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AvInNebr
Hellion


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Join date : 2012-10-01

PostSubject: Transports   Sat Dec 22 2012, 15:29

I have a question that came up last night as I was thinking about what I could have done differently after being beat by Space Marines (other than not charging with my wyches ... 3 games now and the first two they have an 8" charge and even with re-rolls are an inch short and then last night a 3 1/4" charge so I leave the Haemy in and roll a 1&2 and come up 1/4" short ... and in all three games they got wiped out after that so never killed anything ....... but that's just how my dice have gone those first three games).

In the first round a drop pod came in and blew up my incubi venom with a dreadnaught that was inside. Now I sent my wyches elsewhere and used trueborn venoms to blow up the dreadnaught and droppod. The incubi being out of transport really never got into the fight. Now I was thinking after could I have disembarked the wyches with the intent to have them charge the dreadnaught freeing up those trueborn for other things and then (and this is where the rules question comes in) moved the incubi over and embarked on the now empty transport.

Basically, can one transport disembark one set of troops and take on a different set of troops entirely in the same round?
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Sat Dec 22 2012, 16:16

Yes. An individual unit cannot embark and disembark in the same turn but there is nothing preventing one unit from disembarking and another from embarking. The vehicle can even move afterwards as long as it did not move before.

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BMD
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Sat Dec 22 2012, 18:29

There is a discussion on another thread on whether or not units coming out of a drop pod can only snap-fire. I'm in the mind that they can only snap-fire, and my friend who plays SMs agrees with it. It might be worth it to go over the rules with your friend and come to an agreement on how to apply the rules for that. Back on topic, as Adhemar said, units can disembark, and then embark on their next turn.
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Massaen
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Sun Dec 23 2012, 00:38

The grey area around drop pods aside, yes you could transport swap

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Seshiru
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Sun Dec 23 2012, 22:01

There isn't anything that would state they would have to snap fire out of a drop pod if fact both the rules for deep striking and disembarking from a transport say that your allowed to fire at full ballistic skill. The using to snap fire from a transport moving above combat speed specifically states that when firing from inside the transport.

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BMD
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Mon Dec 24 2012, 05:42

Wow, you are really rules lawyering... It makes so much sense that a unit embarked in a vehicle that moved at cruising speed can only snap-fire, but a unit that was in a vehicle that moved at cruising speed (the same as trhe other vehicle), and was able to disembark (a whole extra step) because of unique circumstances, and still has time to take aim when the other unit couldn't. Yeah, RAW you can do it, but I would probably not ever play with you again.
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Massaen
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Mon Dec 24 2012, 10:31

There is no rules lawyering about it. The drop pod gives an exception to disembark despite the vehicle moving faster than the core rules allow (why the issue exists)

As it is, you fire at full ballistic skill from any deep striking vehicle you can disembark from

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BMD
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Mon Dec 24 2012, 12:32

Deep Striking vehicles move at cruising speed. The BRB clearly states that embarked units inside vehicles that move at cruising speed can only snap-fire. I can maybe see a Drop Pod allowing units to fire at full BS, and I'm sure their entry in the new DA Codex will clear this up, and I'm sure a new FAQ will come out about the same time, clearing up the other issues. Until then, i guess we agree to disagree.

This is a Dark Eldar forum, please do not go off topic by discussing lesser races. Cheers - Cavash.
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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Mon Dec 24 2012, 15:26

This is the thread BDM talked about, and Ill quote my post from there here for completionist sake.

@Shadows Revenge wrote:
Quote :
BRB, page 36 - "In that turns shooting phase, these units can fire (or run) as normal, and obviously count as having moved in the previous movement phase. Vehicles, except for Walkers, count as having moved at cruising speed (even immobile vehicles)."

Ok, lets break this up

Quote :
"In that turns shooting phase, these units can fire (or run) as normal, and obviously count as having moved in the previous movement phase."

So this sentence means that your troops count as having moved in the previous movement phase. That means heavy weapons only snapshot, but everything else my shoot like normal (unless your salvo)

then there is a period. This breaks up the two sentences, and shows that they are not connected at all.

Second part

Quote :
"Vehicles, except for Walkers, count as having moved at cruising speed (even immobile vehicles)."

This sentence denotes that the vehicle itself has moved at cruising speed, which therefore it suffers from the results of cruising speed (snapshots, shooting only 1 gun, whatever type of vehicle it is) Also note that any passengers that DONT disembark must shoot at snapshots, as that is a penalty for moving at cruising.


So there you have it. If you deepstrike your vehicle, it counts as moving at cruising. If you disembark your unit, then the unit only moved like they moved during the movement phase. Its a quirk of the rule system, but I guess they are trying to act like the guys deepstriking in their vehicle knew they were going to pile out and pick their shots carefully

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Seshiru
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PostSubject: Re: Transports   Mon Dec 24 2012, 19:25

Ok, I see where the quirkiness is. However a transport that deep strikes is very clearly a different scenario then one that actually moves at crusing speed; would have been nice if they said something like from the passengers persceptive the vehicle has moved at combat speed but to accommodate for the rapid decelration the vehicle counts as having moved at crusing speed ( or any other fluff to explain why they can disembark) but they didn't and they may change this in a later FAQ.
Just like retro fire jets are very different from the Duke's "Low orbital raid". Their different in the fluff, and there different in terms of the game.

Ps. If fluff vs. Game bothers you, don't ever look at the grey knights codex, having psychic bullets is only the beginning of there total nonsense fluff

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