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 Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated

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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 05 2014, 12:44

Hi guys,

Hoping to get some advice again as you've been really helpful so far.

I'm still in the process of assembling my Dark Eldar but a friend has challenged me to a 1500pt game against Blood Angels tomorrow night.

I have 1500pts but it needs to be bumped up with 3 flyers which my friend is aware of and will likely take additional aa from the space marine codex.

So here's the list as I've got it so far, I was wondering if there are any of the selections you would recommend playing around with to make it more efficient as I'm aware I've already nerfed myself by choosing to play a themed wych cult army.

Succubus with Archite Glaive and HWG

3 Incubi
Venom with 2x Splinter Cannon

10 Wyches with 3 Shardnet and Impalers
Hekatrix with Agoniser and HWG
Raider with Lance and Night Shields

10 Wyches with 3 Hydra Gauntlets
Hekatrix with Agoniser and HWG
Raider with Lance and Night Shields

5 Wyches
Venom with 2x Splinter Cannon

Razorwing Jetfighter with 2x Dissie and Night Shields

Razorwing Jetfighter with 2x Dissie and Night Shields

Razorwing Jetfighter with 2x Lance and Night Shields

9 Reavers with 3 Caltrops and 3 Blasters
Arena Champion with Agoniser

Thanks!
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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 05 2014, 13:10

Get as many reavers in the list as possible?

The real problem with this is that Blood Angels are happiest in the thick of the fighting, hitting you with bigger sticks than you're using to hit them.

Consequently you need to make sure you're hitting them first so the fewest possible numbers are hitting back. Reavers will give you that even if the BA are in cover thanks to their HoW hits. If you don't have any more models to take, seriously consider splitting them into 3-man units as an escort for your wych squads, you'll get HoW, then the wyches will hit next, you can also take any flamer hits on the tougher units that way. There's nothing stopping you ganging more than one unit up on a single enemy unit, but use hit and run to maximise as many charges as you can.

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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 05 2014, 13:28

that's a good shout thanks, I'll split them up for now into units of 3

I have 9 more on the way (another shardstorm box and a pack of reavers) however they certainly won't be here in time for tomorrow.

Once I have them the plan was to run 3 6 man units

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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 05 2014, 21:27

The_Burning_Eye wrote:

The real problem with this is that Blood Angels are happiest in the thick of the fighting, hitting you with bigger sticks than you're using to hit them. wyches.

Fixed.
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urden93
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 05 2014, 22:18

i used wyches for a few games new ed, and they can kill marines, just get them distraction from OW, hoemonculy,reavers, anything around, or a shadowfield archon. Planes are fun and so, but i personally dont like 2+ flyer in a list that feels another game. Hope it worked out :3
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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeWed Nov 05 2014, 22:34

In a vacuum, wyches can kill marines in combat. Also, if you charge with another unit to absorb overwatch first, they can do ok in combat. But if you have to purchase wyches, plus another unit to be able to assault stuff, are wyches really assault units?

And if they aren't assault units, what are they?
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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 12:05

Thanks guys, appreciate the feedback and advice on using reavers to tank overwatch (Still have no idea what to do if he shows up with a lot of flamers as I'm guessing I won't get jink on overwatch against a flamer)

My final list I'm going to take tonight after taking on board the feedback is as follows:

-----------

Succubus with Archite Glaive, Animus Vitae and HWG

3 Incubi
Venom with 2x Splinter Cannon

8 Wyches with 1 Hydra Gauntlet
Hekatrix with Agoniser and HWG
Raider with Lance, Night Shields and Enhanced Sails

8 Wyches with 1 Shardnet and Impaler
Hekatrix with Agoniser and HWG
Raider with Lance, Night Shields and Enhanced Sails

8 Wyches with 1 Hydra Gauntlet
Hekatrix with Agoniser and HWG
Raider with Lance, Night Shields and Enhanced Sails

Razorwing Jetfighter with 2x Lance and Night Shields

Razorwing Jetfighter with 2x Lance and Night Shields

Razorwing Jetfighter with 2x Lance and Night Shields

3 Reavers with Blaster and Caltrops

3 Reavers with Blaster and Caltrops

3 Reavers with Blaster and Caltrops

-----------

The reasons behind the changes are:

I fancy giving the AV a go on the Succubus although I know it's hit/miss it could make a big difference (Alternative is probably an extra incubi)

Spreading out of Wyches into 3 mid size units (Cool to try and spread threats

Switch one venom to Raider for additional lance shot

Switch dissies on razorwing for lances again, I'm concerned about my lack of anti tank

Reavers into 3 units to force opponent to choose and also tank overwatch for the assault units

-----------

That leaves me with:
3 x Lance and 3 x Blaster T1
6 additional lances once Flyers arrive
4 x HWG to try and finish any enemy armour off if lances fail.
2 x SC shots (I'm going to ATTEMPT to use the wyches for anti infantry in the most part)

-----------

Any final suggestions on tactics / deployment etc?

Is it worth me reserving any of it to mitigate alpha strike?

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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 12:06

Additionally - If an interceptor shoots at an arriving flyer and it jinks, it can't fire on that turn? or the following turn?

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urden93
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 13:47

i think following but not sure, why blasters btw? i think HL is superior on reavers good ap, relatively high S for termy/SM thingies, 2 point where blaster is better is monsters or 9"+ range, but tbh reavers gonna be turbo boosting or being alrdy close enough to get the melta for blasting tanks
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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 14:24

the shooting phase following you declaring jink.

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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 15:09

worried about the distance really.

I can shoot the blaster from 18" away but to get the most out of the heat lances I need to be within 9", I guess if I'm assaulting anyway it may not be much difference...

I'll perhaps try one of them as a heat lance tonight and make a decision after the game for the future.

Thanks again for your input

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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 15:12

Ah ok, so if I arrive via reserve turn 2 and got shot at by an interceptor, I'm then snap shots for that turns shooting phase but fine again T3

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asdrubael Vect124
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 16:42

i am unsure if i am wrong but i believe that the Incubi are Bulky models, correct me if i'm wrong
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The_Burning_Eye
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 16:51

asdrubael Vect124 wrote:
i am unsure if i am wrong but i believe that the Incubi are Bulky models, correct me if i'm wrong

Consider yourself corrected, Incubi are not Bulky.

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My Blog - The Burning Eye Blog (check it out - comments always welcome)

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BetrayTheWorld
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 06 2014, 18:16

The_Burning_Eye wrote:
the shooting phase following you declaring jink.

Did this get FAQed somewhere? In the book, it says you snapfire until the end of your next turn.

So, unless it's been FAQed, jinking on your own turn against interceptor makes you snap fire for 2 turns? Sad
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StokieRich
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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 07 2014, 09:55

Well, it went really well actually.

I'll note some quick bits down on the off chance that anyone is interested, please

bear in mind this is two guys who haven't played 7th edition since release.

His list was something like:

ML2 Librarian in Terminator Armour (In the Crusader)

Baal Predator with Heavy Bolters and Assault Cannon

Land Raider Crusader with Hurricane Bolters and Assault Cannon

Mortis pattern Dreadnought with Khrys? guns (2 x Heavy 6, S6, Skyfire, Interceptor if

standing still)

5 Vanguard Veterans

5 Sanguinary Guard

10 Assault Marines with Flamer and Power Sword (In the Crusader)

10 Assault marines with Flamer and Power Sword (Jump Packs)

--------------------

Deployment was long table edges, mission was crusade? (D3+2 objectives)

Forgot to roll for night fight

I won the roll for deployment and chose to deploy first, go first - He chose to seize

and won, but then didn't want to seize so we let it go.

Warlord Trait was fearless (6 on the DE chart) which I kept, and combat drugs were

+1LD (boo)

The table had a good amount of terrain on it using the modular buildings from

Warmill, with a good mix of cover and line of sight blocking terrain, although it'd

be difficult to get total cover with a raider.

I deployed the 3 raiders and my venom on my left flank behind some buildings in

cover, and my 3 units of Reavers roughly in the centre.

He deployed the Baal predator directly opposite my transports but behind a building,

the Sanguinary Guard next to it, and the Land Raider on the same side just off centre

with Terminator Librarian and Assault Marines in it.

Just off centre to the right he deployed his Mortis Dread, with the Assault marines

on the far right (his left)

Vanguard Vets are in reserve

--------------------

I took first turn and considered what to do, the Land Raider was scaring me but at

the same time I'd like to deal with the Mortis, then I found out it was only 24"

range which made the decision much easier for me as I decided I'd come on the other

side of the board from it and try to pretty much ignore it.

I moved one of my raiders 12" towards the centre, while the other two raiders boosted

past him and over to behind a building just right of centre. (If I moved these two

12" I couldn't draw LOS to the Land Raider anyway so chose to reposition)

My venom moved forward slightly into the building but keeping LOS blocking terrain

between himself and the Baal.

Jetbikes moved forward to centre mid whilst the unit with heat lance boosted to the

area that the transports had vacated behind a building on the left, waiting for the

Baal to emerge.

Shooting - Two blasters from the Reavers and the one dark lance shot at the Land

Raider and took off one hull point with a glance. The venom shot at the Assault

marines on the right and killed one.

Reavers then used their jetbike move to pull back slightly behind terrain where

possible.

--------------------

Crusader moved forward 6" and fired Assault Cannon at the Reavers but they passed

jink saves (Hurricane bolters were out of range). Baal moved 12" and fired at the

Reavers and killed 1 before the Mortis stepped forward and revved up those beasty

guns, 12 shots later and the other 2 were dead giving first blood to the Blood

Angels.

Sanguinary Guard he thought about for a bit before deciding, well, they're blood

angels - And jumped them over the building and towards the centre of the board, in

the open to try and chase the transports down.

Assault marines jumped on top of the building on my right out of LOS and about

halfway onto the board.

--------------------

Turn 2 Dark Eldar Reserves - One Dissie Razorwing and the Lance Razorwing come in

diagonally from my left side and draw a bead on the Sanguinary Guard.

The venom moves forward to get LOS on them as well, whilst the 3 raiders move 6"

forward towards the centre and prepare to open up on the Land Raider.

Reavers in the centre move forward and shoot but miss the Land Raider before jumping

back.

My Succubus opens up first as I REALLY want to try out the animus vitae, I shoot it

at the Sanguinary Guard and hit, rolling a 4 to wound which kills and gains me

Fearless Charge T2.

Venom also shoots at the Sanguinary Guard and kills one.

Dissie Razorwing then opened up on the Sanguinary Guard with 2x Monoscythe Missiles

and 6 Dissie shots, clearing the remaining 4. (I love the Disintegrator cannon, they

did me proud this game)

3 Dark Lances from the Raiders fire at the Land Raider but either miss or fail to

penetrate. Dark Lances from the second Razorwing then fire at the side of the Land

Raider, hitting twice, penetrating once, and exploding the Land Raider. (Score!)

Nothing dies in the explosion and marines pass pinning.

Heat Lance bikes then fire at the Baal, hit but fail to pen (3+2 on the melta

penetration) then charge in and the rending caltrops penetrate and get crew shaken.

--------------------

Baal backs up away from the reavers and as he has to snap fire anyway he fires

everything at the Dark Lance Razorwing, penetrating through jink and getting Crew

Shaken.

Assault Marines on the right jump towards the centre and fired at the remaining unit

of Reavers there but thankfully the flamer was just out of range, the bolt pistols

caused one wound which was saved with Jink.

Librarian casts invisibility on his Mortis dread (opponent said afterwards this was a big mistake and he should have cast it on the marines)

Mortis and the marines with Terminator Librarian walk forward towards the 3

transports in the centre and open fire, hoping to down one of the transports and

charge the occupants however after the shooting phase the front raider is still there

with 1 hull point and is now immobilised.

Marines and the Mortis dread then charge in on the transport and the Mortis wrecks it but this then leaves the marines standing grouped up and not locked in combat...


--------------------

Turn 3 my final Flyer turns up on the right, aiming at the assault marines coming into the centre from that side. My Dark Lance ravager Flies off the table as he can only fire snap shots this turn and my other Dissie moves towards the centre, also pointing himself at the assault marines coming in from the right.

Wyches and Raiders shuffle around the centre unit of marines with the Librarian and everything disembarks, with the marines now staring down 22 Wyches, a succubus and 4 Incubi.

Both units of reavers on the left surround the Baal and then fire with blaster and heat lance, the Heat Lance penetrating and exploding it, the blast catching all 6 reavers in it and killing 2 from one unit and the Heat Lance from the other (Should have thought about placement better here)

Both flyers open up on the assault marines with 4 large blasts and 12 DC shots between them and wipe them out.

Wyches all open up on the marines with grenades and splinter pistols and kill about 5 or 6 marines (I had around 18 hits from the 4 grenades, bunched up infantry and nice targets!) one unit of wyches and the succubus/incubi then charge in with Furious Charge and the succubus butchers the Librarian in a challenge before the wyches wipe the unit.

We call the game at this point as my opponent only has the Mortis dread and vanguard vets (still in reserve) left.

--------------------

Overall I enjoyed the game and the speed at which the dark eldar can redeploy is great. I think I had a decent matchup against his list in particular and the disintegrator Razorwings were just brutal although it does leave me short on anti tank.

Any thoughts guys if you've got through that wall of text?

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PostSubject: Re: Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated   Themed Wych Cult Army at 1500 - Feedback Appreciated I_icon_minitime

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