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 Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?

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sweetbacon
Wych
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PostSubject: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 15:23

I was wondering if adding a blaster and Sybarite with HWG are worth the extra points in five man squads of Warriors?   The point cost is pretty steep for a cheap MSU squad, but on the other hand, it does mean that every small unit is a threat to peel off one or two hull points from a vehicle.  So if the opponent ignores them, they may wreck a couple vehicles and if the opponent targets them, then the your real heavy hitters aren't getting quite as much attention.
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HERO
Hekatrix
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 18:42

Just the blaster.

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Azdrubael
Incubi
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 18:57

I think it may have merit.

Blaster + Thrown Grenade + Assault. Thats a lot of chances to wreck something. One blaster usually isnt doing much.

At 15 points that isnt much, while you are actually adding something.

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Cerve
Hekatrix
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:07

If u play two squads, u can pay 30 points.

I found it too much expensive if u run like 3-4-5 squads. 15-30 poits are ok; more, are not imho
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sweetbacon
Wych
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:27

@Azdrubael wrote:
I think it may have merit.

Blaster + Thrown Grenade + Assault. Thats a lot of chances to wreck something. One blaster usually isnt doing much.

At 15 points that isnt much, while you are actually adding something.

Yeah, this is what I was thinking also.  My rolling to hit with blasters is usually pretty bad.  So the HWG is for redundancy.  The thrown HWG plus the possibility of assaulting and taking another HP off might give your opponent pause.  At the very least, they are yet another unit that has to be dealt with if your opponent has a mech heavy list.  Plus, if they choose to shoot at these Warrior units, that is less fire going into Scourges, Reavers, Talos, etc.  I might try it out with 2-3 squads and see if they are worth it.
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Expletive Deleted
Wych
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:35

If I could throw a haywire grenade 18" it might be worth it.

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:37

Quote :
If I could throw a haywaire grenade 18" it might be worth it.

I doubt it ) Big point of grenades is that they ignore cover in assaults. Jinking or otherwise. And if you are assaulting - you are in a range of thrown grenade. 8' is just ideal.

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sweetbacon
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:43

Well, actually, you can sort of throw a grenade 18 inches. 6 in. move + 6 in. disembark + 8 in. throw range, then follow up with charge.
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Expletive Deleted
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:44

Ignore cover is a big point. A bad point for assaulting a vehicle with a squad of kabalites is whether they wreck the vehicle or not, they're going to be completely exposed to gunfire in your opponents next shooting phase. With wyches it was worth it, but your sybarite can still whiff his one attack.

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sweetbacon
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:50

Yeah, but to be clear, I would only send Warriors after vehicles that are down to their last HP to begin with.  They have three chances to strip the last HP between blaster, thrown HWG, and assault.  Actually if you try this on Turn 4 or later, they could conceivably glance it death if it has rear AV10.
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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 19:50

Quote :
they're going to be completely exposed to gunfire in your opponents next shooting phase.
Sure, thats a supporting tactics at best. To finish off something. You need something else to draw fire.

Its not as good as Wyches, but its looks ok enough. I'l try it. Frankly Wyches were made in edition where they would hit most things with Haywire on 6s. That they were able to have this role in 6th edition is kinda unexpected for codex creaters, thats for sure.

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Expletive Deleted
Wych
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 20:01

The question for me isn't whether it works, it's just... is it worth it? For 15 points you can expose your troops to enemy fire for a small chance at glancing a vehicle to death. 15 points is exactly what it costs to upgrade a ravager up to 3 dark lances. Or add +1 to your jink. Just doesn't seem worth it in comparison.

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sweetbacon
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 20:18

Yeah, that's a fair point. There is clearly an opportunity cost with trying this out as those are 15 points that aren't going towards something else. Like I said, just something I might try. Maybe it ends badly or maybe it actually works. Basically, I'm still in the excitement phase over the new codex so I'm just trying to think up new things to try.
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El_Jairo
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 19 2014, 23:31

I'm with Deleted on this matter.
Sure HwG and the extra Ld adds to the unit but in general you want to keep point investments low. You rather present more targets than less but stronger units. If your units are that cheap (5 Warriors are) your opponent will have to overspend firepower to effectively destroy them.

Relatively speaking the 15 points add 27% cost to the warriors. Are they really 27% more efficient with HwG? At short range AT, sure but that's all.
So if you would have 3 of these units, not taking the HwG almost pays for a 4th unit; warriors only of course.
As with all T3 based armies, you should somewhat compensate with number of boots on the ground.

I might consider this build as my meta presents me with lots of Mechanized units, so many that HayScourge can't handle.
As I play casual, I'm not expecting that.
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Cerve
Hekatrix
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PostSubject: Re: Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty?   Upgrading Warriors for anti-tank duty? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 20 2014, 05:30

In that 15 points you have already pay another units which can't be ignored. It works on a MSU idea, better than +1 cover or some else
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