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 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining

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HERO
Mr Believer
flakmonkey
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flakmonkey
Sybarite
flakmonkey

Posts : 333
Join date : 2013-03-05

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PostSubject: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 13 2015, 08:59

Hey Commorragh,

So I haven't had many games this year (1, maybe 2) with my Dark Kin. I've been messing around with CSM models and dealing with real life.
I do have a game coming up, against either CSM or Blood Angels. I've messed around alot with Allies in the past, but I wanted to run a straight up DE shooting list. I'm doing a 1650 point list, current total is 1610- What to fill in the last 40 points with?

And here it is, in all its boring, repetitive glory-

HQ

Archon 110
Blaster and WebWay Portal

Elites

Kabalite Trueborn 170
5 Trueborn, 4 Blasters, Disintergrator on Raider

Troops

Kabalite Warriors in Raider 175
10 Kabalites with Blaster, Dark Lance, Aether Sails and Splinter Rack on Raider

Kabalite Warriors in Raider 175
10 Kabalites with Blaster, Dark Lance, Aether Sails and Splinter Rack on Raider

Kabalite Warriors in Venom 120
5 Kabalites, 1 blaster, Dual Splinter Cannons on Venom

Kabalite Warriors in Venom 120
5 Kabalites, 1 blaster, Dual Splinter Cannons on Venom

Kabalite Warriors in Venom 120
5 Kabalites, Blaster, Dual Splinter Cannons on Venom

Kabalite Warriors in Venom 120
5 Kabalites, Blaster,
Dual Splinter Cannons on Venom

Fast Attack

Razorwing Jetfighter 140
2 Disintergrator Cannons, Splinter Cannon, Necrotoxin missiles

Razorwing Jetfighter 150
2 Dark Lances, Splinter Cannon, Monoscythe missiles

Heavy

Ravager 125
3 Dark Lances

Ravager 125
3 Dark Lances

Suggestions are more than welcome and greatly appreciated.

Oh yeah, I should mention I've been reading alot of HERO blog lately Very Happy


Last edited by flakmonkey on Fri Mar 13 2015, 17:58; edited 1 time in total
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Mr Believer
Wych
Mr Believer

Posts : 727
Join date : 2011-09-11
Location : Nottinghamshire, UK

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 13 2015, 16:57

Ooh, stuff is going to get hosed, nice! Hmmm, forty points isn't going to get you much... Shadowfield on the Archon perhaps, or night shields on the Razorwings? Perhaps spreading the blaster love around a little more might be good, as in giving those other two Venom squads a blaster each.

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HERO
Hekatrix
HERO

Posts : 1057
Join date : 2012-04-13

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 13 2015, 17:37

Drop all Warrior Splinter Cannons for Blasters. S8 AP2 threatens a lot more units than just Poison shooting, especially when you can fire off the Poison first and then allocate that AP2 lance on something worthwhile. With straight poison, you can't do that.

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flakmonkey
Sybarite
flakmonkey

Posts : 333
Join date : 2013-03-05

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 13 2015, 18:06

The Prophet of Firepower speaks!
Good point with blaster and poison, it makes sense to have the unit inside being able to threathen armour as well the dudes inside. Although I have benn unlucky in the past with single blasters. I guess it makes sense to have 6 units with the capability.
My list has just become a knock-off of HEROs now.
But I share his belief that the more exotic units in our army lack the consistance performance of gun boats.
I've tried more CC orientated units in the past and have been disappointed. Nothing really stands up to a unit of Sang Guard or Chaos Lord with Spawn. Much better to hose them with shots.

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"Whereas the duty of the Imperial Commander is either to seize or defend territory, the Dark Eldar make war only to steal. If, as a by-product of this, the are able to indulge their vile passion for murder, torture and other decadent acts, then they will joyfully do so, but this is not their primary goal"
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HERO
Hekatrix
HERO

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 13 2015, 19:46

That's fine. I think there's 3 main playstyles that is DE atm: MSU fast movers like Reavers to overwhelm the opposing army, extreme durability through Haemonculus units, or mass shooting from Kabal units.

They each have their own strengths and weaknesses, but I think extreme shooty mechanized Kabal has the least.

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Bleaksoul Brethren
Sybarite
Bleaksoul Brethren

Posts : 252
Join date : 2014-09-02
Location : San Antonio

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 14 2015, 00:28

Personal preference is to get night shields on things that matter (blasterborn raider) but thats the only thing. I love that 3+ save (it has saved me many times).
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flakmonkey
Sybarite
flakmonkey

Posts : 333
Join date : 2013-03-05

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 14 2015, 03:58

I do see the advantages of night shields, but with the way the list is at the moment the only way to get them is to either drop weapon upgrades or splinter racks.
Splinter racks will allow the warriors to shoot effectively even if the raider is jinking, which I'm more concerned with. And I doubt the trueborn will survive their drop and shoot.
They'll probably get torched by a flamer Sad I do so hate flamers this edition.

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"Whereas the duty of the Imperial Commander is either to seize or defend territory, the Dark Eldar make war only to steal. If, as a by-product of this, the are able to indulge their vile passion for murder, torture and other decadent acts, then they will joyfully do so, but this is not their primary goal"
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krayd
Hekatrix
krayd

Posts : 1119
Join date : 2011-10-03
Location : Richmond, VA

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 14 2015, 20:25

I think the point costs on your kabalite warrior + raider squads are off. As they are written, they should cost 190 per unit, rather than 175.
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flakmonkey
Sybarite
flakmonkey

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 15 2015, 07:33

Double checked points costs of Raider Squads. Very confident total comes in at 175. Obviously can't list idividual costs-
10 kabalites
Blaster
raider
Aether sails
splinter racks
dark lance (this is mounted on the raider, not the kabalites)
175
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krayd
Hekatrix
krayd

Posts : 1119
Join date : 2011-10-03
Location : Richmond, VA

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 16 2015, 17:36

@flakmonkey wrote:

dark lance (this is mounted on the raider, not the kabalites)
175

Ah. That is where I was confused. I thought that the upgrade was for the squad and not the raider.
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StokieRich
Hellion
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Join date : 2014-01-02
Location : Exeter, Devon

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 18 2015, 11:01

@flakmonkey wrote:
I do see the advantages of night shields, but with the way the list is at the moment the only way to get them is to either drop weapon upgrades or splinter racks.
Splinter racks will allow the warriors to shoot effectively even if the raider is jinking, which I'm more concerned with. And I doubt the trueborn will survive their drop and shoot.
They'll probably get torched by a flamer Sad I do so hate flamers this edition.

Wait a minute, when jinking the Kabalites still fire at full BS right?

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Vasara
Incognito assault marine
Vasara

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Location : Vantaa

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 18 2015, 11:07

They do

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flakmonkey
Sybarite
flakmonkey

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PostSubject: Re: 1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining    1650 Shooty List - Needs Refining  I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 19 2015, 05:12

@StokieRich wrote:
Wait a minute, when jinking the Kabalites still fire at full BS right?

Again, poor phrasing on my part. I know the Kabalites suffer no penalty from jinking(my CSM opponent didnt and cried "OP" for rest of game) I just meant they'd keep re-rolling the whole game despite jinking.

I played a game with this list today, the Venoms do what they do, my Ravagers did nothing, my Razorwings were quite successful.The firepower of the Raider squads was good, but 1 got immobilized early on and struggled for targets. Also I think dissies would have been more udeful against CSM.

My biggest disappointment was my Archon/Trueborn squad. They dropped in T2, had perfect 6 Blsater shots at a LR Spartan and stripped 2 HPs. Then got their Raider shot out from under them and I ran the Archon away to make sure he didn't get killed.

So I ended up loosing(Linebreaker, 1 objective VS Firstblood, Linebreaker, 1 objective)

Any ideas on how to improve? I was thinking to make more Trueborn squads to fit in more blaster fire.
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