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 Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000

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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Tue 18 Sep - 11:40

Edited: Changed VB to Ago for Wyche Squad without IC. Removed FF from Ravagers.

2000pts

Dutchess - 150pts
Archon - 150 (VB, HB, ST, CD, SF)

9 Wyches - 203pts (squad with HWG, Hekatrix w/ VB, PGL) Raider (NS, Dizzy)
9 Wyches - 203pts (squad with HWG, Hekatrix w/ VB, PGL) Raider (NS, Dizzy)
10 Wyches - 230pts (squad with HWG, Hekatrix w/ Ago, PGL) Raider (NS, Dizzy)
10 Wyches - 230pts (squad with HWG, Hekatrix w/ Ago, PGL) Raider (NS, Dizzy)

6 Reavers - 172 (2 x CC)
6 Reavers - 172 (2 x CC)
6 Reavers - 172 (2 x CC)

Ravager - 105
Ravager - 105
Ravager - 105

This list revovles around Dutchess ability to DS Raiders and bonus to CD. The Reavers and Ravagers will remain on the table and the Raiders with the HQs will go into DS Reserves. I will DS the Raiders near the middle in a safe spot and Flat Out to my Opponents units but try and keep a 13-16" range. This 13-16" will prevent most units from rapid firing due to NS, if they manage to wreck my raider I can still have a good chance to assault (3" disembark + 6" move + 7" charge). The PGL will help me get stealth if im in terrain and charging at my opponent. My Reavers will either bladevane Turn 1 or standby and bladevane Turn 2 with my raiders. This will force my opponent to deal with 3 squad of 3+ cover reavers, and up to 4 4+ cover Raiders. My Ravagers will do what all other Ravagers do best.

I don't have Venoms and I refuse to use them. I plan on getting a Voidraven or 2 when the model comes out, I really don't want to use the Razorwing. I'm trying to avoid using an Kabalite due to the Dutchess being forced to group with them. Tell me what you guys think.

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Last edited by Kayto_Karite on Thu 20 Sep - 8:26; edited 2 times in total
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csjarrat
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Wed 19 Sep - 4:40

do you need the archon? he seems a bit odd, given the duke is decent in CC.
i was wondering if you could maybe drop him and get a ranged AI unit
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mug7703
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Wed 19 Sep - 8:50

@csjarrat wrote:
do you need the archon? he seems a bit odd, given the duke is decent in CC.
i was wondering if you could maybe drop him and get a ranged AI unit

This is a good point. You could drop him for a Haemon w/SS, VB (70pts) who can give a Wych unit FNP and give 6 HLs to your Reavers for some AT goodness (with 8 points spare), especially if it takes a while for your Wyches to set up to charge your opponent's vehicles. I think you're slightly lacking in AT for a 2,000 point battle so this will rectify this and make the Reavers very versatile.

It's a nice list but are you sure you really need to DS the Raiders? The wyches can't assault the turn the DS so I don't know how it'll work but it's worth experimenting with for sure! You never know until you try and I love seeing people experiment with new tactics. Let me know how a test run with the list goes. Very Happy
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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Wed 19 Sep - 10:14

The point of this List is to not play the range game. I want to blitzkrieg my opponent until one of us is defeated. My reavers will be AI with the bladevanes, they won't stop bladevaning until they are destroyed or my opponet charges them. My Wyches primary goal is to lock infantry in CC to prevent them from shooting, if any tanks or dreads survive the 2 turns of shooting from my Ravagers then the wyches have the option of taking them out as well.

To me wyches are not big damage dealers in CC, they are meant for attrition and tarpiting. I bring both the Dutchess and the Archon so my opponent has to worry about to heavy hitting CC units. The Dutches will be in one Wyche squad and the Archon will be with another, my opponent wont be able to stop them both. If he does then he wasted his resources lettinng my Reavers and other 2 Wyche squads run freely in his deployment.

With 4 Raider squads and 3 Reaver squads in his deployment and 3 Ravagers in my backline he will be forced to make difficult decisions. Everything in his deployment will have a 3+/4+ cover save and my Ravagers will have a 5++. Whichever decision he makes he can't stop them all and the units he couldnt stop will take advantage of the situation.

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Bibitybopitybacon
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Wed 19 Sep - 21:46

Not bad! but I'd switch the FF to NS on the ravengers. Taking into account ravengers can move 12 and still fire all weapons and get a 5+ cover save and that you want the ravengers to be hanging back out of range it seems like the NS would be better for your plan.
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Steffo
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Thu 20 Sep - 1:45

I believe the duke/dutchess has to be deployed with a unit of warriors or trueborn.
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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Thu 20 Sep - 6:24

Quote :
Q: What happens if your force contains Duke Sliscus but does not
contain any Kabalite Warriors or Kabalite Trueborn, as the Serpent’s
Venom special rule says he must deployed with one of those units? (p51)
A: He will deploy like any other independent character.

I get what your saying about NS over FF. From experience I still prefer the FF for Ravagers. Reason being is you don't always have night fighting and/or turn 1. If I don't have turn 1 then that means my Ravagers don't have Jink. In dawn of way my opponent can put his AT at his 12" line, he still has 36" of range on the table. Most Imperium AT guns are 48" so NS is a bit useless. I see NS being good in hammer and anvil or maybe vanguard strike.

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Thu 20 Sep - 6:37

@Kayto_Karite wrote:

I get what your saying about NS over FF. From experience I still prefer the FF for Ravagers. Reason being is you don't always have night fighting and/or turn 1. If I don't have turn 1 then that means my Ravagers don't have Jink.

Do you not have much cover on your board? Now days with vehicles only needing 25% cover it isn't that hard to get cover for your ravagers. Even with just one piece of cover providing terrain you can make a daisy chain of raiders/ravagers to give cover to each other.

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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Thu 20 Sep - 7:28

@Mushkilla wrote:

Do you not have much cover on your board? Now days with vehicles only needing 25% cover it isn't that hard to get cover for your ravagers. Even with just one piece of cover providing terrain you can make a daisy chain of raiders/ravagers to give cover to each other.

Yeah you do make a good point, I just always used FF and stuck to them out of habit. I could probably try playing without the FF. I would have to figure out where to put the extra 30pts.

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Thu 20 Sep - 7:30

@Kayto_Karite wrote:

Yeah you do make a good point, I just always used FF and stuck to them out of habit. I could probably try playing without the FF. I would have to figure out where to put the extra 30pts.

It's worth trying out, if you don't like it's not like you can go back. Smile

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csjarrat
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Thu 20 Sep - 8:05

the 30 points could go into boosting the non-IC toting hekatrix's up to agonizers, that would help punch through marine armour.
or it could get you a pair of blasters for a reaver squad, giving them some ability to deal with tanks and dreadnoughts. its also a bit more useful if you come up against a heavy mech enemy, or for popping late game drop pods etc for kill points.

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Caranthir987
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 3:10

looks good against a lot of ground based stuff, very good in fact. I would think about swapping that Archon for a Succubus with venom blade and giving your ravagers NS and raiders AS so you can reliably hide on that first turn when you have to go 2nd.

Problem I see is flyers. A lot of competitive lists in 6th @ 2k will have 2-3 flyers, and possibly even more if its guard with their ridiculously undercosted OP vendettas

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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 7:21

@Caranthir987 wrote:
looks good against a lot of ground based stuff, very good in fact. I would think about swapping that Archon for a Succubus with venom blade and giving your ravagers NS and raiders AS so you can reliably hide on that first turn when you have to go 2nd.

Problem I see is flyers. A lot of competitive lists in 6th @ 2k will have 2-3 flyers, and possibly even more if its guard with their ridiculously undercosted OP vendettas

The Raiders won't need AS they will be in reserves deep striking in. I'm just not a believer of NS for long range protection, instead I think it's to deny short range weapons with rapid fire or assault 2/3. I am aware about flyers, so far the meta at my store only 1 flyer is brought. I do plan on doing some shifting and bringing a Voidraven when the model comes out. Even then If i bring 1 or 2 Flyers it still won't be enough to stop the 2 armies that abuse flyers. I will have to wait for GW to get out of Wards* rear and realize that Flyers and AA needs to be rebalanced.

* If a rule sounds OP or seems to highly benefit Crons and/or GK I blame Ward Twisted Evil

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Seshiru
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 10:27

Unfortunately you cannot have the 2 Shadowfields

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Kayto_Karite
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 10:29

@Seshiru wrote:
Unfortunately you cannot have the 2 Shadowfields

Get with the times man. That rule was so last codex.

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Caranthir987
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 12:14

[quote="Kayto_Karite"]
@Caranthir987 wrote:
I'm just not a believer of NS for long range protection, instead I think it's to deny short range weapons with rapid fire or assault 2/3. I am aware about flyers, so far the meta at my store only 1 flyer is brought.

Lucky you. I am saturated with flying croissants as far as the eye can see, and there are a lot of guard (vendetta + hydra spam) players in my area just to rub it in

I suppose the NS are not really needed if your DS'ing in. However if you do ever feel like setting up on the board NS can really, really save your ass if your going second

But like I said before - looks good.

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Seshiru
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 12:43

WOW, that's what i get for reading this so early in the morning.
My brain must of been a few years behind when I got out of bed today

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Mushkilla
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PostSubject: Re: Raining Raider Rush (RRR) 2000   Fri 21 Sep - 12:48

@Seshiru wrote:
WOW, that's what i get for reading this so early in the morning.
My brain must of been a few years behind when I got out of bed today

To be honest I had no idea you could take two shadow fields this edition (I knew you could with special characters, but didn't know you could do it with vanilla archons). So you are not the only one who's old habits die hard! Smile

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