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 Are Incubi viable in the current meta?

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Azdrubael
Incubi
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PostSubject: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 08:46

Yo people! After GK release i feel incubi really lose much of their position.
Are they still viable choice? Do you include them in rosters ? Do you dare go with them on tournaments?

Whats the common builds regarding latest meta thrends ?
They are primiere in dealing with 3+ FNP units , but really its a gamble , cause in GK army they can be ineffective against unit.

What do you think about them right now?
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Arrex
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 10:00

I've always, always loved them. (Been playing them since 3rd, got every single model you can imagine)

But your question is based entirely on something subjective: The local meta determines their use. Even in tourneys, it's still going to be all about the local meta at the tourney. I don't see many GKs in my area; here in NC its other DE, Guard, etc, in VA where I play it's all meched up Marines.

Personally I think they're great for making almost anything without an invuln save die horribly, but they do suffer from some curious limitations:

1. No grenades. This is a problem because you ideally want a pain token to capitalize on their high armor and protect the points investment, but you also would prefer to have grenades from a PGL. (I go the pain token route, since it's much cheaper than taking an Archon with PGL)

2. No shooting. This is odd to me since the last edition let them fire and even carry assault weapons, and the fluff mentions them having some sort of soulstone. (Maybe it was supposed to function as grenades)

3. Lack of good anti-vehicle weapons. You really, really don't want dreads wandering over and tag teaming them. (Another argument for avoiding prolonged combats with them)


So what are they good for? I use large squads with a Klaivex (Heresy, I know) to absolutely wreck infantry. I prefer to either send them into an isolated unit where they can butcher them without taking much fire the next turn, or make sure that while my Incubi are charging one unit, my Wyches are tying up another while my Warriors spray down a third. Still, honestly, as a Black Templar player, I find paying 22 points a model for a power weapon at I5 WS5 to be a real steal...
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Arrex
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 10:01

Are Incubi viable in the current meta? 294448_300432239967321_100000016420630_1253780_301628164_n
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notts
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 10:07

surely it's only grey knights and "everyone has a power weapon" that comes with that, that makes Incubi a bit risky to take.

Against everything else I imagine they do pretty well!
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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 15:54

They are still very viable. They are our best anti-MEQ, and even against a squad of GKs they will come out on top, barring they are rocking 4+ hailberds. The trick is that when you take incubi, you are losing a unit of blasterborn, and you now have to fill AT elsewhere.

I normally run 5 of them in a venom, or 4 with an PGL Archon in a venom. This is used as a counter-assault unit in my venomspam list and they do amazingly well. They chew through all that MSU people are running these days.

@Arrex wrote:
2. No shooting. This is odd to me since the last edition let them fire and even carry assault weapons, and the fluff mentions them having some sort of soulstone. (Maybe it was supposed to function as grenades)

Well, the stone you are talking about is the bloodstone, which is a flamer the klaivex can take. Or you are talking about the tormentors, which they had last edition in the form of a pistol in their helmet, even though they weilded a two hand weapon (like scorps and their mandi-blasters) Which if you look at their profile, its still there (as originally they were base one attack... now they are base 2)

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notts
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 15:57

my main GK opponent has old metal GKs... full of Halberds...
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Eldur
Sybarite
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 16:55

2 units of 5 in venoms. They can go hunting Longfangs, Tactical Marines, Crisis suits, etc.. even light vehicles! Not dreads of course. I also like to use them as a combat finishers, because wyches tend to spend a lot of time in combat... In this case I don't care about the lack of grenades... but some day i'll sacrifice some points to add my Archon (and then use 1 of 8 Incubi in a Raider with him).

About the wych+Incubi combo... against GK I managed to kill 2 units of 5 paladins+Inquisitor in 2 turns... just great. So bad I got shooted out of the table after that...

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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 17:42

@notts wrote:
my main GK opponent has old metal GKs... full of Halberds...

better make sure he is paying for all those halberds... because those points add up. Actually I would be happy to play a GK list with all halberds, means less psybacks on the field Razz
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Raneth
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 18:44

^ preach it, brah.

Incubi are amazingly cheap for what they do. IMHO, a PGL-sitter is mandatory though; if I take a hammer unit I want to hammer at whatever I damn well please whenever I damn well please. Especially when you consider they can't shoot at all; you want them in cc FAST. This, of course, limits listbuilding somewhat, but in my case that would most likely just mean not being able to take Hellions as Troops and no Stealth on my Beasts. Big deal (lol).

No 3rd Blasterborn unit hurts, but we can get AT in any section of the codex, albeit slightly less pts-effective, while the Incubi can manage feats none of our other units can. Ask any math head.

So yeah, if you ask me, Incubi rate right up there with the very best units in 40K.

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Siticus the Ancient
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 19:01

In my eyes, all GKs should still be armed with halberds, no exceptions. The double swords or staves are absolutely silly. Hammers are acceptable.

But yeah, I'm always getting a good use out of my Incubi whenever I use them. Five-six Incubi with an Archon is such an amazing fire magnet alone. People are so damn scared of the Incubi, they absolutely want to get them down as soon as possible, even if it means ignoring other, comparatively minor or not as immediate threats. Sometimes my Incubi will slaughter entire squads. Sometimes they'll merely be an escort for Lelith or Archon. But whatever the case, I still love them, and always like to field them against most of the armies in my local game store.

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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 20:19

@Siticus the Ancient wrote:
In my eyes, all GKs should still be armed with halberds, no exceptions. The double swords or staves are absolutely silly. Hammers are acceptable.

The problem here is your not abusing wound allocation, which imho is one of their more hidden strengths. say you take a 5 man strike squad in a psyback. Well lets see... you have 5 models to make individual. So first off one guy gets a psycannon. Sarge is getting a TH, because you really need that extra base attack for the TH to do something. so now we have 3 guys. Best way imho oppinion is giving two halberds, and leave the other guy with his sword. Now you have 4 different models in the squad, and can easily put all the low AP shots on who I like to call "Guy with Sword" and watch him get obliterated.

Also on termies and palies swords are a very good investment, leaving your guy with a 4+ invul. Sure its not a stormshield, but its the closest that army can get to it other than Guillieman, I mean Calgar, I mean Dragio... Yah... that guy Razz
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notts
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 22:59

@Shadows Revenge wrote:
@notts wrote:
my main GK opponent has old metal GKs... full of Halberds...

better make sure he is paying for all those halberds... because those points add up. Actually I would be happy to play a GK list with all halberds, means less psybacks on the field Razz

He does pay for them, and actually fields a pretty friendly GK list.

no psyriflemen! only two psybacks! no purifiers!!

fortitude is still annoying though.
And back on topic- I want some incubi but I hate this resin cack, and I hate the old models... so need ot find some of the metal new ones.
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Arrex
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 09 2011, 23:30

I have all the Incubi, and surprisingly, I like the Finecast the best. The detail is a little better, it's easier to prep, and the wiggle factor is minimized by the two handed construction. You do need to gap fill though.
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Siticus the Ancient
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeSat Dec 10 2011, 07:58

@Shadows Revenge
I absolutely despise the multiwound shenanigans. They draw out the games significantly just with all the micromanagement of wounds involved, not to mention the time it actually takes to killing the damn things. Screw Nobs and screw Paladins, seriously. GKs should be armed with halberds, no exceptions, because halberds are awesome.

I'm kind of oldschool in that regard, much preferring the old GK models with all halberds. They looked unified like a military force. The current mishmash of weapons makes them look like a group of PCs of a Deathwatch campaign.

But this is going offtopic. Apologies.

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Eldur
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeSat Dec 10 2011, 17:21

Back to the topic, if you don't see more Incubi at competition is because Venom spam has enough anti-infantry (GEQ and MEQ) due to lots of splinter cannons and rifles, and because wyches are more usefull in all aspects, being a scoring unit too. Not to mention the popularity of blasterborn... 7 fun elites and we all get the same boring unit! Hope that 6th ed will change that!! But I'll make that rant in the right topic Wink

Oh and nice Incubus (refering to the pic up there). I'm still painting mine, but I'm too lazy right now... and with a huge hangover...

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Plague
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeSat Dec 10 2011, 18:12

I think Incubi are great but I always HAVE to field a full squad of 10 for them to be effective. The player I go against the most runs an Ork army and loves to field a full squad of Mega Nobs with power klaws and a pain boy. 3 wounds, 2+ invuln, and feel no pain is tough to beat, let alone those power klaws causing instant death and negating feel no pain if the Incubi have it. I've throw a full squad of Incubi at him and often times the Mega Nobs will get the best of me unless I tie them up with a wych squad in turn 1 and then get the Incubi to hit turn 2. That allows my Incubi two full rounds of attacks before losing a single member of the squad.

Against most other armies, the Incubi are among the most feared units on the board. They always seem to attract a lot of attention. I think they are worth their cost when put in the right situation but you always have to be cautious on what you attack.

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Eldur
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PostSubject: Re: Are Incubi viable in the current meta?   Are Incubi viable in the current meta? I_icon_minitimeSat Dec 10 2011, 18:51

Other people would lance those Nobz to death... but you're doin' it right, and in the DE style. I use those tactics too, but a unit of 10 is like... 300 points with transport? But hey... then I remember my poor banshees... same cost with transport, same attacks, less strenght, 4+ and no FnP nor furious charge available (not to mention they can't assault from transport). Damn, Incubi are the best MEQ killers of the Eldar race!!

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