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 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list

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Gammal
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Gammal

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PostSubject: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeSat Jan 16 2016, 23:15

Hello everyone, first post here Smile
I have been lurking around the forums for quite some time, since I decided to play the space-elves, so... hello again!

Now I got 2 lists, but lets start with my 1200, the 1850 is just a expansion of the first list, the master plan will be revealed as soon as we get to 1850.  

The idea was to create something fun and to use the models that (to me) look the coolest, but still be a bit competitive, its a weird combo, and not always easy to achieve, but have a loom if you will.

So here is my go!

1200pts - Combo Elves

Dark Eldar Combined arms Detachement. (realspace raiders)

HQ:
Archon
- Nothing here!
- Basically just to get the required HQ slot Smile

Troops:
5x Kabalite warriors
5x Kabalite warriors
- Filling troop req....

Fast Attack:
Raider - Night shield - Disintigrator cannon

Razorwing Jetfighter
-4x Shatterfield - Night shield

5 Scourges -3 Haywire blasters

Harlequin Formation: Cast of players

1 Shadowseer
1 Deathjester

Troupe
5 Players -3 Kisses
1 Master - Kiss

Eldar Formation: Aspect Host

6 Striking scorpions
1 Exarch - Scorpion Claw

6 Striking Scorpions
1 Exarch - Scorpion Claw

6 Warp Spiders
1 Exarch

1201 pts (usually ok!)


Now the list is weird, I get that.
The genreal plan is to get the Harlies in to transport, escorting archon perhaps, scorpion squads harass enemy lines giving time to get the transport out safe.
Flyer gives a nice alpha strike the turn it arrives, and with any luck the warp spiders also come knocking on the door early, and scourges doing their usual jazz popping tanks.

Anything to ad? Well, I think thats the basics of it anyway, if you are interested il go in to more detail.

Now, for the 1850!



HQ:
Archon - Power wep - Armour of misery - Webway portal

Court of the archon
2 medusa
3 Sslyth

Troops:

5x Kabalite warriors
5x Kabalite warriors
- Filling troop req....

Fast Attack:

Raider
- Night shield
- Disintigrator cannon

Razorwing Jetfighter
-4x Shatterfield - Night shield

5 Scourges
-4 Haywire blasters

Harlequin Formation: Cast of players

1 Shadowseer
- mask of secrets
1 Deathjester

Troupe
8 Players - 4 Kisses
1 Master - Kiss

Eldar Formation: Aspect Host

6 Striking scorpions
1 Exarch - Scorpion Claw

6 Striking Scorpions
1 Exarch - Scorpion Claw

6 Warp Spiders
1 Exarch

And here is the kicker!
Eldar Allied detachment!

HQ:
Autharch - Power wep

Troops:
5 Rangers

Fast Attack:
Crimson hunter

Heavy Support
Fire Prism



So there you have it!
Its an odd mix isnt it?
So I am looking at this wondering mainly a few things.

1. Is there enough bodies?  I know I cant hold objectives very well, but that might not be a problem if...
2. There is enough firepower? Subbing out a few upgrades and keeping many squads low in body count I managed to  fit a fire prism while still having "ok-ish" bodies. But then comes the question:
3. Is 2 flyers overkill? I mean I do have 1 for countering other flyer (eldar) and one helping out with ground forces (DE), I can easily switch fireprism or one flyer out for basically anything, for example adding more bodies.
What do you guys think?
Is it total garbage, or does it look interesting?

Would love to hear some opinions.
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hydranixx
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hydranixx

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 17 2016, 04:08

It strikes me as lacking transports for the Kabalite Warriors and Court of the Archon.

- The Court need a transport so they won't eat one blast that hits all the entire unit of them. Try a raider if you're going wwp mode with the archon and his court.

- Kabalites are often bought so that we can access venoms anyway.. so grab 2 of these. They can serve as more than minimum troop requirements if they're on a venom.

Excess upgrades that you don't need:
Archon Power Weapon - either drop it entirely or make it an Agoniser.
Razorwing Nightshields - 15 points spent better elsewhere.
Shatterfield missles - try 2 Shatterfields and 2 Monoscythes. Its cheaper, and some of your missles will now have some ap.

As for your eldar, I don't know enough about prisms this edition. I like the Warp Spiders. I'd play more Very Happy The scorpions might die on their own when they infiltrate as nothing else can move fast enough to support them. I'd scrap the prism for more transports/fast moving things.

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"Of course you should fight fire with fire! You should fight everything with fire."
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Gammal
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Gammal

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 17 2016, 10:51

I do agree with the assessment that i´m transport light.
But I do have "speed" anyway, just about everything either deep strikes, moves fast or has a transport.

2 scorpion squads infiltrate, 5 scouts infiltrate, warpsider/scourges deep strike/move fast
Harlies in transport, court+archon+autarch deepstrike, 2planes come from reserve.
I have ONE back line fire support platform in the field turn one, and thats the prism, why would I get rid of it? That would leave my backline terribly empty.
Im not trying to make a raider/venom spam list, im trying to make a list that works without them.

The ONLY thing that is "slow" is two 5man squads, and they are supposed to be backline firepower anyways, I have many things going offensive as is.
3 extra venoms, thats the prism and most gear removed, I feel I lose to much starting on the board.
And the archon+court+ aurtrarch are going in webway, so I cant use transport for those Smile

Edit: Oh and dont forget! Warp spiders and scorpions are 3+ save. sp pretty durable ^^

Removing the uppgrades you suggested I can bump the spiders up to 9 strong, seems good ,^^
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Gammal
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Gammal

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 17 2016, 15:27

So with some tinkering, how about this for 1850?

Cast of player (8players)
Jester
Shadowseer
- Raider from DE - 10 man squad

HQ
Archon
- webway
-amour of misery
Joined by: Court of the archon (3 sslyth 2 medusa) and
Eldar Exarch (all deepstriking)

Troops_
5 Kabalites
- venom, splinter cannon
5 Kabalites
- Venom, splinter cannon

5 Eldar Rangers

Fast:
Raider - Nightshield (for harlies)
Razorwing Jetfighter 2mono, 2 Shatter
5Scourges - 4haywire blasters

Heavy
Warp Hunter - another 7 warspiders (same point cost) also a possibility.

Aspect Host formation
6 Scorpions + exarch (7 bodies)
6 Scorpions + exarch
8 warpspiders + Exarch (9 bodies)

The prism and eldar flyer is gona to make room for Venoms and Warp hunter. Thoughts?

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Gammal
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Gammal

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeSun Jan 17 2016, 22:49

Another iteration of the list ^^
man Ive been going at this the whole weekend.
Would really love some feedback !


HQ
Autarch (for better reserve rolls)

Archon, Webway, armour of misery

troops:

5 Kabalites
- Venom, Splinter cannon
5 kabalites
- Venom, splinter Cannon
5 Rangers

Elites:
5 Wraith Blades
- Axe and force shield (now joins the archon in webway)

Fast attack:

1 Raider - Night shield
1 Razorwing Jetfighter 2-2 missiles

5 Scourges - 4 Haywireblasters
5 Scourges - 4 Heat Lances


Formations

Harlies: (goes in raider)
Cast of players
10 bodies
1 shadow seer
1 Deathjester
8 players - 4 kisses

Aspect Host:


6(7) Striking Scorpions
- Exarch with Scorpion Claw

6(7) Striking Scorpions
- Exarch with Scorpion Claw

8(9) Warpspiders
- Exarch, Twin linked deathspinner



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hydranixx
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hydranixx

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 18 2016, 23:31

@Gammal wrote:

And the archon+court+ aurtrarch are going in webway, so I cant use transport for those Smile

They are allowed to take a transport. The Webway Portal gives non scatter deep strike to their transport too. It makes the Court a little tougher to kill, and you can abuse the open top transport rule to shoot anywhere off its hull, so you increase the range of your stuff inside substantially. Also, templates are fantastic firing from the hull. Grab a raider, you won't regret it.


@Gammal wrote:

I have ONE back line fire support platform in the field turn one, and thats the prism, why would I get rid of it? That would leave my backline terribly empty.

For exactly that reason - there's ONE. One target is easy to kill as most of your opponents army can focus it down instantly. Eldar tanks are pretty big, and they skim, so there's low chances of hiding it completely. Honestly, it might work for you, but the venoms are likelier to survive if you place them in safe places and keep the Kabalite Warriors outside, about 5-6" away.

You won't get tabled easily.

@Gammal wrote:

Edit: Oh and dont forget! Warp spiders and scorpions are 3+ save. sp pretty durable ^^

Don't let 3+ fool you. You're still t3 and will die pretty quick. There's a lot of weapons out there that seem made almost just for killing MEQ - Helldrakes, Battlecannons, Inferno Bolts, and all of this stuff eats t3 even easier. Keep your spiders mobile and be aware where the ap3 is. As for the the scorpion squads, keep them small, and in cover, if you insist on playing them.

@Gammal wrote:

Elites:
5 Wraith Blades
- Axe and force shield (now joins the archon in webway)

This is not going to be terribly scary, because they'll be sitting around for a turn doing nothing. They can still die to small arms fire. If they're the only thing nearby, you can bet a few lasguns are going to start forcing saves. Wraithguards are better for their powerful, pinpoint shooting -owing to their guns and the webway portal.

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Tounguekutter
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Tounguekutter

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19 2016, 05:57

Hi Gammal!

I'm glad hydranixx gave you a pretty gentle critique, I feel it's important to not shoot down players before they even get to the table (nice job hydranixx cheers ).  I just wanted to let you know I'd recommend using your Archon model as a Lhamaean.  A naked Archon is sadly about as tough and dangerous as a Lhamaean, as his extra wounds hardly help him survive longer.  A Lhamaean may not be an independent Character, but just hold her in reserves and deploy her as far away as possible from the enemy and then you have some spare points to spend on your force.  This could allow you to give Blasters to your warriors or maybe take out one unit and add two cheaper units in its place - I'm sure you can do something more useful with those points than sinking it into an HQ that although fluffy is so very disappointing.  Sad

Shameless plug: In the fan codex I'm currently working on, Archons are 20 points cheaper naked and can take Hellion Skyboards, Reaver Jetbikes, or the Scourge treatment and function kind of like old Dark Elf assassins did in Warhammer Fantasy before it became Sigmar (which I don't view as a bad thing btw, Sigmar is a fun game IMO)

_________________
My 8th edition fandex is complete enough for appraisal (note that I completed it before any previews had been released) .  I'm sure there are inconsistencies, please let me know where they lie as you find them.  Thank you!  Click here for fandex
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hydranixx
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hydranixx

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19 2016, 10:13

@Tounguekutter wrote:
Hi Gammal!

I'm glad hydranixx gave you a pretty gentle critique, I feel it's important to not shoot down players before they even get to the table (nice job hydranixx cheers ).

Hey, everyone needs a light welcoming to the Dark Kin! Smile

I thought Gammal's list had some really cool stuff in it, and some interesting ideas. I never see scorpions or prisms these days, so was fascinated by his inclusion of them. They're not necessarily weak units, just not things I have any authority on.

@Tounguekutter wrote:
I just wanted to let you know I'd recommend using your Archon model as a Lhamaean.  A naked Archon is sadly about as tough and dangerous as a Lhamaean, as his extra wounds hardly help him survive longer.  A Lhamaean may not be an independent Character, but just hold her in reserves and deploy her as far away as possible from the enemy and then you have some spare points to spend on your force.  This could allow you to give Blasters to your warriors or maybe take out one unit and add two cheaper units in its place - I'm sure you can do something more useful with those points than sinking it into an HQ that although fluffy is so very disappointing.  Sad

Totally agree. You can go with any configuration of the Court of the Archon models and wind up better than the singleton Archon. Even a Haemonculus would be better for the extra toughness and Master of Pain rule, though admittedly, there's not really any big Dark Eldar unit to take advantage of that.

Consider a single Lhamaean and a venom for only 15 points more than the Archon's total himself. It will do a lot more than him for your list.

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"Of course you should fight fire with fire! You should fight everything with fire."
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Gammal
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Gammal

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19 2016, 21:20

Thanks guys!
Latest list, ive done a lot of thinking these past days, and I think im more happy with this latest version of the list!
Check it out Smile

Cast of Players formation:
Death Jester
Shadowseer
-Mask of Screts
- Crescendo

Aspect formation (+1 WS)
6(7) Scorpions
-Exarch with claw

6(7) Scorpions
-Exarch with claw

5(6) swooping hawks
- Exarch

Aspect host (+1 BS)
7(Cool Warp Spiders
-Exarch

7(Cool Warp Spiders
-Exarch

5(6) Swooping hawks
- Exarch

HQ.
Autarch (for reserve rolls)

5 Rangers

DE:

Lhameans

5kabalites, 1 blaster
- Venom, splinter cannon

5kabalites,
- Venom, splinter cannon

1 Raider (night shields) - For Harlies
1 Razorwing Jetfighter - Splinter Cannon

5 Scourges, 4 hawywire blasters

1849.


So how about that!?
I got more scorps infiltraiting (yeah I like scorps Wink ), I got the same number of spiders but now with +1 BS
The hawks add a big pie plate each on the turn they arrive, and 6 haywire attacks in combat, with much needed firepower on more numerous troops. They also give me a better check for flyers.
The rest is pretty much the same

What ya think? Smile
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hydranixx
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hydranixx

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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 20 2016, 03:02

I think it can be pretty good dude.

I've heard impressive things about Swooping Hawks, so they're a good choice. You already know my bias for Warp Spiders, so of course I like seeing even more of them. If I may ask, how are they getting +1 BS? Does the Aspect host/formation give you a choice of +1 bs or +1 ws?

If scorpions are your thing, hey go for it. Eldar units are pretty good across the board.

As for the Dark Eldar contingent, I think this is much more efficient use of your points. The Lmahaean plays no part in the plan, but is super cheap so that's ok.

Your venoms are there for target saturation and objectives, and with Kabalites on board they pose a serious threat to high toughness creatures. Consider keeping them in reserve for deepstrike. The scourges balance out your anti tank, and also love deep strike, and the Jetfighter can do horrible, horrible things to infantry.

I especially like your load out on it actually. Cheap, focused, and good against all infantry, be they lightly or heavily armoured. You'll get a lot of mileage out of it, and it doesn't set you back too much.

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"Of course you should fight fire with fire! You should fight everything with fire."
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Gammal
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 20 2016, 21:55

Thansk Hydranixx ^^

Yeah I feel a lot more confident, and I was having trouble getting the webway feel "worth it" anyways, so why not scrap it and tkae more unnits ^^

Yeah, the aspect formation, wich im using two of, lets you either get +1ws or +1bs for the entire formation, so pretty sweet.
In an ideal world I would loke both my swooping units to get the +1 WS making their haywire attacks in CC more reliable.

Thank you guys so much for your help, I think im happy with this list for now, got a game the friday for 1200 points, wich will be my first game ever with the Eldar alliance.
Wish me luck Smile
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PostSubject: Re: 1850 - 1200. Wierd combo list   1850 - 1200.  Wierd combo list I_icon_minitime

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