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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 01 2014, 23:27

I'm not used to post on the forum, I've been lurking for a while now.

But today, I've come to seek counsel.

Some people think the Real Space detachment does not grant the status of Battle Forged army. Leaving troops without the objective secured rule.
According to the wording of the rule book, page 117, I think it does grant Battle Forged.

What do you think?

The Real Space Raider also grant cover save of 5+ to troops and 6+ to the rest for the first turn and any turn in which the night fighting rules are in effect.
But...
The rule book states that night Fight is in effect during game turn 1 on a 4+. But it does not mention if it might keep going the following turns. So why is it written as if it could in the Dark Eldar codex?

And last question, how does it affect and stack with other stealth and jink effects?
I would say it does'nt impact Jinks but Night shield makes it better by +1.

I hope my broken english won't scare you off, my french is way better but useless here.

Thank you for helping the noob that I am.
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Sigmaril
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 01 2014, 23:45

Real Space Raiders is most definately Battle-Forged.
It is not a Combined Arms Detachment, though, and this is the detachment which grant Objective Secured. Real Space Raiders get "Hunt From the Shadows" instead.
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fredpower
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 02 2014, 06:24

about the night there rules in other faction even eldar corsair that makes more night turns in a game
thats de idea for the formation with this part of 'buff'.
this 'detachament' give you a cover save extra but that will get stack with stelth and shouded rules because this rules improves the cover but jink units will not be benefited from this bonus by the fact jink gives you a cover save and this cover save can be refined for rules like stealth and shouded...
sry for my poor english.
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 02 2014, 13:14

Realspace Raiders ARE Battle-Forged, but being Battle-Forged does not grant Objective Secured.
Only being a Combined Arms Detachment grants the Objective Secured rule.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 02 2014, 14:02

@Squidmaster wrote:
Realspace Raiders ARE Battle-Forged, but being Battle-Forged does not grant Objective Secured.
Only being a Combined Arms Detachment grants the Objective Secured rule.

Or an Allied Detachment.

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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 02 2014, 16:11

So does that mean that you can have the Coven formations as part of the real space raiders detachment and then have a Combined arms detachment of standard DE for objective secured?

It would mean that you wouldn't have the freakish spectacle but a 5+/4+ cover save for the first turn on a disembarked Scalpel squadron is pretty nice! I don't know how useful it would be for grots though as they will almost always be in a raider.

I like the Detachment options that we now have but I will need to play a few games to find out which of them is best.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 02 2014, 16:17

@The_Hornet wrote:
So does that mean that you can have the Coven formations as part of the real space raiders detachment and then have a Combined arms detachment of standard DE for objective secured?

It would mean that you wouldn't have the freakish spectacle but a 5+/4+ cover save for the first turn on a disembarked Scalpel squadron is pretty nice! I don't know how useful it would be for grots though as they will almost always be in a raider.

I like the Detachment options that we now have but I will need to play a few games to find out which of them is best.

Not sure where to start here! Firstly, no model or unit can be part of more than one detachment. So you cannot have, say, a unit of Wracks being in both the Real Space Raiders detachment and the Scalpel Squadron formation.

Secondly, all of the formations and detachments in the Haemonculus Covens book have Freakish Spectacle but, as they are not part of the Realspace Raiders detachment they would not benefit from the cover save.

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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 03 2014, 01:02

What I was suggesting was that you used the coven formations/ relics and whatever whilst using them in the Real Space detachment as opposed to the Covenite Coterie Detachment, after looking at the detachment rules this of course cannot happen.

The only way to really use this with coven is to have your grotesques/wracks/whatever on the ground t1 as part of the real space detachment which is pointless.

I guess it just makes mandrakes that much harder to kill with a 2+ cover and can infiltrate them close to the enemy aswell.
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 03 2014, 11:29

Units in a Realspace Raiders Detachment can NOT take upgrades from the Haemonculus Covens supplement, nor can the Detachment take units from the Supplement.
Only the formations and detachments listed in the Haemonculus Covens supplement can use the rules and upgrades in the supplement.

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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 03 2014, 11:37

I think there are a lot of misunderstandings in 7th edition over formations, detachments, dataslates, supplements and codexes. There have been a few articles on this subject on various gaming websites but I might write something simple up, just as a guide.

EDIT - Actually, this article from Frontline Gaming seems to sum it up fairly well.

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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 03 2014, 19:51

Yep, Reecius breaks it down pretty well there. I actually discussed this extensively with him during collating the info for this video:
It says the same thing basically, but I give slightly different examples.
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 04 2014, 22:01

Thank you for your feedback.
I had my first game with my new Dark Eldar army last night against Tyranids and it was awesome.
Although I didn't need Hunt From The Shadow as much as I would have needed Objectif Secured.

Count Adhemar, I go read the article you mention. It is indeed a little confusing all those new ways to make a list.
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 28 2015, 19:49

If your primary (and only) detachment conforms to the Realspace Raiders requirements, do you still get the bonus? Or does it only apply to secondary attachments?
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PostSubject: Re: Real Space Raider questions   Real Space Raider questions I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 28 2015, 20:34

the primary detachment simply defines which one contains your warlord (and therefore can't be an allied detachment) but otherwise the command benefits apply to all detachments provided the minimum requirements are met.

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