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csjarrat
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PostSubject: Eldar Codex review   Mon Jun 03 2013, 16:14

hi guys,
thought i'd share my thoughts with you on the book from a gamers perspective (not a tournie player by any means)
i got my first game in over the weekend and had the chance to try out the following:

Spiritseer got doom and fortune
x2 warlocks (one on jetbike, both got conceal)

x10 scorps, ex with claw (infiltrating)

x10 DA's, ex with shimmer, serpent
x10 DA's, ex with shimmer, serpent
x5 wraths, D-cannons, serpent with lances
x3 jetbikes, one cannon (cheap scorers)
x5 rangers (cheap scorers)

Prism with holo
x3 shadoweaver platforms (conceal lock here)

i played against a nilla marine player rolling many tac squads and headed by a chaplain + sternguard squad.@ 1500.
it was a solid win, with me getting 1 objective with avengers, wrathguard contesting another, linebreaker and firstblood.
artillery was brilliant, shelled units on objectives all game either pinning them or causing panic tests for casualties.
it cleared one objective on its own and was very resilient to fire, impressed for 90pts!

so onto the book review:

Characters:
Special characters have never been my specialty as they tend to be banned round my area, however i can safely say that none of the new special characters jump out as auto-takes.
for the most part they over-priced and bring little to an army that couldnt otherwise be achieved for less price through other choices.
the exception to this is nightspear, for unlocking pathfinders who at 70 skaven slaves isnt a terrible buy if you are into snipers in a big way.
pathfinders are ungodly expensive however, but they should be able to rip the teeth out of most squads by picking away seargants and special weapons.

Eldrad is more expensive than 2 farseers, and the double farseers would do a better job. he can regain a charge point after casting on a 5+ which is dandy though. can still re-deploy units pre-game

Yriel, meh. took a nerf. his eye-bomb isnt too great thanks to the new 6thed pile-in rules, he'll have to wait till 2nd round of cc to use it most effectively.

Pheonix lords
for the most part these guys are far too expensive and bring little if anything to the board:
Asurmen, 4++ and a decent power sword. D3 eldar traits is OK, but i think for the points i'd just put in an autarch with the new shard of anaris instead. it should free up 120pts that way!

Jain is not that great either, she does make her unit +1 run, so in a banshee squad they get +4 to run moves, however, its not like you're going to be taking banshees anyway given how difficult they are to get into CC.

Karandras is a beast, he is about the only one i'd really take, but at well over 200pts he's for massive games only i'm afraid.

Fuegan seems daft to me. if you want dual firing melta that is good in CC, take the cheaper and better Avatar of Khaine.

Baharroth, again, brings little to the fight for the points. he could make hawks a credible threat in CC with hit n run and a kitted exarch to back him up, but i think spiders and autarch do that better + cheaper tbh.

Maugan ra, No. just No.
terrible synergy with reapers as usual. no invul. just take a kitted autarch with reaper launcher if you really must.

as far as i can tell, these guys are not restricted to only joining their aspects now which could open up USR shenanigans if you are so inclined...

Generic HQ
Avatar, can take exarch powers (most suck or cost a fortune) as an upgrade. fast shot for his melta is the obvious pick here (2 BS10 melta shots is tasty). he is expensive, got better stats in CC but dropped a pip of invul save to compensate (thanks daemon rule)

Autarch. i wanna play test this guy. he has access to the remnants of glory list which opens up some new options for him (i like the shard of anaris). his biggest problem on foot was always his lack of high strength power weapons for combat, and he didnt bring in much in terms of strategy outside of riding in with shining spears. he is still excellent with spears as a source of many attacks, but i think the new wargear section should make him more playable as an infantry leader too. his reserves rule remains, he can +/-1 to reserves rolls which is nice for the new fighters, jump infantry and outflankers.
the shard of anaris gives him +2S and rending so all those tasty attacks he brings can be put to good use. he gets better in challenges too, as he picks up fearless, instant death and fleshbane.
I can see him being used as an infantry leader with warp spiders or dire avengers and taking on challenges. his basic kit is decent too, starting with 3+/4++ with the full assortment of eldar grenades.
a lack of PGL ability/equipment for him seems like a missed opportunity given how crap banshees have just become though.

Farseer. the big boy. mastery 3 for same price as a chaplain is tasty. bike is very cheap and a worthy investment for the pip of T and 3+
runes are one use only and nerfed massively. obviously has to roll for powers too. divination/telepathy/runes of fate are all his options.
he can also take remnants of glory, but the only one you'd use would be the spirit stones of anathlan. they allow you to reduce charge 2 powers to charge 1 cost, at the expense of your invul save. very handy if you're on a bike as the 3+ and jink compensate for this.

Spiritseer. bargain basement farseer, but makes wraithguard/blades troops. 35 skaven slaves seals the deal for a mastery 2 psyker (telepathy/runes of battle). he can take remnants too. keep him cheap and in a unit. runes of battle primaris is conceal, so he is best keeping troopers alive in the backfield.

Warlocks, not technically a HQ slot as they dont take any slots at all. buy as many as you want (up to 10) split them off for other units as you need and roll for psychic powers before you assign them to units.
not that great tbh, they're pretty limited in what they can join (guardians/jetbikes/artillery) and have to roll to cast @ LD8. nice to have cover saves on artillery, and guardian defenders will def appreciate the help when in cover (20man in walls with conceal up is nice) but not a must take at all. can only generate from runes of battle

Troops
let me just say now that all exarch powers suck except for night vision + fast shot and cost a fortune. most are not worth looking at.

Dire avengers. more expensive, but shurikens got a lot better vs infantry.
annoyingly, the exarch is now not going to contribute to shooting and lost the excellent defend and bladestorm powers. his powers only affect him, and as such probably shouldnt be taken. i would go for shimmershield everytime here. power swords are always good and the 5++ applies all the time, not just in CC. its pricey, but hey its a 5++ save for your full unit.

Guardians, still die like flies when introduced to a flamer, but can take two weapons per 20man team. they are now BS4 and can actually hit with those weapon platforms. for some bizarre reason EML's cost a fortune in this 'dex, so the lance and scatter laser are the better choices. stick a conceal lock in here and put them on an objective in cover. shuriken boosts applies here too, but they are still 12" range, so dont get too excited and leave cover for long!!! battle focus means they can move into range, shoot and run into cover again which is nice.

Stormies, not a bad way of getting cheaper melta onto the board. BS4 here too and scoring with battle focus makes this a more useful version of fire dragons, though dont let them get flamed/shot/looked at funny.
can take 2 power swords and come with plasma grenades so received a substantial boost for their +1pt increase

Jetbikes, auto-take.
3 for a shade over 50pts. T4, 3+, 36" turbo boost. BS4 rending guns? JSJ moves? 'nuff said.

Rangers, considerably crap, considerably cheaper. take 5-10 and camp on objectives. get better with serious psyker support but i see these as a cheap scoring unit more than anything.

Wave serpent:
just became insane. became BS4, and weapon options dropped to bargain basement prices. (TL BL for 5pts??? woot?)
shield drops pens to glances 5/6 of the time and can be used another gun too!!!. with jink, holofields and a liberal dose or "fortune" this became unkillable

Elites
Banshees: No. Just No.
1) no grenades. (WTF GW, stormies get them, but not the premier assault troops??)
2) no assault transport.
3) mask means strike simultaneously with enemies in cover.
cheaper, can run +3" but still unplayable really.

Scorpions: YES
now have fleet, move through cover, infiltrate and stealth as standard. grenades and battlefocus. exarch can take the claw which isnt unwieldy anymore. S6 I6 AP2 attacks anyone? inflitrate/outflank means dont need transport. do like these guys!!!

Dragons: Not really. still massive overkill against most tanks. have got heavier armour and battlefocus so less of a suicide unit, but i'd rather take scoring options like melta stormies or wraithguard for this role.
exarch with pike and fast shot is nice however.

Harlies: yep, lots of flip-flopping on how shadowseer works, now rolls to activate power @ LD9 and is back to the original night fighting x2D6 roll rather than shrouded and stealth. harlies havent changed otherwise.

Wraithguard/Blades: YES
realistically you're going to take a spiritseer and take these guys as troops.
i feel a bit miffed that you cant spec these guys like termies. i think a mix/match approach would help a lot to sweeten the expensive deal with these guys. as it stands, all models have to take wraithcannons/d-scythes/swords/axes. in a shooting unit, 3 with cannons and 2 with scythes would make them so much more flexible. they cant though, so my pick is the original and best: cannon. S10 AP2. take 5 in a serpent, disembark, melt something and then go scoring/contesting.
scythes are brutal for infantry clearing though!!!
i'm not sold on the combat units, they suffer the same problem as banshees, but can at least take a kicking for a turn before thy get fighting, but S6 AP3 attacks are nothing to sniff at. they'll still lose to mobs however.

Fast Attack
Hawks: YEP. they now don't scatter and grenades ignore cover. use them to bomb tau gunlines. they have to shoot at the target they bombed, but you can place them in such a way that they dont have LOS so they can shoot other stuff too. guns got better, they got cheaper. like it! can tool for light combat too, thanks to plasma grenades, assault 3 guns and optional hit n run and power weapon on exarch if needed.

Spiders: HELL YES
jet pack now, so can be nice and safe. can still super jump if need it. come with hit and run, battle focus and S6 pseudo rending guns that are S7 against vehicles and low Ini troopers. nice.
good place for a melta gun and shard of anaris toting autarch i think!

Fighter/Bomber:
Fighter=maybe, bomber=no
if you face lots of enemy flyers, the fighter is a good call. vector dancer, re-rolls to hit on flyers and a stack of lance shots would work nicely. if you dont, they are both very expensive and wont do that much otherwise. they are really fragile too!!

Vypers: YES
gun options got much much cheaper, squadron rules are better, BS4 and free jink saves for moving mean this is a great little gun platform.
scatter lasers and Scannon upgrade works nicely thanks to laser lock rule (twin linking weapons if scatter laser hits first) for infantry shredding, but i see these guys as a good BL platform. can take holofields to boost the jink save too but gets expensive.

Shining Spears: YES
Addressed old-book concerns with low model count by capping at 9 now.
Get the skilled rider power free, but have to buy hit and run for the exarch. can outflank for free. no grenades and low attacks mean these guys either need numbers or autarch support. will not hurt much in round 2 of CC. cheaper though! good unit for outflanking and sorting out rear armour or picking off lone devastator squads and objective campers.

Heavy Support
Reapers: Yes
Pricey, but versatile; they can take krak missiles now (pinning too). exarch has options to get flakk missiles, fast shot and night vision which would no doubt come in handy if you're expecting the RAF in your next game. no skyfire options for normal troopers though so will waste a lot of shots when firing at aircraft. slow and purposeful so they can shoot and move too.

Artillery: YES
90 points buys you 3 S6 kind-of-rending barrage shots that get better on low Ini troops and vehicles. weapons summary says large blast too which will need FAQ/Errata.
Vibro cannon does more damage with more hits, does multiple hits now and crew are BS4. not hard to get x3 S9 Ap2 shots into something for 90pts which is nice!
D-cannon is mint but more expensive. x3 24" S10 ap2 blasts that multiple barrage. shiny. crew also have grenades and rending guns if needed.

Prism: yep
changed the weapon profiles around a bit. x3 firing modes from large blast, through to lance mode, so can deal with all types of threats. holofields are a must as no serpent shield but still a very good multi-role tank.

Spinner: maybe
if you're loading up on melta/D-weapons/lances in Troops + FA this could work nicely, but i think the support weapon battery is the better call as it can't be one-shotted or stunned/shaken etc.

Falcon: no.
hasn't gained anything. just stick bright lances on your serpents for 5pts and forget your warm fuzzy DAVU memories.

War walkers: yep
can be another AA platform but cost a metric ton as for some bizzare reason, EML's are a fortune in this book. flakk aint cheap either and only works on one rocket pod per purchase.
they have battle focus, fleet and scouts however so i'd be running these boys in and out of cover and using them for anti-infantry duties.

Wraithlord: maybe
still the same old 'lord, but more expensive. has lower strength, but +1A. sword no longer takes up a weapon slot and weapons can be duplicated without becoming twinlinked. weapons now cheaper too. i like the look of x2 lances, x2 flamers and a glaive but its a shade less than 170pts. so i'd probably just keep him cheap and support the troops.

Wraithknight: maybe
hugely expensive for x2 S10 guns as default. very tough and lots of wounds. pretty mobile, but no invul. i dont think it'd take DE or nids very long to poison their way past his measly 3+ save. becomes much more expensive to get an invul and lose BOTH anti tank guns to do it.
best he can get is a multiple blast S6 gun with that load out, but eldar dont need to pay nearly 300pts for more S6 shooting. shoulder mounted guns are a fortune, and he cant use them unless he paid to lose both guns for a sword and shield.
cant see the point in this guy, he's the eldar equivalent of the "big dick" syndrome.
small points games (750pts) could see this guy dominating imperials though as there wont be enough AP3+ stuff on the board to deal with him.


hope you enjoyed my wall of text, let me know of any erros or omissions. i'd love to hear your thoughts on the new book and experiences with it in-game.
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shadowseercB
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Tue Jun 04 2013, 01:57

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Last edited by shadowseercB on Thu Jun 06 2013, 16:54; edited 1 time in total
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wanderingblade
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Wed Jun 05 2013, 15:05

@csjarrat wrote:

Falcon: no.
hasn't gained anything. just stick bright lances on your serpents for 5pts and forget your warm fuzzy DAVU memories.

I definitely disagree with this. It just got BS4 for 5 points extra and most of its weapons choices came down too. A Pulse Laser/Bright Lance Falcon is now 135 points for 3 BS4 S8 shots; it used to be 145 for 3 BS3 S8 shots. The Scatter Laser Falcon just basically gained twin-linked on the Pulse Laser.

The Falcon's main problem is it's in a packed Heavy Support slot full of some amazing choices, a lot of which did gain, and that Wave Serpents are awesome.
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csjarrat
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Wed Jun 05 2013, 18:56

fair point, but everything got BS4, vypers, artillery, walkers, guardians etc. the falcon didnt get anything special.
it is till going to want to take holo fields for some kind of reliable protection, so you can stick another 15pts on that total.
but did a 10pt decrease really justify taking a tank that only puts out 3 shots? two S8 shots without the lance rule isnt going to help much against hard armour. AV13-14 will come down to 5's+6's on 2/3rds of those shots. it'd be fine against light armour, but we have better platforms for dealing with that tbh.
Wraithlords and wraithknights can take decent AT loadouts in that slot, and while pricey, can't be lascannon-one-shotted or stun/shaken into uselessness. The prism has a stronger lance and is more reliable at damaging, whilst bringing multiple fire modes onto the table, and artillery choices are much better now too.
i'm not over-sold on falcons and havent been since you cant score inside a tank. their best function for me was as a tough to kill scoring unit, and sadly for the falcon, that function no longer exists :-(

you're right about the heavy section being hotly competitive, but even if it were just a choice between prism and falcon, it'd be prism anyday of the week and twice on sundays for me. the utility that it brings with it's varying fire modes is pretty awesome and you can always go prescience/guide if you need to for those S9 AP1 lance shots.
yes, serpents are now awesome to the point of making other armies cry :-)
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bklooste
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Thu Jun 06 2013, 12:14

My 2c.

Heavy

#1 Spinner: Excellent Get a crystal targetting and Holo... You can now go flat out all the time for a 3+ cover save this is important because you will go flat out and put a Torrent templet down EXACTLY where you want .. Got some anoying guard and vehicles behind a defence line ... go flat out and cover them with a S7 monofilament ( 6 = instant death) template. that ignores cover.. This will attract a lot of fire which is why you need 3 cover... Turn 1 18" flat out and torrent covers 12 to 24" so you can reach up to 42" ..And last but not least a S7 BS4 Large Blast . You can move into LOS average scatter is less than the template size . So can deal with many situations.

#2 War walkers Excellent... Scout and Battle focus on walkers (!!!) and a save ... Walk shoot , run back ( maybe out of LOS) ... keep the range .. You need cheap lances or Star Cannons this is the best way. Note Scatter Laser is usefull too since it will TL and are pretty good against air due to being TL you have a 1 in 3 chance of a 6.

#3 Prism Excellent .. probably unupgraded. Again Large blast but different from the Spinner , spinner is good for light and medium vehilces and GEQ. Prism large blast is AP3 MEQ. And the S9 AP 1 lance is usefull penetrate any vehlce on 3+ or better . Pen hit on AV 13 - 14 on a 4 will take a vehilce out of action for at least 1 turn .

#4 Artillery: Average to Good
its so easy to take out the crew and give up first blood or kill points.
Vibro is poor as they will just avoid your LOS.
Dcannon too expensive
Shadow weaver is prob the best but AP 6 ...no ignore cover , would be Excellent but they lost the large blast in the FAQ
Barage is ok for stationary but indirect is 4in 6 chance of scattering 7" and a large blast is much better , see other heavy . Not bad value but the others are better .

#5 Good Knight
Situational can be usefull dropping him behind the enemy taking out heavy weapons / vehilces supported by hawks and bikes. Also usefull as a fire magnet

Reapers: Nope
Too pricey and other heavy is better.. Exarc with anti air may be worth it in a Very high air Meta

Wraithlord: Nope ..
Too pricey others are better ...Dark Eldar laugh at Wraith constructs .

Falcon: Nope
Others are better... Even its tank transport role is now better done by a wave serpent



Last edited by bklooste on Thu Jun 06 2013, 12:18; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : FAQ on Shadow weaver)
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Massaen
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Thu Jun 06 2013, 13:53

Your list at the start... Did you mean farseer? Spirit seers can't get doom or fortune...

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wanderingblade
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 08 2013, 02:59

Well, if I'm prepared to pay (roughly) the same amount for the one shot of the Fire Prism or the Night Spinner, then I'm surely prepared to look at the mighty three shots of a Falcon!

You mention heavy armour as a problem; even against AV14, a tri-las Falcon would be more likely to strip a hull point (by .11). Of course, the Fire Prism is more likely to explode the blighter, but we're only talking a 16.6% chance here, while the tri-las Falcon has a 7.4% chance... l imagine it only gets better against AV13, and since very few things have better than that on their side armour, its always worth the college try, so lets see...

The Fire Prism's stats don't change (1 shot, 66pc hit, 44pc hull point, 33 pc chance penetrates, 16.6pc bang) the Falcon however is 77.7pc likely to ding a hull point and 44pc likely to penetrate now. The explosion is still less likely, only 14.8pc... as such, I feel happy saying its activities in the heavy armour role are pretty cool. Put Guide on, and it reveals my inability to do percentages properly after a certain point as adding up all the Tri-las Falcon's chances of hitting gives it 104pc likelihood of a hullpoint, which we know is lies, but can't recall how to resolve this... lets just say twice as likely as the Fire Prism, 15pc more likely for the penetrate... and still 3pc for the explosion. Fire play. Fire Prisms love making things explode.

The Falcon is also somewhat more immune to some of the perils of vehicle life than the Fire Prism. Weapon destroyed leaves the Falcon a bit sad 2 out of 3 times. It has a 1 in 2 chance of rendering the Fire Prism obsolete. No snapshots reduces the Fire Prism to a 1 in 6 chance of doing anything, the Falcon's three guns gives it a decent chance.

Of course, the Fire Prism can fire pie plates, which the Falcon can't, although give me three S8 weapons over 1 S7 blast for dealing with Termies and the like. The Falcon is definitely not a bad tank, although I still concede the situation is against it. It would help if it wasn't paying for a transport capacity that frankly, it will probably never use. Still. If they updated the Corsair list, placing them in an attractive situation again, we would see them do great things.

Incidentally, I don't see the compulsory need for a holofield. 15 points for a 1 in 6 chance to negate damage, fading to 0 in 0 against the growing range of weapons that ignore cover - I think I might be able to live without. Not saying its bad, but I don't think its must have either.

Having mentioned Corsairs - do you think any of the Forgeworld units still have a place? I think Hornets might still outrank Vypers.

I'd also point out that a 5 man Shining Spear squad will, through shooting and combat, probably leave a sole survivor of a full 10 man tactical squad. Not sure they need as much support as you say!
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Evil Space Elves
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 08 2013, 03:51

@wanderingblade wrote:
Having mentioned Corsairs - do you think any of the Forgeworld units still have a place? I think Hornets might still outrank Vypers.

Hornets have scout, armor 11, aren't open-topped and have access to pulse lasers. I'll still take Hornets every time.

As to other FW units, have you tried these? Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil


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bklooste
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 08 2013, 05:19

The Falcon does not compete with the Prism and Night Spinner .. As you say they have the versatility to put out large plates , templates ,S9 AP1 to penetrate not stun ( not just explode but also more kill weapon / imobalise) , these allow you to handle things the rest of the army cant.. Even guardians can get lances.. IMHO it competes with the walkers slot and even hornets with 2 pulsars in a fast slot .. who can also put out 4 to 6 lance slots. I preffer 4 lances and 2 SC or scatter lasers

Agree holo is not compulsary unless you get Crystal targetting

yes Shining Spears are very nice even vs terminators.
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 08 2013, 10:30

@bklooste wrote:
( not just explode but also more kill weapon / imobalise)

How does it get more weapons destroyed and immobilised, the prism has a 1/6 chance of causing an immobilised result with a penetrating hit the same as a falcon has with a penetrating hit. AP1 only affects your chances of causing a vehicle explodes result and reduces your chance of causing a stun/shaken it does not affect the chances of weapon destroyed or immobilised.

Also the falcon can more reliably get through invulnerable saves and cover (number of shots). Fire prisms suffer from their one shot getting negated by a cover save or invulnerable save (and most vehicles have one or the other this edition).

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bklooste
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 08 2013, 11:48

@Mushkilla wrote:
@bklooste wrote:
( not just explode but also more kill weapon / imobalise)

How does it get more weapons destroyed and immobilised, the prism has a 1/6 chance of causing an immobilised result with a penetrating hit the same as a falcon has with a penetrating hit. AP1 only affects your chances of causing a vehicle explodes result and reduces your chance of causing a stun/shaken it does not affect the chances of weapon destroyed or immobilised.

Also the falcon can more reliably get through invulnerable saves and cover (number of shots). Fire prisms suffer from their one shot getting negated by a cover save or invulnerable save (and most vehicles have one or the other this edition).

S9 is +1 which is an increase in the to hit need a 4+ instead of a 5+ to pen AV12-14. Yes you take Shaken of the table and replace it with a kill which is good .. what I clumsaly meant was the average pen result was better and your more likely to pen 50% higher vs AV 12-14.

Lastly its 60" so your going to get less return fire ..

Im not saying the main weapon is better .. its slightly worse than 3 shots probably made up for by the range , the thing is you can pump out small and large plates which few other things in the eldar list can do...What does a falcon do vs 80 Orc boyz. Anything a faclcon can do others can do eg Hornets with 2 Pulsars give 4 shots or a walker with 2 lancees and both are cheaper / shot.
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csjarrat
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Mon Jun 10 2013, 10:59

"anything a falcon can do others can do"
These are my sentiments.
The fact that a prism can deal with drop pod squads, disembarked troops, deep strikers, hordes etc as well as contributing AT fire means i'll choose prism over falcon anyday.
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bklooste
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 15 2013, 07:50

So who is not taking. The spinner with targeting matrix
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 15 2013, 10:13

@bklooste wrote:
So who is not taking. The spinner with targeting matrix

It's a one shot item. You are paying a lot of points for an AP6 helldrake (155pts) on a more fragile platform. Night spinners are good, but personally I think a crystall targeting matrix just encourages you to expose it early and as a result lose it early. Sure putting a template down turn 1 is nice, but it's a S7-8 AP6 template, most units won't care. Also as long as your opponent doesn't bunch up his tanks it's basically an auto hit missile launcher that might be hitting side armour. Again not too impressive. If the crystal targeting matrix was not one use only, then it might have been worth considering. But as it is I wouldn't bother.

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bklooste
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 15 2013, 13:59

Yeah , kind of agree there .. I thought  save 3+ ( flat out and hollo is great ) , but  you will loose the unit... and 2 spinners is just too expensive.. I dont think they are more fragile though .. when you rush save 3+, heldrakes get ignored ( people move under them or where you cant fire next turn) or taken by flyers and sky units and your on the board the whole game and you have the large plate.


It can be good as a target as it will not be ignored and take a fair few shots eg it takes about 15-20 S8 shots to kill through glancing ..This can be very usefull as a DE ally having all the enemies AT nhot firing on your Venoms and Raiders.


Its probably better used just putting down large plates , forcing a dispersed deployment which allows the rest of your army to pick more isolated elements..   Use the plate on hords and from turn 3+ you may use the Torrent.

The thing i really like though is if the guard deployed vehicles behind wall  you could run up and put a torrent behind the wall.. then again a large plate behind the wall is not too bad..
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar Codex review   Sat Jun 15 2013, 14:08

@bklooste wrote:
The thing i really like though is if the guard deployed vehicles behind wall  you could run up and put a torrent behind the wall.. then again a large plate behind the wall is not too bad..

The barrage fire mode is better though (and doesn't need an expensive upgrade to work). It ignores the cover from the defence line (as it's a barrage weapon), and because it's a barrage weapon it always hits side armour of vehicles (Which for guard artillery and chimera is AV10) making it pretty lethal.

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