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 Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)

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ZaGstrike
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ZaGstrike

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PostSubject: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 02:06

Hi, i'm currently debating with myself as to which of these is better in my army.

All my troop choices are mounted, as is my HQ (both in mounted elite units), i plan to include a ravager and 2 squads of six reavers, as well as some harlequins on foot. My overall strategy is with shooty tactics, having my kabalite warriors firing from their raiders while staying out of range of return fire (for the most part) using their night shields.

Anyway, i've got 75 to 80 points to spare and am wondering if i should invest in a small squad of hellions or beastmasters.

With hellions i'd probably only be able to go with a basic squad, but with beastmasters i could get three kymera, two beastamasters and a razorwing flock.

Which would be the better choice?

(Also, would the old warp beast models be considered tacky to use as kymera?)
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 02:28

I use the old Warp Beasts as Kymera - if someone thinks it's tacky then they have no joy in their soul.

At 80 points or so, I'm not sure either unit is really a big win. All you're doing is buying a cheap distraction unit. Personally I'd probably go with RJBs if that was how many points I had.

If you're focused on this idea - then the simple question really is, what would you rather have?
An assault unit, or a shooty unit? (whatever others may say, Hellions are a shooting unit with minor assault capability)

Both units will do okay versus similar targets. The Hellions will be a touch faster, the Beasts will be a touch tougher to kill.

Of the two, I'd go Beasts because usually locking something up in assault is needed more than just some more poison shooting that the rest of my army has.

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ZaGstrike
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ZaGstrike

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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 03:01

Cool, thanks for the advice.

Yeah i think i'll go with the beastmasters, my army has plenty of shooty units already (the only wych squads i have are 5 wyches each and venom mounted), it'd be useful to have a CC unit ready as a back up if any of my main warriors get assaulted.
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kenny3760
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 09:57

With only 75-80 points to play with you will only get 5 hellions, that is nowhere near enough for them to be effective. The will die before they get to do anything.
The beast pack is the better option for the points, more wounds, wound allocation tricks, more attacks, and some inv saves as well.
Sure the hellions can shoot as well as assault but I just doubt they'll live long enough to do anything. I'd try and free up some points though to increase the size of the beast pack to make it more effective.

I
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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 17:16

actually, I would use those points to up the wych squad and put them in a raider (5 wyches isnt enough) or get a 3 man RJB squad w/ heat lance... but thats just me

Out of the two, beasts are better. Hands down.

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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 18:13

As for Khymere models, how about Warg Riders?

In price of 2 Dogs, You get 6... I doun't quite know what the hell are those (pups/cats?) things but they look cool.
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1080112

Also, Chaos Hounds. They are better deal than Wargs, however You need bases... and they don't look as good.
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440109a&prodId=prod1570038

Sadly no alternative "stock" models from GW, however You may make conversions from Ripper Swarms if You don't mind they are bugs.

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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 30 2011, 19:15

If you're actually excited by all the above and want to get rid of your old Warp Beasts models - let me have a right of first refusal on them Very Happy

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ZaGstrike
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 01 2011, 01:15

I've actually already written in two squads of 6 reavers with 2 cluster caltrops, a heat lance and a blaster each, i wanted to use my last fast attack slot for something different.



Thanks for the suggestions but personally i think there're a bit too... furry, for what i'd imagine a nightmare dog to look like. Through the magic of ebay i've already got my hands on the old warp beasts anyway, and i'll probably get some spawn tentacles to add some extra gribbly.

Although while we're suggesting alternative Kymerae what do you about using cold ones?
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Thor665
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 01 2011, 02:09

Hurm - I will note, you're paying 80 points for those Caltrops. That's 80 points you'll never use when shooting those heat lances and blasters. And you're trying to add in a support anti-infantry choice.

I'd sack the caltrops you'll still do decent damage turboboosting via only bladevanes, and add those 80 points to your other free 80 points and net yourself 160 points, which equals an excellent Beastmaster unit, or at least a larger mob of Hellions.

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thecactusman17
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 21 2011, 09:11

@ZaGstrike wrote:
Hi, i'm currently debating with myself as to which of these is better in my army.

All my troop choices are mounted, as is my HQ (both in mounted elite units), i plan to include a ravager and 2 squads of six reavers, as well as some harlequins on foot. My overall strategy is with shooty tactics, having my kabalite warriors firing from their raiders while staying out of range of return fire (for the most part) using their night shields.

Anyway, i've got 75 to 80 points to spare and am wondering if i should invest in a small squad of hellions or beastmasters.

With hellions i'd probably only be able to go with a basic squad, but with beastmasters i could get three kymera, two beastamasters and a razorwing flock.

Which would be the better choice?

(Also, would the old warp beast models be considered tacky to use as kymera?)

Hellions are a great unit, but without the Baron and a number of extra wounds to soak you simply won't last long enough to make a difference. In this case, definitely go with the Beastmasters. If model collection is an issue for you (a full unit of those things costs somewhere around $150) I would advise looking at the Fantasy range, where for the same $150 and a bit of extra effort you will get up to 3 full units.
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Grumpy Kwi
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PostSubject: Re: Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request)   Hellions vs Beastmasters (advice request) I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 21 2011, 14:50

I use the old cold ones for a while - dumb as looking dinosaur running loose in the 41st millennium. That got old real quick and became a little embarrassing making dinosaur noises and saying "nom-nom" all the time.

Whatever you use, be sure to put them on the round terminator bases as using the old rectangular Calvary bases is not the same. I am sure someone can find a way to take advantage of the old bases and to tell you the truth you really do not get the true eye-opener to see how much space a decent beast squad really uses - it is truly a huge footprint!

On the note of using different pieces, I like the Strange Dudes idea for the flocks. I was lucky enough to get my hands on some forgeworld winged ripper swarms and just used those instead of the birds. Although mine are more of an organic "flock" I somehow still like the idea of a mechanical flying/spinning razor blade that the beastmaster controls, seems more evil.

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