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 Squad upgrades and Trueborn

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Orthien
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PostSubject: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 02:04

While working on my re-do of the Battlescribe Catalogue I came across something I had not though of before.

It is generally accepted that upgrades that apply to the squad i.e. Wych weapons, Caltrops etc can't be put onto the Champion. However in the Trueborn entry for Dracon it mentions him swapping his CCW and Pistol for other options but doesn't say anywhere where they came from in the first place.
Does he automatically and invisibly drop his Rifle for CCW and Pistol on becoming a Dracon or does he have the option as per the Trueborn entry to swap his Rifle for CCW+Pistol for free or a Shardcarbine for 5 points, then upgrade the CCW+Pistol further if picked.

If its the latter which it seems to be then does this mean we can have Hekatrix with Razorflails etc?

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 08:30

There's absolutely nothing stopping you from putting Wych weapons on your hekatrix as they are available to any model.

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Seshiru
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 17:22

there is nothing that says you can't (although the referrence for then replacing your wyches close combat weapon suddenly makes no sense) but it may be taboo with your local gamers and/or any tournament you go to. Let's not forgot that other armies can exploit this more tha Dark Eldar can (persicion shot psycannon anyone?) so best not to go down that rabbit hole first.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 17:34

@Seshiru wrote:
there is nothing that says you can't (although the referrence for then replacing your wyches close combat weapon suddenly makes no sense) but it may be taboo with your local gamers and/or any tournament you go to. Let's not forgot that other armies can exploit this more tha Dark Eldar can (persicion shot psycannon anyone?) so best not to go down that rabbit hole first.

There is no justification for any taboos on this particular issue as it's perfectly legal under any reading of the rules. I could understand if it was the old Sybarite/Blaster debate (again) but not this particular one.

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Seshiru
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 18:32

Looking back on the wording, I see your point

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Tiri Rana
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 19:40

The Trueborn entry is the perfect example. Pistol + CCW and Carbine are available to ervery model. The other special weapons are only available to Trueborn and the Dracon can only exchange his pistol or CCW, if he has one.

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Orthien
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 20:47

@Count Adhemar wrote:
There's absolutely nothing stopping you from putting Wych weapons on your hekatrix as they are available to any model.

See that's what has me confused. There have been many discussions that have said that squad upgrades don't apply to leaders because of the abuse of war gear and that they have their own upgrade entry's.
I have always played taking this as they way things work especially since I have never seen Wych weapons on a Hekatrix for example.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 22:56

@Orthien wrote:
@Count Adhemar wrote:
There's absolutely nothing stopping you from putting Wych weapons on your hekatrix as they are available to any model.

See that's what has me confused. There have been many discussions that have said that squad upgrades don't apply to leaders because of the abuse of war gear and that they have their own upgrade entry's.
I have always played taking this as they way things work especially since I have never seen Wych weapons on a Hekatrix for example.

The particular codex entry (Wyches) says:

Quote :
For every 5 models in the squad, one may replace her splinter pistol and close combat weapon with..

The upgrade is available to any model in the squad. If you wish to have your Hekatrix be one of those models then that's absolutely fine and I personally wouldn't care if someone felt I was breaking some sort of taboo by doing that. They have precisely zero grounds on which to base any complaint.

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: Squad upgrades and Trueborn   Tue Nov 27 2012, 23:33

Like I said in chat reavers are a perfect example of this:

one in every three reavers may have a blaster <- fits into the taboo of the champion can't take one as he isn't a reaver

one in every three models may have cluster caltrops <- you can give your the champion caltrops no problem

If it says model it's fair game for squad leaders as far as I'm concerned. Smile

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