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 1500 for an upcoming game

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tibersky
Hellion
tibersky

Posts : 42
Join date : 2013-09-07

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PostSubject: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 18 2020, 20:35

Hello Dark Kin,
Bellow is a list I wrote up for an upcoming game. Right off the bat I think it has too many points in HQ's, so I would love some feedback as to what to shift around or swap out. I am probably going to face custodians or nurgle marines in my next game.

Patrol 1, PoF
Haemonculus, Warlord(?)
5 Wracks (Naked)
Talos, 2x Macro-Scalpels, Heat Lance
Talos, 2x Macros, HL

Patrol 2, PoF
Drazhar, Warlord(?)
5 Wracks (Naked)
Talos, 2x Macros, HL

Patrol 3, Custom Kabal, Mobile Raiders and Soul Bound
Yvraine, Warlord(?), Gaze of Ynnead, Storm of Whispers, Smite cheers
5 Kabalites, Blaster (not even sure if blasters are worth it anymore scratch )
5 Incubi
2 Ravagers, Dissies
3 Raiders, Dissies

So thats my list I have prepared. I only have he 3 talos, but I have 10 grotesques and they have both done well for me in the past, but I think I would need more raiders to fly them around and I just don't have the points.

I am taking a gamble with Yvraine, I have never ever used a psycher before, Even when I got her during the ynnari domination days. I just feel archons are such a waste of points. Run around and reroll 1s, woo. Or I could MORTAL WOUNDS, REGENERATE, WAVE DASH 6" CONSOLIDATE.

I picked the two kabal choices to kind of hybrid Flayed Skull speed and Black Heart FNP. I never used the vect stratagem and felt like it was worth is so no loss, and cover is so much more varied now so flayed skull cover bonus applied less then half the time.

Also, not sure who the best Warlord is.

So I would love some feeback

Cheers,
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fisheyes
Hekatrix
fisheyes

Posts : 1257
Join date : 2016-02-18

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 19 2020, 14:43

Personally, I would take another look at Black Heart. Honestly, even the threat of AoV has stopped enemies positioning to take full advantage of double shoot/etc strats. I really, really dont think the custom Kabal is worth it, but if you feel strongly on this please take it and enlighten the community!

Sorry, I cant comment on Yvraine, never used her before. In general, psykers are a whole game in their own (positioning for Deny/Auras/etc). Please try positioning her in your army before bringing her to a game, otherwise you may be spending a lot of time fiddling with her (or worst of all, leave her hanging in the breeze to die before she does anything).

Grots dont really need a transport. A strategy that I have been using was to just run them up in cover (as much as possible) turn 1, then use them to counter an enemy movement turn 2. They can take a obscene amount of damage, especially when they get up to T6 with their 4++/6+++.

For Warlord, I would recomend the Haemonculi. This is because he has the best/most general WLT available (Diabolical Soothsayer for the +D3 CP and free re-roll). I dont believe that Drazhar really needs re-roll to wound when he is surrounded by Taloi, and dont know enough about Yvraine to comment on her.

Something that we need to wrap our heads around in 9th is the Secondary missions. What Secondaries was this list built around? I dont see much mobility, but you could probably do Table Quarters and Raise Banners, any idea what your 3ed would be?
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tibersky
Hellion
tibersky

Posts : 42
Join date : 2013-09-07

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeFri Aug 21 2020, 04:46

I've been fortunate to use black heart and flayed skull to great advantage, but what has been most useful to me are the extra movement and the Fnp for the vehicles. Having Vect feels safe, but I would rather use my cp to regen wounds or give -1s. But who knows, I may be making a huge mistake.
I want to keep yvrain square in the middle of my forces for deny the witch, targeted mortal wounds and heroic intervention. She has soulburst which is very easy to trigger so I will fight first most of the time.

I've decided to take 5 grots and 1 talos, grots are just so durable.


You know, I was thinking those were the two best objectives for drukhari, but I haven given it too much thought, unfortunately. I usually take the mission secondary as well as it usually flows with the primary. If its bad I think I will take psychic interrogation because yvraine.

The raiders are extra dissies, mobility and body blockers. They are kind of great at funneling the enemy to keep them off my objectives in a pinch. Also table quarters.

Tomorrows the game so we shall see. I believe I'm facing dark angels.
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Denegaar
Hellion
Denegaar

Posts : 39
Join date : 2019-01-30

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSat Aug 22 2020, 10:56

A couple small points:

- I would add at least 1 Chain-Flail in the Talos squad, it helps a lot if the unit gets tied by chaff.

- Grotesques are great, but if you lose some of the Talos you'll be short in antitank, in my opinion. You only have one Blaster and the rest is low strenght (both the Disintegrators and the Heat Lances).

Maybe if you play vs Marines the sheer amount of Disintegrators work, but if the dude has T8 vehicles it's going to be hard to destroy them.

Good luck!
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tibersky
Hellion
tibersky

Posts : 42
Join date : 2013-09-07

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 23 2020, 07:37

So we bumped the points up to 2k and I faced off against dark angels. It had a mix of disasters, plasma primaris, azriel, a relic dread and lots of terminators.
and i kept this core plus some grotesques and wracks. I changed my coven choice to DT snd gave everyone liquifiers. I missed the prophets durability but it payed off when i got into liquifier range. Overcharging them is decistating. I also took down a relic dred with drazhar and 5 incubi alone in 1 round. They then proceeded to clear the flank.
I did stick with raise the banner snd table quarters. On the raze mission, i think 5, i took the raze secondary. Body blocking with the grotesques worked wonders. And the liqs are so deviststing
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Denegaar
Hellion
Denegaar

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Join date : 2019-01-30

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 23 2020, 10:03

Liquifiers with Wracks or also Grotesques?
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tibersky
Hellion
tibersky

Posts : 42
Join date : 2013-09-07

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 23 2020, 21:01

so I took 2 liqs on wracks, 1 liq per grotesque group, my talos's and my heamonculus, so overall 14 liqs and 2 cronos weapons (basically liqs).
My updated list was:

Yvrain
Drazhar
Heamonculus with a liq
3 units of 5 wracks, 2 liqs each
A unit of 5 kabs and pgl
3 units of grot with 1 liq each
2 Incubi of 5 each
2 talos with heywirs, liqs and macro scalpel.
A cronos with all the fixings
4 dissie raiders.

overcharging all the weapons was so worth the lack of toughness, and I also actually felt like I was playing True glass cannon dark eldar. Overcharged dissies also did a lot of damage before they were popped. Against power armor, this list kills.

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Denegaar
Hellion
Denegaar

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Join date : 2019-01-30

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 23 2020, 21:31

Hmmm I see, it looks killy indeed.

What about splitting the Covens in two? a PoF one to take objectives and the killy one being DT/MoM. I have to try those liquifiers, they look really fun.

How do you use your Kabal? Mine is just there for the Archon that gives me Vect and Labirinthine Cunning.
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Oaka
Hellion
Oaka

Posts : 42
Join date : 2020-08-02

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 23 2020, 22:36

This is great information, thanks.  Did you feel like Drazhar and the Incubi played a vital role, then?  It looks like they might be more effective than relying on whatever surviving Wracks, Grots, and Taloi make it to the enemy.  Were the Raiders mostly used as mobile weapon platforms or did you feel they added enough with transporting units around to be considered more than just their disintegrators?

I ask this because instead of Raiders, I have been intrigued by the idea of boosting a ranged Covens list with a small Craftworlds detachment consisting of support weapons.  I would like to see how well a few D-cannon platforms would perform intermingled with Grotesques and Taloi, as it allows the 24" range platforms to move up the board with more impunity.  You would be adding to target saturation with more toughness 5 wounds, and could include a Ynnari character as the required HQ (I'd be going Yncarne for teleportation shenanigans as support weapons split into individual units) but keep the Craftworlds attributes to give the weapon platforms Expert Crafters (very good on single model units), and perhaps a defensive attribute as the second one (6++ or counts as in cover).

Alternatively, if you go the DT Reaper route, adding in a battery of Vibro Cannons provides a solid ranged firebase that also prevents multiple enemy units from advancing, which may be very useful for objective denial.

It would also be a blast to build up Coven-themed weapon platforms.

Either way, ranged Covens looks like a thing, for sure, glad to hear about your success with them.
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tibersky
Hellion
tibersky

Posts : 42
Join date : 2013-09-07

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PostSubject: Re: 1500 for an upcoming game   1500 for an upcoming game I_icon_minitimeSat Aug 29 2020, 08:12

Denegaar, Splitting the coven may be a good tactic, but I wanted to keep it simple to really observe the effectiveness of the Dt. I only picked the kabal so i could take yvraine and the kabalite with phantasm grenade launcher. I combo the PGL with torment grenades strat for d3 mortal wounds. Black heart is just for the strat i guess, though i didn't use it.

Oaka, I sent one incubi squad, 3 grots and a talos at a 10 or so deathwing plus a character of some sort on one flank. The incubi did good for a turn before being fisted to death. I still won out on that combat at the end. I hung the other squad and drazhar back until turn 3, when I sent them to deal with one of those leviathan dreads on the opposite flank.
with drazhar they took it out very quickly and then proceeded to wipe the rest of the flank through the game.
As to DT reaper, well I don't have one. so noting to say on that.
The raiders did their job. protect, transport, support. They get my dudes exactly where I need them to be, relatively intact, and either shoot or body block. The dissies are good but i think 5 or 6 of them is a good number, as 4 didnt feel like enough. My revised list has 5 raiders with dissies.
Their number 1 job is still skooting my dudes around. They are surprisingly resilient.
The covens are naturaly good in Cc so having DT helps them round out theyre utlity. regular opponents wont expect the pure carnage coming out of the liqs.
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