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 New Codizes and what we think about them

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Marrath
Sarcron
Barking Agatha
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The Strange Dark One
Yziel
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krayd
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toldavf
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sekac
Wych
sekac

Posts : 649
Join date : 2017-06-03

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 31 2021, 00:05

@Kalmah wrote:
@Zenotaph in your example, why in the first place did you place the Incubis in the Venom if the second the Venom touch the field you empty it? And you still need to be at a minimum of 9'' from enemies models, so there is no gain here at all............you should just put the incubis + Drazhar in reserve in the first place and at the start of turn 2 do the same thing that you pointed but without spending an additional CP (and you could even save 85pts because you don't need the Venom).


It ends up being 2 CP either way. Either you spend 1 to reserve the unit in the first place or 1 to do Swift Outflank. In either case, you spend 1 more for Murderous Decent.


So it's really about flexibility vs risk. By placing the venom on the table at the start of the game you can either Swift Outflank it or use the venom and its contents on turn 1. With Strategic Reserves, there is no way they'll be where you need them on turn 1. On the other hand, by placing it on the table, there is the risk it dies before it gets used at all, and there is no risk of that in SR. 


SR is safe, Swift Outflank is flexible.



@toldavf wrote:
When you compare that to the ork version doesn't MD look trash? Truck boys in on turn 2 12+3+5+maybe a d6 no minimum distance from enemies then assault. If md had given some bonus for to charge range it might of actually been good as it is ATM I don't rate it


I certainly wouldn't make the case that Murderous Decent is better, I don't think it is. However, it does have downsides that Murderous Decent does not. For instance, and excellent counter is destroying the truck. There is no opportunity to destroy the transport before Murderous Decent gets used.


There is also a larger opportunity for misplay by the ork player. Since trucks are pretty fragile there likely will not be good opportunities later in the game. This is a turn 1/turn 2 strat most of the times. As Drukhari players, I'm sure we've all learned the lesson of playing too aggressively too early. Just because you can, does not mean you should. The ork player must weigh that with "if i don't do it now, I may not get to do it all." They may end up convincing themselves to spend a CP only to ultimately sacrifice a squad/trukk for little gain.


Granted, I don't weigh the value of things under the assumption that my opponent will mess it up, so I'd say it's definitely better than Murderous Decent. I just wanted to highlight that it might end up being a little more situational than it first appears. 
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Kalmah
Wych
Kalmah

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 31 2021, 01:01

well, at least this conversation has hallowed me to learn how to best use Murderous Descent Wink
gotta thank you for that Smile
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Zenotaph
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Zenotaph

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeSat Jul 31 2021, 17:26

Oha! I just read this here Goonhammer article.
I especially like the point, where the Kill Rig can send Flyers into strategic reserve. Suspect

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Zenotaph
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Zenotaph

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 02 2021, 19:22

Here are the first psychic toys for GK and TS. Not sure, but some really look nasty.
Somehow its not really, what I had expected.

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Kalmah
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Kalmah

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 02 2021, 19:40

after review, sadly for TS players, this is a complete waste of time:
The 3 revealed spells are already in Psychic Awakening, and worst of all, the Cult of time Spell has been nerfed :/

before it was WC=5, revive 1 infantry, if WC=9+ then revive D3 models full health

now its WC=6 revive 1 infantry

seriously i'm really disapointed Sad (i know our Termi will be REALLY good targets for this spell but then again, it's not what i was expecting at all)

The 2 other spells seems unchanged

luckily it's just the 1st day of reveal............fingers crossed Wink
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sekac
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sekac

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 02 2021, 20:08

@Kalmah wrote:
after review, sadly for TS players, this is a complete waste of time:
The 3 revealed spells are already in Psychic Awakening, and worst of all, the Cult of time Spell has been nerfed :/

before it was WC=5, revive 1 infantry, if WC=9+ then revive D3 models full health

now its WC=6 revive 1 infantry

seriously i'm really disapointed Sad (i know our Termi will be REALLY good targets for this spell but then again, it's not what i was expecting at all)

The 2 other spells seems unchanged

luckily it's just the 1st day of reveal............fingers crossed Wink


You've gotta factor in that you're reviving 2 wound Rubric Marines or 3 wound terminators. If you have to choose between 1 wound marines with a good spell or 2 wound marines with a usually better, but occasionally worse spell, which would you choose? I think everyone, everywhere would take the latter option. The spell is harder to cast because it benefits you more than the old one.
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toldavf
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toldavf

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 02 2021, 20:35

@Kalmah wrote:
after review, sadly for TS players, this is a complete waste of time:
The 3 revealed spells are already in Psychic Awakening, and worst of all, the Cult of time Spell has been nerfed :/

before it was WC=5, revive 1 infantry, if WC=9+ then revive D3 models full health

now its WC=6 revive 1 infantry

seriously i'm really disapointed Sad (i know our Termi will be REALLY good targets for this spell but then again, it's not what i was expecting at all)

The 2 other spells seems unchanged

luckily it's just the 1st day of reveal............fingers crossed Wink

Could still be good on terminators? 3 wounds on a TS termie most likely so it's not too bad.

Given the new stat lines of grey knights though, they are gonna be pretty damn tough for most armies, luckily their defense for the moment seems to be just standard marine levels, Most of our units can't absorb a charge from dedicated assault units in marine armies but we can certainly slice them up.
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Kalmah
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Kalmah

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 02 2021, 21:04

ho i'm aware of all that, but the thing is that EVERYTHING is getting better with every new codex being released, so i don't think that wishing my spell to stay the same but that can have better target is a unicorn dream Wink

The thing that really let me down is that everything that they previewed is at best the same thing that was written in my 8th edition codex + Psychic Awakening.
I would have preferred if they would at least shown me new spells or stuff like that.

But i still have real high hopes for my codex, don't get me wrong, i remember too well the reactions people had when our Drukhari Codex was being previewed Wink lol i learned from that that you have to take everything into account before making conclusions Smile

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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 02 2021, 21:14

The best: Kabalites now have 4+ and an additional attack! Exactly what we need! lol!

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 03 2021, 13:23

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/08/03/cabbalistic-rituals-are-about-to-make-your-thousand-sons-psykers-scarier-than-ever/

THAT'S the kind of article i wanted yesterday Wink
Only new stuff, and gotta say, seems really FUN new stuff! Smile
really love the cabal points mechanic!
Also the upgrade for our Sorcerer are really nice, especially the +10pts for Sorcerer in Termi who will become a beast in melee!
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Zenotaph
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Zenotaph

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 03 2021, 14:39

I also read it just now. Thats more like it. Collecting Cabal Points in addition to CP seems to be a nice twist.
It reminds me a bit of the HH Legions Onlinegame. But in a big game you really need to keep track of your points.

Edit: The article states, there are 9 different upgrades for different sorcerers. Thats quite a number!!!

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fisheyes
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fisheyes

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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 03 2021, 17:58

Always read the Community articles with a big grain of salt.

Keep in mind these are the people who do these previews dont actually play 40k and have no idea what rules are.

Ill always remember the Tau preview when 9th came rolling around. "Oh, but Tau get to overwatch twice!".

Seriously, until we see the full thing there is little point in exhausting our emotions. Unless thats what makes you happy (we are emotion vampires after all Wink ).

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 03 2021, 19:23

ho no worrie there, i always try to keep my head cold when reading those previews Wink
So, i don't know if this will be good or not, but the newly revealed Cabals really brings a good flavor to the TS!

One thing i can't wait to see is to see the new datasheets for the Daemon Engines (Forgefiend, Heldrakes etc...) because if i'm not mistaken, it's the first 9th edition codex with those units!
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 03 2021, 19:42

What about the Mutalith Vortex Beast? That is a very nice model!

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 03 2021, 21:06

@Zenotaph totally agree!! a lot of stuff i want to see lol Smile
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 04 2021, 15:36

Grey Knights turn! Nothing shiny, no blingbling, but I would call it solid.

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 04 2021, 15:47

Looking like both Codicies are getting released this weekend?

The roll out schedule is very strange recently...
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 04 2021, 16:06

Well, with the new box coming...

GK get the extra wound too. So another possibly stupid question: Do Terminators then have T5 and 3W?

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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 04 2021, 17:25

the new Tide that allows them to almost always succeed their charge is insane! (1-2 = 3 for roll or advance)
knowing they are at base 3A this will be a huge difference for them.

@fisheyes yes, the two codices as well as the Hexfire box will be for preorder this saturday and available next one (14th)......it's Christmas #2 for me! Very Happy

@Zenotaph about the termis, i'm pretty sure (hope) they will be 3W but i'm unsure about the T5

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fisheyes
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 04 2021, 17:30

The regular marine Termies are T4.

But these are super-duper-special Termies, so anything is possible.

Im a little surprised that they didnt upgrade the GK Strike squads with a Primaris body with a GK upgrade sprue. Those mini-marines look pretty off after looking at Primaris for the last few years...
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Kalmah
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 04 2021, 18:13

The thing is, as per my friend who plays GK, the GK where never ok with the Primaris system.
Being incorruptible they fear this may invite some treason in their rank.
After all, in every Primaris there is the gene of the traitors Primarch!
This is what i'm being told

But for sure........they look so.........not modern models lol, especially in comparison with the TS who are really well detailed (IMHO)
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeThu Aug 05 2021, 14:44

So, according to this here post, Termies now have 3W, 2+, 5++ and 5+++.
They are psykers of course and able to psych an additional attack. With their Nemesisweapons, well, thats quite a punch.

I think, we'll see lots of them. Depends on the costs, of course...

Edit: No additional attack. I read it wrong. Strat: +1 to hit, Psi: reroll wounds...

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krayd
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeThu Aug 05 2021, 14:55

@Zenotaph wrote:
So, according to this here post, Termies now have 3W, 2+, 5++ and 5+++.
They are psykers of course and able to psych an additional attack. With their Nemesisweapons, well, thats quite a punch.

I think, we'll see lots of them. Depends on the costs, of course...

Note that the 5+++ is only against MWs, and the entire army gets it.
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Zenotaph
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeThu Aug 05 2021, 15:11

With Hammer and Shield they have Sx2 and 3++, right? Inbuilt Stormbolter and deepstrike.
Hrhr, I am shivering. Not sure though, if its excitement or... something else. affraid

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krayd
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PostSubject: Re: New Codizes and what we think about them   New Codizes and what we think about them - Page 5 I_icon_minitimeThu Aug 05 2021, 17:31

@Zenotaph wrote:
With Hammer and Shield they have Sx2 and 3++, right? Inbuilt Stormbolter and deepstrike.
Hrhr, I am shivering. Not sure though, if its excitement or... something else. affraid

Stormshield gives 4++ and +1 to armor save rolls.
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