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 FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update

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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 14 2020, 19:25

What is the wording for CWE on how to take their traits? B.c if it is worded like the other 6 codices I have (I do not have mine with me it is in my locker at my club) then it calls how only <Craftworlds> gets traits.

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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 14 2020, 19:27

Example, I have my PA book and it is stated like this

Codex: Craftworlds describes how the <CRAFTWORLD> keyword can be substituted with the name of your chosen craftworld, as well as describing the abilities that units in Craftworlds Detachments gain. One of these abilities is Craftworld Attributes. If your chosen craftworld does not have an associated Craftworld Attribute in Codex: Craftworlds, you can create its Craftworld Attribute by selecting rules from the list here. Unless otherwise stated, your chosen craftworld has two Craftworld Attributes from the following list:

If it is worded the same in the codex then Corsairs can NOT have CWE traits. They also can NOT have Kabal traits.

Why? Well b.c they do not have the keywords on their datasheets.

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Oaka
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Oaka

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 15 2020, 15:38

CRAFTWORLD ATTRIBUTES

If your army is Battle-forged, all units in a
Craftworlds Detachment gain a Craftworld
Attribute, so long as every unit in that
Detachment is from the same craftworld. The
Craftworld Attribute gained depends upon the
craftworld they are drawn from, as shown in
the table on the right. For example, all units
in a SAIM-HANN Detachment gain the Wild
Host Craftworld Attribute.


It's worded differently than the Drukhari book, because it doesn't reference <Craftworlds> units at all, just units in a Craftworlds Detachment. The Drukhari book specifically says only <Kabal> <Wych Cult> and <Haemonculus Covens> units gain obsessions.

I believe the intention is obvious, though, and the Craftworld rules were written without taking Corsairs into regard. It should just be <Craftworlds> units that can gain attributes.
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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 15 2020, 17:54

Does it say at the start of the rules (where battlefocus and stuff is before all the datasheets, like where our Drugs are at) is CWE only gain craftworld rules for keywords?

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Oaka
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Oaka

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 15 2020, 17:57

KEYWORDS

Throughout this book you will come across
a keyword that is within angular brackets,
specifically <CRAFTWORLD>. This is
shorthand for a keyword of your own
choosing, as described below.

<CRAFTWORLD>

With the exception of some units, such as the
mysterious Phoenix Lords, all Asuryani belong
to a craftworld. Some datasheets specify
which craftworld the unit is from (e.g. Prince
Yriel has the IYANDEN keyword, so is from
Craftworld Iyanden). If an Asuryani datasheet
does not specify which craftworld it is from,
it will have the <CRAFTWORLD> keyword.
When you include such a unit in your army,
you must nominate which craftworld that
unit is from. You then simply replace the
<CRAFTWORLD> keyword in every instance
on that unit’s datasheet with the name of your
chosen craftworld.

For example, if you were to include an
Autarch in your army, and you decided they
were from Craftworld Biel-Tan, then their
<CRAFTWORLD> keyword is changed to
BIEL-TAN, and their ‘ThePath of Command’
ability would say ‘You can re-roll hit rolls of
1 for friendly BIEL-TAN units within 6" of
this model.’


Last edited by Oaka on Sun Nov 15 2020, 18:11; edited 1 time in total
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Oaka
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Oaka

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 15 2020, 18:10

It basically boils down to the Corsair rules missing a key sentence that is included in the rules for adding Ynnari characters to a Craftworlds detachment:

Corsair Rules-Ally of Convenience: If your army is Battle-forged:
• This unit can be included in a <Craftworld> or <Kabal> Detachment and models in that Detachment can still gain their Detachment abilities.

Ynnari Rules-If you choose for the Detachment to remain a
Craftworlds, HARLEQUINS or DRUKHARI Detachment,
then Yvraine, the Visarch and/or the Yncarne can be
included in that Detachment without preventing other
units from gaining the following Detachment abilities:
The Path of War, Craftworld Attributes, Vanguard of
the Dark City, Raiding Force, Drukhari Obsessions,
Defenders of the Black Library, Masque Forms. Note
that Yvraine, the Visarch and the Yncarne do not benefit
from any of these abilities themselves.


That last bolded sentence should have been included in the Corsair rules.
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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 15 2020, 19:45

They can not be Ynnari, that is without question, b.c Ynnari says it removes the Craftworld from them and you need the keyword to change it. EDIT: Ynnari rule is this The Detachment is no longer considered to be a Craftworlds, HARLEQUINS or DRUKHARI Detachment, and so cannot use their respective Detachment abilities
So they can not be ynnair.

The question is, can they get CWE traits.

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Burnage
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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 16 2020, 09:18

@Oaka wrote:
Note
that Yvraine, the Visarch and the Yncarne do not benefit
from any of these abilities themselves.
[/i]

That last bolded sentence should have been included in the Corsair rules.

Honestly, I think that being present in the Ynnari rules already makes it crystal clear that only units with the <craftworlds> keyword will receive <craftworld> attributes.

If Corsairs benefited from Craftworld attributes their rules wouldn't have to point out that they don't cause other units in the Craftworld detachment to lose theirs.
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Void Prince
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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 16 2020, 17:08

@amishprn86 wrote:
They can not be Ynnari, that is without question, b.c Ynnari says it removes the Craftworld from them and you need the keyword to change it. EDIT: Ynnari rule is this The Detachment is no longer considered to be a Craftworlds, HARLEQUINS or DRUKHARI Detachment, and so cannot use their respective Detachment abilities
So they can not be ynnair.

The question is, can they get CWE traits.

I have watched the last few post with great interest. I appreciate everyones interpretation of the various rules etc. I do feel however from a general fluff aspect that not allowing Corsairs to be part of a Ynnari force is just daft.

As I said in an earlier post the real issue and problem is GW inability to write a set of new rules, for gameplay, that actually works with or alongside an existing set of rules!
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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update   FW Legends update, Corsairs playable in DE detachments and Raven cool update - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 16 2020, 18:49

I'm not talking about fluff though. You can play narrative and do it if you want. I'm talking RAW.

Fluff wise we should have a full range of Outcasts Aeldari as its one of the biggest groups with many Aeldari going in and out of Outcasts (Corsairs is part of the outcasts). For 100% Yvraine would go for them first and not some of the main factions.

But GW seems to ignore outcasts these days.

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