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 Archon's personal guard

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The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
The_Burning_Eye

Posts : 2501
Join date : 2012-01-16
Location : Rutland - UK

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PostSubject: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 09 2014, 14:40

Ok so I've got a club night with a string of 750pt games coming up next week. We're not going super-competitive, in fact positively friendly (it's Christmas after all!), so I've thrown out the lance heavy style I've been running recently.

After a couple of attempts that still looked pretty competitive in composition I decided my best bet was to go thematic. So, I threw out the battle forged concept and went unbound in an attempt to get something that resembled an Archon and his personal guard.

So here's what I came up with.

Archon
Armour of Misery, Agoniser, Blast Pistol, HWG, Shadowfield, Webway Portal

Archon's Court
2 Medusae in venom with dual cannons

Incubi Bodyguard
3 Incubi and Klaivex in venom with dual cannons

House Guard
5 Kabalite Trueborn with 3 blasters in venom with dual cannons

Scouts
5 Scourges with 4 Heat Lances

Total: 750 on the nose.

So what do you think - clearly it's not intended for a competitive setting, but I've got heat lances to tackle any armour or elite infantry, which can be deployed via webway.

There's a pair of Medusae to tackle dug in squads of nasty power armoured infantry if I'm facing that instead, again which could be deployed via webway if necessary

I've also got combat AP2 and 3 utility blasters alongside 6 splinter cannons for whittling down infantry lists.

Does this look like an Archon's personal guard to you? If not, what would you take instead.

Actually, let's make that a challenge - post your own 750 list with that theme in mind - it must contain an archon.

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Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

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High Archon Kraillach
Slave
High Archon Kraillach

Posts : 17
Join date : 2011-12-10

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 10:44

I keep seeing a lot of WWP's on people's army lists even though they have embarked their Archon in a Venom or Raider (by all means tell me to shush if I'm blatently misreading the codex) but are they really needed? Venoms and Raiders have Deep Strike, so would that not deem the WWP an unnecessary upgrade? Or is the WWP required for the embarked squad to Deep Strike with the Dedicated Transport?

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'I tell you that I will make any pact or bargain to gain the strength to free myself from the clutches of the tyrant.
I will have my freedom, no matter the cost.' - Archon Ysclyth of Talon Cyriix
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The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
The_Burning_Eye

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 11:06

The WWP isn't necessary to allow deep strike, or even deep strike in the transport - but it is necessary to make sure that the deep strike arrives exactly where you want it instead of potentially scattering - in the case of a transport with medusae in it, possibly resulting in them being out of range and getting shot to pieces in the following turn.

In this list, the flexibility given by the WWP on the Archon means that against 3+ armour I can deploy the medusae to wreak havoc, against armour or tough elites I can bring the heat lances in accurately within melta range, or I could use it to make sure the incubi get up close before their transport gets destroyed.

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Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

My Project Log - Visions of the Burning Eye

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High Archon Kraillach
Slave
High Archon Kraillach

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 11:38

Ah I see! Thank you, definitely putting them back in the list!

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'I tell you that I will make any pact or bargain to gain the strength to free myself from the clutches of the tyrant.
I will have my freedom, no matter the cost.' - Archon Ysclyth of Talon Cyriix
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koshi482
Kabalite Warrior
koshi482

Posts : 175
Join date : 2013-05-20
Location : United States

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 14:26

It's a hit and miss really. Templates are the only reason I see to get a wwp anything else does not need it if it has ds already. Too many points for blaster born and such for very little gain.

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The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 14:32

@koshi482 wrote:
It's a hit and miss really. Templates are the only reason I see to get a wwp anything else does not need it if it has ds already. Too many points for blaster born and such for very little gain.

Not even heat lances?

Sure, if your opponent has tanks with plenty of space behind them then you can target rear armour but I don't often find that on turn 2-3 when they're likely to arrive. Conversely, if I can just place the unit they'll fit into a gap 4-5" wide/deep.

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Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

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koshi482
Kabalite Warrior
koshi482

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 15:27

Maybe heat but you have more room to play with. But to go back on topic your list is very interesting.
I would list my list for 750 when I get my book in hand

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The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
The_Burning_Eye

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 18 2014, 15:44

Just discovered what I'm up against - it seems some of the other players have interpreted 'freindly' differently to me - there are five of us taking part in a league style format.

Me - Dark Eldar
Farsight Crisis Suit list
Eldar jetbike list
Grey knights with ID shooting
Nids with a flyrant, and 2 (yes, 2!) dakkafexes in tyrranocytes! Hate those things, they cost me my last game cos I thought they couldn't hold objectives!

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Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

My Project Log - Visions of the Burning Eye

My Gaming Log - Chronicles of the Burning Eye

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The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
The_Burning_Eye

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 19 2014, 12:46

Forgive the double post - I'm just providing a little follow-up on what actually happened.

I played two games in the end - the first against the nids when I got well and truly thrashed (although interestingly if the game had finished on turn five I'd have won). The Flyrant did what flyrants do so despite grounding it (haha!) on one turn it survived the game. I butchered my way through a couple of spawned units of termagants but weight of fire eventually told (as did the fact that of the three penetrating hits caused to me venoms, by non AP1 or AP2 weapons, two caused explosions).

The second game was the opposite - it ended on turn 5 and I lost, though another turn would have seen me well ahead. Not an excuse (I did nearly pull off a win after all) but my dice in this game were appallingly bad, with the exception of my scourges saving throws. Just a few examples - on two occasions, 12 full BS shots from splinter cannons caused a single wound. 3 blaster shots and two hits (average!) from trueborn caused no wounds on a crisis suit team in the open with 6 flamers facing down my incubi. My archon faced a single wound from a fusion gun. And failed his shadowfield save. I caused 5 wounds on the Tau Commander's unit (him and a drone) and, despite needing 4+ to save, the drone stopped all five wounds. One more penetrating hit on a venom from missile pods. Explosion.

I managed to whittle him down though, and in the end he'd got one full squad of 3 crisis suits with fusion blasters, one single crisis suit and his commander on a single wound facing my turn with two fully operational venoms and a four-man incubi squad. I'm confident my next turn would have seen the sole crisis suit and commander disappear, meaning he could only hold a single objective to my (potentially) three.

_________________
Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

My Project Log - Visions of the Burning Eye

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koshi482
Kabalite Warrior
koshi482

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 19 2014, 13:10

Lol nice recap there. It's always a war of attrition at those low points. Would have been great to see

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albions-angel
Kabalite Warrior
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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 26 2014, 12:08

Ouch. Thanks to this thread I just reread the WWP entry. That thing got nerfed since I last played. So it doesnt open a portal your reinforcements can come through like it used to then?
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The_Burning_Eye
Trueborn
The_Burning_Eye

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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitimeSat Dec 27 2014, 23:47

I'm afraid it doesn't no, though it still serves a purpose - just a very specific one that's quite costly so it's not a generic tactic for a whole army (not to my mind anyway - taking enough characters with them to really swamp your opponent gets expensive)

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Tan? You're joking, I'm a gamer, you're lucky I'm wearing deodorant!

My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

My Project Log - Visions of the Burning Eye

My Gaming Log - Chronicles of the Burning Eye

My Club - MAD Wargaming

My Fluff - Kabal of the Burning Eye, Cult of the Shadowed Blade and Coven of Distorted Perfection
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PostSubject: Re: Archon's personal guard   Archon's personal guard I_icon_minitime

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