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 Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?

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kubi
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kubi


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PostSubject: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 08:58

Greetings,

I have recently started playing W40K and I have done some research on army lists and tactics about drukhari on this site but I wanted a more direct answer and help. I would like to start building towards a 1000pts drukhari army (I will not be going to any tournaments but I want it to be competitive because that's how I like to play). Because I have literally nothing from Drukhari, I am thinking of buying 2x combat patrols for starters. Is this a bad decision? I would appreciate any tips on creating a small collection and/or 1000pts army lists from the scratch.
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 11:55

Nothing wrong with the combat patrol boxes. They are a real good start.
Too bad, the old Start Collecting boxes are out of commission.

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 13:41

That is the one with the Raider, Ravager, Incubi and Warriors, right?

All of these are pretty good, and you could easily use all of that in a 1k game (especially if your playing in your garage with your buddies)

Would recomend picking up some 1/8" and 1/16" magnets for the Raiders/Ravagers. They are pretty customizable if you dont glue or magnatize the options (also makes it easier to transport without breakage).

Good luck and welcome to the ranks of the True Kin!
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kubi
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 13:52

Yeah, these are the ones.

I read somewhere on the forum that Kabal is second on the power rankings after Wych, but apart from the second archon I have come to the conclusion that everything else is top value. Happy that you agree.

I will surely magnetise the Raiders/Ravagers and special weapons for the troops.

If I had these 2 boxes, which models would you go for next for a 1k list?
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 14:45

Its not only about the power ranking. Kabalite Trueborn are by far the very best shooting unit we can get.
Upgrade your Archon, put 10 elfs with all the works in a Raider and just shoot.
Then you have Incubi. Our own spikey aspect warriors. They tear through almost anything.
Raiders are a must have unit. Without them, we dont stand a chance against anyone.
Ravagers are good, too. Maybe a little bit expensive, but still playable.


But, and thats a big but, you need to play Drukhari the right way. Every unit gets down easily, when you just sneeze in their direction.
Well, there are some exceptions, especially in the coven section, but mostly its just the way ESE are.

Other units, you want to have are definetly Wyches. Nice and extra slicey is Drazhar. But I think, he could wait.
Mandrakes are very useful in DS denial, Hellions are great for flanking.
Heck, well, actually you could just open the Codex and pick a random unit. Maybe except the Beastmaster.

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 16:46

@Zenotaph speeks truth. There is basically no "Bad" units in our codex (outside the mentioned Beast Master, who can be useful in certain builds).

As he states above, Wych Cults are probably where you would go next to get up to 1000 points.

Other power options would be Court of the Archon models and Scourge, assuming you want to keep your force "Kabal".

But Wych Cult units would be best from a Competitive point of view.

Seems like your more into the "fun" side of the game, at least while your learning. Honestly, just grab stuff you like the look of. You can plug anything into your Kabal force, even if it isnt actually "Kabal".

Main thing to learn when playing Dark Eldar is positioning. That is where you win and lose. And if your anything like me, there will be many more games in the "lose" category while your learning the army Wink
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 17:07

Oh boy, believe me, I lost my fair share of games. Often its like:
This place looks nice, I put a Raider there. Still enough room? Hmm, the Reavers could flank from here perfectly.
Then your opponent just sees enough Sail to blow up your paperboat and your dice show a double 6. And 2-5 1s after that.
After that, your battleplan circles down the drain.

Or a bloody Helldrake ends his movement right in your deploymentzone and two Raiders are cought in CC,
because you placed them too close to each other.

Lets just put it that way: Most of the times, you are prepared for everything! Except the things, you just didnt think of...

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 17:39

"How far away are your Raiders? Oh, just 18"? Well, I will then move and charge them so my army is now right in your face"

"Those guys who just jumped out of the Raider that blew up, how far away are they? OK, this unit that teleported will now shoot them, then the other unit, now the HQ is exposed and its dead too"

So many mistakes that can be made, and the only way to learn them is to make them all, then not make them again Wink
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 18:09

Or the classic: attack order after multiple charges...
Of course my Archon comes first. Lets show, what he can do. Next would be my Incubi. They easily slice through everything.
But, and here is the big but again, the opponent still has CP to burn. And interrupting the attack order is a nice way to do so.
And while the enemy is rearranging his troops, you just think: Why didnt you attack with them first, the Archon had a chance to survive.
That happened to me two times. It will never happen again. OK, I admit, I had bad luck with the tormentors.

Uh, well, btt:

You really want a Succubus too. But maybe you can kitbash one. I did with Elves hanging from Raiders and Venoms.

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kubi
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 18:46

From some lists that I have seen and correct me if I am wrong but there are a lot of Succubus and Wyches in almost all lists. Same with Drazhar.

Hellions, Scourges and Mandrakes are more situational. And a model that I liked at first, the Cronos/Talos I see it so rarely.
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeWed Sep 29 2021, 19:35

Chronos is nowadays pretty common. His autohitweapon still benefits from DT.
Wyches and Incubi are almost autotakes. They take you through almost every melee.
But almost as common as Incubi are Mandrakes. They just dont stand out of the crowd so much.
Scourges dont appear that much, right, but a flock of Shredder Scourges is also a common sight.
And Hellions are often seen in Wych heavy lists.

Btw, Talos said 'Hi there' big time at the London Supermajor GT...

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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 15:54

@Zenotaph wrote:

Btw, Talos said 'Hi there' big time at the London Supermajor GT...

Just be weary of those lists and results. The format and terrain of that tourney was such that super skewed lists were the norm, and it became a I go first I win unless you are so tough I bounce off. All your wins needed to be 90+ point to even have a chance at winning that thing.
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 16:44

I go first, I win seems to be a real problem. But how to repair it? I dont have the slightest idea. Nothing comes to mind.

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 16:53

personally, and i know i will probably be lapidated for daring to say such thing, i would suggest to change the overall mechanic of the game:

instead of being: every model from your amy move, shoot, charge etc.... and then an hour later its your opponents turn, i would propose to things:

1- one player move a unit, psychic, shoot, charge etc.... and then the opponent choose a unit and do the same and so on alternatively until every units have done their thing (a little bit more like a chess game)

2- one player do his move for every units from his army, and then the opponent, and after that the shooting for one army and then the opponent, and then charge etc.....

I personally prefer the 1st option, but i know they're probably some stuff i did not take into account so i don't know if this would be truly viable, but this could mitigate for sure the first player win aspect
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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 20:00

Ya, there has been a lot of hate for the "I go, you go" system for the past few years. Maybe in 11th edition they will completely change the game, but it would destroy any sort of "balance" that has been designed over the past few editions.

Back on topic, at 2000 point Competitive the units are roughly

Auto Take:
-Draz
-Succubus
-Incubi
-Wyches
-Raider

Basically Auto Take:
-Mandrakes
-Scourge
-Hellions
-Trueborn

Really Really Good:
-Cronos with Dark Technomancer
-Court of the Archon
-Voidraven Bombers with Poison Tongue.

Im sure i forgot a few, but thats the basics

The Strange Dark One likes this post

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 20:33

Auto take: Drukhari codex Wink

But what @fisheyes and @zenotaph says is indeed true.
Kabal and Cult are indeed our two best sub-faction, and the good news is that they are the easiest to get your hands on (Coven are almost exclusively webstore only and it sucks)

If i were you, i would start with 2x combat Patrol as you intended, and after that, slowly but surely, i would add some Cult units and Drazhar.

2x Combat Patrol =
20 Kabalites
2-4 Raiders
0-2 Ravager
2 Archon
10 Incubis

this is already a pretty impressive start (we're lucky to have such a great combat patrol.......still waiting for my Thousand Sons one to be revealed......but that's another story Wink )

After that i would try to get my hands on:
at least another Raider (they are our bread and butter for our army, so 3 would be the minimum)
10 Hellions
20 Wyches
1-2 Succubus
maybe 5 Scourge
Drazhar
maybe 5 Mandrakes (but they are webstore only and resin only........yuk!)

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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 20:40

Dont forget the humble Wracks.

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 20:55

for a starter i would not recommend to go Coven sub-faction just because of the difficulty to get your hands on them and to not get lost in too many different units that don't fit together.
Starting with Kabal and Cult is a good way to learn the way of the Drukhari without being lost in too many different builds.

That being said, indeed, Wracks are REALLY good troop units (but damn they are expensive!!! 43 can$ for only 5 models.......when Wyches and KAbal are 45 can$ for 10 models each)
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kubi
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 22:42

Thanks for all the new information! Yeah that's the plan generally. After that I am planning to buy Draz, Wyches, Succubus and Mandrakes (it's my second favorite model after the incubi).

Quick question, is this setup for Trueborn standardised?
[1 Dark Lance, 2 Blasters, rest splinter rifles]

I am also a bit confused on their stats and how to upgrade them since I cannot find the Master Archon upgrade that I have read about. Where am I supposed to be searching? Ok, I finally found the rules...
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeThu Sep 30 2021, 23:23

Its just the mostly used setup for Trueborn. Sure, you could equip a Splintercannon and two Shredders.
But why waste a DL and 2 Blasters, that will always hit on 2+?

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 01 2021, 12:56

The reason people are running the "Standard" Trueborn is that they are great at taking out a lot of the more "durable" units.

Many of those units have -1 to hit, which the Trueborn simply ignore. Enemy Raiders, Mortarion, Eldar in general, etc.

Due to that "always hit with BS2" it makes the anti tank super reliable. Throw in some Black Heart/Obsidian Rose rerolls, and they become really reliable.

Also take into account they have the added durability of "sitting inside a raider", it turns them into a problem that many oposing armies cannot deal with.

Sure you can take other weapon loadouts, and they will do good work with them, but it will not be as "Amazing" as the anti tank role they fill.

Thats my $0.02 anyway, feel free to prove me wrong!
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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 01 2021, 14:12

@kubi just so that you don't have a bad feeling about them, Mandrakes were amongst my favorite models until i got my hands on them and found out that they look like ants next to Incubis just because they are really old models made in resin, they are a little bit smaller than the rest of our other units.
Note that this can be a bonus knowing that they will be easier to hide, BUT, don't buy them for their aesthetic design cause you might be deceived

personally i proxied some Tree-Revenants from the Sylvaneth of Age of Sigmar (they are bigger so a little bit harder to hide, but they are FAR better looking)

but that's purely a question of taste, so its really up to you at this point Wink
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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 01 2021, 20:06

Ya, the Mandrake sculpt is pretty cool, but the Resin just ruins it IMO.

I did a conversion using some gasping hands from the Fantasy Crypt Ghouls (which I used for Wracks) and some GW terrain. Pretty pleased with my shadow arms reaching out from the shadowed corners of various battlefield debris.

Long story short, its a great place to flex your creativity/conversion skills Wink
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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols?   Newbie start - 2 Combat patrols? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 01 2021, 20:19

For my part, i did not paint them already, but my Tree Revenant i intend to paint the ''wooden parts'' as if it was some sort of moving shadow and the model is popping out of it to grab anything that comes close......i will hone my painting skills before i can do that though.....
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