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Squidmaster
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PostSubject: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 16:21

Well, its official now:

40k 9th edition has just been announced in an hour long twitch stream. No definite release date, but it seems towards the end of the year was their pre-covid plan.
- All Codexes etc still valid, and Psychic Awakeningg written with 9th in mind.
- Command Points now a set amount it seems, and you pay for Detachments and unlocking second Codexes etc.
- Tanks now able to shoot while in combat.
- "Blast" weapons now able to take out hordes easier.
- New "Conquest" narrative games, which sounds like a campaign system.
- Terrain and cover rules rewritten from gound up to be better than the rubbish they are now.
- Army building app in development for some time now.
- Necrons a big figure in new story, with return of the Silent King and a load of new models (including Warriors, new Monoliths, several big stompy things, possibly a new C'tan, and the Silent King himself).
- Also new Assault Intercessors, and new Primaris Chaplain.

Thoughts?
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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 16:45

I wonder if that means the Aeldari races will also become big players in the next edition as we are mortal enemies of the Necrons but who knows
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Cavash
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 17:17

I am going to use it as an opportunity to get back into 40k. I didnt play any games of 8th, between the stark change in rules and Ynnari nonsense I was quite put-off the hobby. I think 'Conquest' is what has done it for me.

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 17:22

IMO the 5 worst things in 8th and what makes 8th not manageable in balance and takes to much away from the players is.

1) Terrain: Now they are addressing this, this could be very good, also we better have MC's fight multi floors lol.
2) Detachments/Allies: Currently we can take w/e is BiS from 3-10 books, Combine there two and you are just chasing OP units with nerfs. There is a known saying "Oddly, restrictions gives more freedom" not or having a extreme less option to taking only the best troop, the best fast, the best elite, etc.. out of different armies makes using anyting else points.
3) Keywords/USR: We just need Unit and Weapon Keywords as a main rule, you can balance and add way more to units/weapons if they had a USR system. If we had (Infantry, swarms, Bike, Fly, Jump, Airborne, MC, Vehicle, Enormous or Giant, and Titan) you can scale balance so much easier. Want infant to be able t fallback from swarms but not bikes? easy done with keywords/USR. You want dedicated Anti infatry or Anti Tank weapons? USR makes it easy.
4) No more combat from both sides in the same player turn. Make OW for melee and make melee like Shooting.
5) Way to many books and rules all over the place


So far from 9th little information we got. It seems they are somewhat hitting on a few of these, which is good. I'll wait to hold out any more full judgements for in June when they give us more information.

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The Strange Dark One
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 17:30

Compared to previous editions I personally rather liked army building, I hope they don't screw it up for a system that sounds nice in theory only. I mean, does that mean Knights don't even need Guard as ally to max out their CP? Oh my God. Until there's more information available, I'm slightly concerned.

I was also just about to buy some Wraith units that I can convert into Castigators.
That aside, I don't think we really know that much more about 9th edition. I love that Blast weapons are coming, as I think they should have been part since start of 8th edition.

But the devil's in the details, so I expect much more to be presented in the coming weeks. I hope they revisit unit coherency so horde armies can't spread all over the board like a fungus.

@Archon_91 wrote:
I wonder if that means the Aeldari races will also become big players in the next edition as we are mortal enemies of the Necrons but who knows

It's certainly an opportunity, but so was Pychic Awakening. Similar to Blood of the Phoenix, I think the best we can hope for are plastic versions of Grotesques or Mandrakes with no further significance in the overall lore.


I'm glad there is finally some public information about 9th edition, but I can't say any of this blows me away. I hope Crusade is going to be fun, though. It's certainly a huge opportunity for games with friends.

Edit: Pretty much agree with Amish.
You are also true that the detachment system can be badly abused, I hope we end up with something reasonable that doesn't only promote mono-lists.

A revisited Keyword system is also something I'm looking forward to. This has been one of 8th best changes and I hope they refine it further.
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 20:31

A new edition? Awsome!

Can't wait for even more units and options to disappear from the DE codex whilst GW spend the next two+ years vomiting out wave after wave of new marine models.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 20:42

well lets see...

Also one thing you forgot to mention which affects us is flyer rule change in some way... They did mention that they wont be destroyed if they fly out of the table now but what exactly this means is to be seen... Are they going to be placed into reserve (which also comes back)? Also they mentioned they are going to feel more like aircraft now whatever that means...
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 20:43

Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 20:44

@Soulless Samurai wrote:
Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

but knights are fine n 1000 point games...?
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 21:57

@The Strange Dark One wrote:
Compared to previous editions I personally rather liked army building, I hope they don't screw it up for a system that sounds nice in theory only. I mean, does that mean Knights don't even need Guard as ally to max out their CP? Oh my God. Until there's more information available, I'm slightly concerned.

I was also just about to buy some Wraith units that I can convert into Castigators.
That aside, I don't think we really know that much more about 9th edition. I love that Blast weapons are coming, as I think they should have been part since start of 8th edition.

But the devil's in the details, so I expect much more to be presented in the coming weeks. I hope they revisit unit coherency so horde armies can't spread all over the board like a fungus.

@Archon_91 wrote:
I wonder if that means the Aeldari races will also become big players in the next edition as we are mortal enemies of the Necrons but who knows

It's certainly an opportunity, but so was Pychic Awakening. Similar to Blood of the Phoenix, I think the best we can hope for are plastic versions of Grotesques or Mandrakes with no further significance in the overall lore.


I'm glad there is finally some public information about 9th edition, but I can't say any of this blows me away. I hope Crusade is going to be fun, though. It's certainly a huge opportunity for games with friends.

Edit: Pretty much agree with Amish.
You are also true that the detachment system can be badly abused, I hope we end up with something reasonable that doesn't only promote mono-lists.

A revisited Keyword system is also something I'm looking forward to. This has been one of 8th best changes and I hope they refine it further.

Why are you concern? We have little to no information. Only hints at what is changing and the idea of a direction.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 22:17

@DevilDoll wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

but knights are fine n 1000 point games...?

For the record, I would very much like to see them (and other superheavies) disappear from standard 40k, too.

I know it will never happen but I can dream. Wink

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 22:19

@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

but knights are fine n 1000 point games...?

For the record, I would very much like to see them (and other superheavies) disappear from standard 40k, too.

I know it will never happen but I can dream. Wink

5th ed was my favourite, so I can agree with you, but they have been around long enough for me not to be overly salty anymore lol

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 22:39

I did get a sad, bitter chuckle out of them saying the PA rules were written with 9th edition in mind. If true, this means that in the next edition, Covens will be our best shooting faction and Kabals will be our best CC faction Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSat May 23 2020, 23:28

I have mixed feelings. There's definitely problems in 8th that I hope will be fixed with a new edition. On the other hand, GW has a habit of starting a new edition really frak up, slowly fixing it with updates and Chapter Approved books and such, and then when it finally seems to kinda work, they start all over again. The current edition is more balanced than any previous edition I ever played. The fact that current codexes will remain usable is positive. It indicates that they aren't doing a complete wipe again. Maybe this 9th edition will be more like an 8.1 edition. I sure hope so.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 00:09

@Cavash wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

but knights are fine n 1000 point games...?

For the record, I would very much like to see them (and other superheavies) disappear from standard 40k, too.

I know it will never happen but I can dream. Wink

5th ed was my favourite, so I can agree with you, but they have been around long enough for me not to be overly salty anymore lol

Other than like maybe 4-5 things, 5th was my favorite too (Missions, dangerous terrain, hitting flatout speed vehicles in melee, stuff like that) but it still was my favorite for sure. And best DE book every, even if it wasn't top tier. Also some of the best characters for nids.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 04:15

@Squidmaster wrote:
Well, its official now:
- All Codexes etc still valid, and Psychic Awakeningg written with 9th in mind.

This comes as a major disappointment. We need a new and genuine codex update.


Quote :
- Command Points now a set amount it seems, and you pay for Detachments and unlocking second Codexes etc.

Drukhari don't take Detachments for WLTs, Stratagems or Relics... because we don't have any. We take Detachments because the army is arbitrarily divided by subfactions. GW has lost their minds if they expect us to play Cult or Cabal.
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 12:19

@amishprn86 wrote:
@Cavash wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

but knights are fine n 1000 point games...?

For the record, I would very much like to see them (and other superheavies) disappear from standard 40k, too.

I know it will never happen but I can dream. Wink

5th ed was my favourite, so I can agree with you, but they have been around long enough for me not to be overly salty anymore lol

Other than like maybe 4-5 things, 5th was my favorite too (Missions, dangerous terrain, hitting flatout speed vehicles in melee, stuff like that) but it still was my favorite for sure. And best DE book every, even if it wasn't top tier. Also some of the best characters for nids.

That Nid codex was the worst. They took a really interesting codex for Nids with loads of variety and interesting units and stream lined it to boringness while making the army require "synergy"; and pointed them to include that synergy. which sort of worked while every single unit you had survived, but as soon as you passed turn one and lost a couple of units the whole thing fell apart.

At least you had the doom of malantai, but that was all you had.

I really enjoyed DE in 4th and 5th, even before the 5th ed codex, as our units could fly in transports, get out and charge. So much speed so much damage, so much glass hammeriness! And an aspect I miss from our current army as the damage in melee just isn't there from our fast units.

8th is probably my favorite edition (lthough i haven't played a game for 18 months!), but second will always hold a nutty place in my heart.

On topic; excited by 9th. Adding terrain rules will help so much. Playing on planet bowling ball sucks. Happy they are dealing with the soup and command point situation, although from the rumours it isn't how I'd solve the situation, but hey. They've made a call and I'm exicted to see how it goes. (could have been a beta rule though)
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 15:16

@LordSplata wrote:
@amishprn86 wrote:
@Cavash wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:
@Soulless Samurai wrote:
Maybe they could fly off every board any into Apocalypse, where they belong.

but knights are fine n 1000 point games...?

For the record, I would very much like to see them (and other superheavies) disappear from standard 40k, too.

I know it will never happen but I can dream. Wink

5th ed was my favourite, so I can agree with you, but they have been around long enough for me not to be overly salty anymore lol

Other than like maybe 4-5 things, 5th was my favorite too (Missions, dangerous terrain, hitting flatout speed vehicles in melee, stuff like that) but it still was my favorite for sure. And best DE book every, even if it wasn't top tier. Also some of the best characters for nids.

That Nid codex was the worst.   They took a really interesting codex for Nids with loads of variety and interesting units and stream lined it to boringness while making the army require "synergy"; and pointed them to include that synergy.   which sort of worked while every single unit you had survived, but as soon as you passed turn one and lost a couple of units the whole thing fell apart.

At least you had the doom of malantai, but that was all you had.

I really enjoyed DE in 4th and 5th, even before the 5th ed codex, as our units could fly in transports, get out and charge.  So much speed so much damage, so much glass hammeriness! And an aspect I miss from our current army as the damage in melee just isn't there from our fast units.

8th is probably my favorite edition (lthough i haven't played a game for 18 months!), but second will always hold a nutty place in my heart.

On topic; excited by 9th. Adding terrain rules will help so much.  Playing on planet bowling ball sucks. Happy they are dealing with the soup and command point situation, although from the rumours it isn't how I'd solve the situation, but hey.  They've made a call and I'm exicted to see how it goes. (could have been a beta rule though)

Yes the nids were bad, but i liked the special characters, other HQ's and how they played, 4th was for sure the best nids for unit rules. I was moreso talking about I liked 5th the most even tho i played DE and Nids at the time, that shows how much i didn't like 6th, and 7th got really good for me, but only after i got the Corsairs book (7th Corsairs was the most fun i'll eve have, but there was so much not ot like about 7th, we played with house rules, only 1 unit with D, only 1 formation).

8th was great for the 1st year, but as you said you have not played in 18months, it has just gotten worst every month after that. More and more faqs, more and more OP combos and rules, more and more broken metas (unlikee the start of 8th, broken meta was just spam, now its Unit A with rules ABCDEFG, Oh you forgot i had rule RTY, oh you got i could do that right now? well to bad).



What rumor did you see? On twitch they said it will cost CP's to take a detachment for a different Faction (they didn't say how much), so we don't know (unless it got leaked) how much CP we start with and how much CP ally detachments cost.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 15:43

That’s the same rule I’ve seen.
It always felt like an issue they could have solved so easily by saying you can’t use stratagems expect from your warlords faction.
All of a sudden soup armies take a hit. Not a death knell, but It forces some decisions.

The whole marine debacle from the outside did sound crazy. And the number of rerolls is not something I’m a fan of at all. There was a reason they found guiiliman so hard to balance at first, but did they learn?
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 16:11

@LordSplata wrote:
That’s the same rule I’ve seen.
It always felt like an issue they could have solved so easily by saying you can’t use stratagems expect from your warlords faction.
All of a sudden soup armies take a hit. Not a death knell, but It forces some decisions.

The whole marine debacle from the outside did sound crazy. And the number of rerolls is not something I’m a fan of at all.  There was a reason they found guiiliman so hard to balance at first, but did they learn?

That's pretty much what I would have proposed. Bind CP-generation to their factions. 12 CP from a Guard Brigade can only be used on Guard Stratagems, end of story. CP generated from Labyrinthine Cunning can only be used on Drukhari Stratagems etc.

The current system had a lot to offer and there were many ways you could have improved it. I think the Raiding Party was a great rule that only needed some tweaking. Similar systems could be set into place for other factions to help them have more CP.

@Amish because of those reasons, my concern is that they start a completely new system from scratch. They probably start with something that sounds like a good idea, but then it takes another edition until it's actually balanced. And then it is changed again. I think there is much more room to screw up than to actually improve.
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 18:54

IMO, there are 3 main rules that's going to affect us positively, everything else is really who cares.

1. Cover/Terrain - This one is absolutely gigantic because it might allow us to actually move around with our vehicles again for advantageous shooting.

2. Mono armies getting benefits in CP - Soup armies take a hit, DE-only armies will benefit. I've always thought in 8th that we were better by ourselves after the Jinx/Doom nerf. This will only benefit us.

3. Strategic reserves changing - One of the biggest benefits if this is done correctly. Being able to drop in blasters or outflank with larger units of Wyches will change the game for us.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 19:22

@HERO wrote:

2. Mono armies getting benefits in CP - Soup armies take a hit, DE-only armies will benefit.

Unless they want to take more than 1 subfaction.

Because if you want to take Kabal *and* Coven, then you have to either spend CPs to buy extra detachments or else shove everything in a single detachment and so won't get any Kabal or Coven traits.

Can't say I'm particularly hyped.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 20:08

At 1:20:45 mark https://www.twitch.tv/videos/629530944

They said per codex (I just hope they mean that and not per faction and said codex) But we have some hope at least.

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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeMon May 25 2020, 02:56

Or we get some special rule allowing a Kabal, a coven and a cult being together (as the codex was designed this way)
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PostSubject: Re: 40k 9th Editon   40k 9th Editon I_icon_minitimeMon May 25 2020, 06:05

@LordSplata wrote:
Or we get some special rule allowing a Kabal, a coven and a cult being together (as the codex was designed this way)

I am hoping that useless patrol rule of ours turns into just this instead.

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