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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 10:45

The talos is a great unit, but our heavy support slot is very competitive. I propose two simple changes that would make the Talos more interesting and more viable.

Fleet - To represent its hovering nature, and to make it good at charging through and out of cover (as it was always intended to be good at). This also makes it's run a bit more reliable and in general helps it keep up with the rest of the army. I think this would be the best way to represent it's hovering nature.

It will not die - This just seems fitting and fun. It makes the talos slightly more resilient and forces your opponent to focus fire him in one turn, or risk him regaining wounds over the course of the game.

These rules would be added at no extra points cost.

Thoughts?

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Saintspirit
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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 10:55

Yeah, perhaps. Though, I'm not sure if it should be added at no cost? At least 5-10, I think.

Also, I think IWND fits somewhat more than fleet does, because I just find it really heavy. Even though it is hovering.

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shamroll wrote:
Dang! I was hoping Tyranids followed the Pokemon naming idea. A big Carnifex running around just yelling "Carnifex! Carni-Carnifex!" followed by a squad of termagants all saying "Termagant" to each other.
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Cavash
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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 11:31

Don't fix what's not broken! Razz

Fleet would b valuable but I usually don'thave trouble getting my Pain Engines where they need to be. It would be quite valuable, though.

It Will Not Die would be a lovely way to ruin your foe's day! It would be fun but I don't think it's needed.

I agree with Saintspirit, I think a small pric lift would be needed.

I so like this idea, though.

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 11:58

Maybe a 5pt increase, would make sense. So a base cost of 105pts rather than 100pts.

Saintspirit wrote:
Also, I think IWND fits somewhat more than fleet does, because I just find it really heavy. Even though it is hovering.

The talos is all about lurking in terrain and stalking it's prey, and that's why it has move through cover. However move through cover doesn't do anything for charging through terrain this edition. In the previous edition it did, the idea was to give back what it lost effectively. As it hovers, it's not like it's going to trip over something, I just thought it was an elegant way of representing it's hovering lurking nature.

I'm also under the impression, that the haemonculus would make it hard to escape from on foot. fleet is a nice way of showing how it's a bit more graceful in it's own peculiar and disturbing way. Slowly gaining on you as you try to get away.

I do think it will not die would be hilarious though, and very fitting. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 12:11

Quote :
However move through cover doesn't do anything for charging through terrain this edition
I actually hadn'trealised that. Cheers for pointing it out. Yeah, I guess that makes sense, then.

Next you'll be putting your Talos in a suit and calling him Slender Man as he chases an Imperial Guardsman through the woods.

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 12:36

Cavash wrote:
Next you'll be putting your Talos in a suit and calling him Slender Man as he chases an Imperial Guardsman through the woods.

Damn straight! Slenderman is exactly how I picture talos to operate. Silent grav engine stalking through the night. Humming something disturbing to itself. I always picture talos as having a large repertoire of disturbing tunes to hum to itself.

Also I didn't want to change the talos too radically, or break its theme. The way say making it a jump monstrous creature would.

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 12:56

Quote :
The way say making it a jump monstrous creature would.
That wasnt going to be my suggestion Smile

The Talos is great
The problem is, the Ravager is better.

If Ravagers, Taloi/Cronos and Razors/Voids were available as squadrons or fast attack, the Torture Engines would see a lot more use.


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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 14:02

That is true, I suppose. However, I simply can't see myself painting a second ravager when the first was such a hell Neutral So personally, I don't think I would have that much of a problem with taking a Talos in the third HS slot.

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shamroll wrote:
Dang! I was hoping Tyranids followed the Pokemon naming idea. A big Carnifex running around just yelling "Carnifex! Carni-Carnifex!" followed by a squad of termagants all saying "Termagant" to each other.
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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 14:06

I think having them in squadrons in slightly unreasonable. The whole army works well together with any of those choices without them being in squadrons, and I am able to win by filling the HS choice with any of them. Having more on the table would just be hell! Having all of those LG templates over something before I intend on smashing them up would murder them outright.
(There is an apocalypse datasheet for a squadron of Ravagers, I believe.)

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Fri Apr 19 2013, 17:14

Making it fleet makes sense, but its still a distant second place behind Ravagers for army wide utility.
Most (competitive) armies are going to take three Ravagers, and thats just that.

If Ravagers were fast attack, people would (in my opinion) take a wider mix of Ravagers, Raiders and Engines.

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Sat Apr 20 2013, 20:19

If the Talos, why not the Cronos as well?
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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Sat Apr 20 2013, 21:50

DominicJ wrote:
Distant second place behind Ravagers for army wide utility.

If the haywire blaster was assault 2, the ravager would be extinct. The main reason the Talos has a tough time is, ravagers are our only decent long range AT option. Not because it's not good. Though it will not die would be a great addition and reinforce it's tanking role in the army.

Barking Agatha wrote:
If the Talos, why not the Cronos as well?

Goes without saying. I meant both pain engines. Very Happy


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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Sun Apr 21 2013, 08:13

Me too Smile

A Pain engine squad of two Taloi and a Cronos for one slot is my final offer

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PostSubject: Re: Simple Talos Fix   Thu Jul 25 2013, 13:26

Perhaps a simple move to elites would do the job for the pain engines? the riptide is elite after all, as are the c'tan shards so there is a precedent of MC choices in the elite slot.

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