
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PostSubject: Re: Wyches suck?   Wyches suck? I_icon_minitimeFri Jan 07 2022, 22:58

duckduckgoose wrote:
Thanks for the tips all. I think I've been using them incorrectly, in that units of 5 are way too squishy, as most of you have said, and that wyches aren't necessarily expected to kill a bunch of things (though they often will), but there value is more as a unit that can tie-up higher value units in combat, or contest an objective.

I'm going to try running a squad of 10 in a raider with my succubus, and probably using them as one of my initial push units along with haemoxytes and court.

That sounds exactly like what wyches are good at. Go for it!

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