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 Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?

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hydranixx
Wych
hydranixx

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Join date : 2013-11-26

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PostSubject: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeMon May 18 2020, 03:22

If you've played Dark Technomancer Talos, would you ever consider replacing their Haywire Blasters with Stinger Pods?

Benefits of Haywire Blasters:

- The Haywire special rule, which is strong against vehicles, and really enjoys benefitting from the +1 to wound.
- They offer AP-1, which is quite nice against a variety of targets, but especially lightly armoured infantry and vehicles.

Benefits of Stinger Pods:

- Almost twice as many shots on average; 2d6 vs 2d3 from the Haywire Blasters
- 1 point cheaper per model.
- Base strength of 5.
- Counts as a single weapon as opposed to two individual weapons, so there's less chance you'll wound yourself twice in one shooting phase.
- Similarly, they're twice as fast to roll with as you don't need to roll each individual Haywire Blaster separately. It is possible to roll different coloured dice to fast-roll your Haywire Blasters, but even so, you'd need 6 unique colours of dice to fast-roll a squadron of Talos, and then need to remember which is which.

Having double the shots and +1 Strength are the most appealing parts for me. Wounding MEQ on 2s with 2 damage is where you want to be to force saves and wipe Primaris Marines out in droves.

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fisheyes
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fisheyes

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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeThu May 21 2020, 12:57

Why stinger pods over dual splinter cannons? Sure it is slightly less points, but the volume of fire and range make a big difference
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sekac
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sekac

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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeThu May 21 2020, 14:37

@fisheyes wrote:
Why stinger pods over dual splinter cannons? Sure it is slightly less points, but the volume of fire and range make a big difference

To be clear, the 2x splinter cannon has added range at lower volume. It only has higher volume at shorter range than the splinter pod. Volume an range are an either/or situation, the splinter cannon does not have both advantages simultaneously.

You're also not acknowledging that having 2 guns instead of 1 means you inflict half as many mortal wounds on yourself.

The other advantage splinter pods have is their versatility. Being strength 5, they wound primaris on 2+ and vehicles on 4+. 2x splinter cannons will wound primaris on 3s and vehicles on 5s, so it's worse at both jobs in terms of quality of fire. Quantity is the only thing that saves

So for one extra point, you kill yourself twice as fast, kill primaris a little better (at short range), but you're less effective at killing vehicles.

I prefer the stinger pods simply because I can't get that profile anywhere else. If I want a DT platform killing itself with mortal wounds, I'll take a venom.
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hydranixx
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hydranixx

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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeFri May 22 2020, 03:13

@sekac wrote:

I prefer the stinger pods simply because I can't get that profile anywhere else. If I want a DT platform killing itself with mortal wounds, I'll take a venom.

I take it you've had a chance to run Talos this way? How'd you find them overall?

So far I basically assumed everyone just takes Haywire without thinking twice, so it's refreshing to read someone trying something different.

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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeFri May 22 2020, 04:20

DT HWB also deal D3 MW's on a 5+ and 1 MW on a 3+ for Anti-tank its worth it 100% for TAC you also have to add in the -1ap from HWB, that makes its 16% more damaging just from the AP PoV, having 0ap is rough.

IMO Talos are not Anti MEQ, we have to much anti MEQ at the moment, especially if you are going DT. Talos fills the Anti-tank and Anti- heavy army via HWB and Scalpels. If you wanted long range shooting to kill meq, just take DC.

With DT a Stinger pod only kills 1 Primaris on average, and its actually only a 95% chance to kill 1 (not not a full chance)
While the HWB only kills a Primaris 67% the time, they are honestly very close for a weapon that is not made to deal with infantry.

I honestly would rather take Cronos for Primaris hunters than Talos, As DT any wound roll on a 5+ is 2-4D for all of its weapons. It is also only 70pts (without the Probe) compare to 98pts, its 87pts cheaper per 3 with the same defensive stats and better anti Primaris weapons.

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sekac
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sekac

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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeFri May 22 2020, 04:35

I've only messed around with it briefly and for a fairly specific reason. A friend of mine plays (played) ITC a lot and runs a Ynnari/CW list with 3 wraithlords, 2 wraithseers, and Yvraine and The Visarch supporting them. I'm happy to be the whetstone on which the more competitive minded folks to hone their craft.

That damn near unkillable wraithseer, grrr....

Anyway, my typical recipe for list building is 2 detachments and a battalion, and I need legit tank busting in at least 2. I would never consider stinger pods if I don't have that rule fulfilled first. Lately (in a relative sense) with a ToS wych battalion with flyers and a detachment of at least 6 hayweavers.

There's a bunch of T8, 3+/5++ wounds running down your throat that haywire is awful against. The splinter cannons definitely work, but they also cause a lot of mortal wounds. I don't like powering up long range shots, and 2 mortal wounds is not uncommon at short range. The best thing about a talos defensively is that 7th wound. A single lucky shot won't kill it. If you take 2 mortal wounds, that advantage is gone.

So I usually take 3 venoms instead. They die to a breeze or a sneeze anyway, so what difference does it make?

So with dedicated haywire already present, dedicated poison already present, and the heavy hunting ToS flyers already present, I feel I've got a bit more freedom to have a weapon platform that has volume enough to threaten infantry, but high enough strength to also threaten monsters and vehicles alike.

I wouldn't start a list with splinter pods, but I'm attracted enough to their versatility to end there once I have my bases covered.
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LordSplata
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LordSplata

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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 12:27

@amishprn86 wrote:
DT HWB also deal D3 MW's on a 5+ and 1 MW on a 3+ for Anti-tank its worth it 100% for TAC you also have to add in the -1ap from HWB, that makes its 16% more damaging just from the AP PoV, having 0ap is rough.

Not being finicky; but you know stats are my jam, the -1 is way better than 16% improvement.
6+-> no save is 20% better
5+->6+ is 25% better
4+->5+ is 33%
3+->4+ is 50%
2+->3+ is 100%

16% improvement is if you rerolled a single negative result. (like re-roll 1's)
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers?   Stinger Pods in Dark Technomancers? I_icon_minitimeSun May 24 2020, 15:20

@LordSplata wrote:
@amishprn86 wrote:
DT HWB also deal D3 MW's on a 5+ and 1 MW on a 3+ for Anti-tank its worth it 100% for TAC you also have to add in the -1ap from HWB, that makes its 16% more damaging just from the AP PoV, having 0ap is rough.

Not being finicky; but you know stats are my jam, the -1 is way better than 16% improvement.
6+-> no save is 20% better
5+->6+ is 25% better
4+->5+ is 33%
3+->4+ is 50%
2+->3+ is 100%

16% improvement is if you rerolled a single negative result. (like re-roll 1's)

thanks

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