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 What book should I use?

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gunnerboy1607
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PostSubject: What book should I use?   Wed Feb 15 2012, 13:35

Hey everyone, it would be awesome if I can have some assistance.

It's just I have an English assignment coming up soon and includes me having to do a 10minute speech about a certain text. And lucky for me, I am in the sci-fi genre. Hence why I chose to read a 40k book. But the problem is, that I haven't read much of em. And I would just like to ask everyone if they have some ideas.

During this speech I will need to talk about:
1.) how the text fits in to the sci fi genre. (Pretty easy being 40k and all Razz)
2.) socio-historical and cultural aspects
3.) how this text alludes to other texts that you have viewed or read.

But certain elements I should look out for, to make it easier for me to talk about:
1.)shows how science and tech can be abused
2.) utopian or dystopian
3.) concerns about ecological, political, tech, and environment issues. (main emphasis)
4.) quest for freedom and social justice
5.) reflect elements of the contemporary society
6.) rise of feminism
7.) ecological exploitation and degradation
8.) great psychological depth in characterization.

PLEASE EVERYONE!!! Suggest something that fits in with that. I do have one book in mind, but I am open to ideas. I really like the book "for the emperor" the one that's part of ciaphias cain novels. But please do, keep suggesting. And please if u have time. Put in a quick brief on how it fits in well to the criteria! Please it'll be great help!!!! Thanks!!!! Smile

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Wed Feb 15 2012, 16:42

1.) how the text fits in to the sci fi genre. (Pretty easy being 40k and all )
As a popular dystopiam genre with a solid pararrels with Fantasy, space orks, space knights, space inquistion.


2.) socio-historical and cultural aspects

Main side of the conflict - Imperium of Man, society based on late Rome, degrading and collapsing.
Main cultural themes - role of men in very large society, one of the characteristic thing - social changes in perception of human life value with more and more larger human population, to the point when human lives objectevely less valuable resourse then piece of old Technology or Planet or a city.

Next theme - lack of responsiliblity in ever growing society , that is objectevely not possible to control or have any sort of coherent law system. Rise of Aristocratic and Violence based Olygarchic control mechanism.

Religious Zeal theme, another theme on space scale, space church. Interesting thing is that Imperium of Man is theocratic society, even against the will of its creator.

3.) how this text alludes to other texts that you have viewed or read.

You know better.

1.)shows how science and tech can be abused
Exterminatus. Is it moral to destroy entire world(planet) because its population decided to change faith?
Does it justified as a war action?

2.) utopian or dystopian
Radically dystopian.

3.) concerns about ecological, political, tech, and environment issues. (main emphasis)
Ecological - not a concern in the Imperium of man. Earth (Terra) - completely without water, and with giant Hive-cities. Planets have a life cycle of its own bio-sphere from start of population. At some point they are not habitable outside hives. That is not the case with Agricultural planets, but there people live in almost middle-age concerning used tecnology.

Political - autoritarian vertical power, burocracy and theocracy is the main factors of the Imperium of man.

Tech - tecnology based on Standart Template COnstructs , early tech that any colonising ship have. Not all of them recovered. Adapted for military uses. Theocrasy in main techological institute Adeptus Mechanicus has led to monopolising science knowledge. That said institute does not also develop new tech, they just try to preserve and try to spiritually understand technolgy. Complete ban of AI, on the tasks where machine labout is required there is special lobotomised and technolgically augmented humans called servitors.

environment issues - non-existened, no one cares.

4.) quest for freedom and social justice
Freedom is punishable by death, only in servise to the Emperor does one have its salvation.
Social justice is non-existant. On the fron book of any book Imperium described as the most bloody regime ever created.

5.) reflect elements of the contemporary society
Many paraleles with middle ages, many paralels with autoritarian societies.

6.) rise of feminism
Dut to little value of human life itself difference in rights of man and women is pretty slim, everyone doesnt have much of them. So there is no need for feminism.

7.) ecological exploitation and degradation
World and planets are specialised , on the Forge Worlds ecological systems destroyed completely if there is a need.

8.) great psychological depth in characterization.
General lack of men-women interaction in the books. Many of the books written from the face genetically enhanced super-soldiers, who lost ability to reproduse and form pairs.
All of them are subject to psycho-condition and a certain ideals they uphold. There is typically evil-good arhetype conflict between said soldiers and their traitor counterpart.
While both side still is psycho-conditioned, one of it lose its ideals completely and are a slaves to evil powers of the warp.

When stories take placve amongst normal humans main themes are thoughts about survival, inquisitivness ,trying to prosper, survive and prevail in death-worlds conditions.

Society is completely xenophobic.

Sorry for english, lazy to correct mistakes.

You also cant chose one book to cover all the topic. I would suggest to read at least one from Horus Heresy and something from Ultramarines maybe. Books about Cain are too funny )
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gunnerboy1607
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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Thu Feb 16 2012, 12:23

Thank you sooooooo much!!! That is such a big help! No joke! Smile thank you again Smile

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Thu Feb 16 2012, 13:30

You're welcome Wink .

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gunnerboy1607
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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Tue Feb 21 2012, 12:40

Would the ciaphias Cain series be able to provide evidence for all of those? Or should I go much broader and access different books from different series?
Also, would it be easier to show all these information, by using the book planet kill??

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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Wed Feb 22 2012, 09:47

Fulgrim from the horus heresy series would work best out of ones I have read.
There is some debate about industrializing vs. leaving untouched planets untouched. Only 40k book with ecological topics I've seen.
Fabius bile is doing genetic/human augmentation research and there is some debate of the ethic of it within legion. As the legion falls there are different views about if fulgrim is creating a utopia or destroying one.
There is a lot of depth to the motivation of many of the main players, internal thoughts are show from all sides. Marines that turned on legion to follow emperor, turn on emperor. Emperor children and eldar debating inernally if to treat the other as equals or pests. Primarchs wondering after hey choose sides if they made the right choice.
Also, its just one of the better 40k books, always helps for the book to be good.

The only books in 40k to go into a struggle for freedom would be the soul drinkers books, not so much the 1rst but the later books they are trying to live free while still following the ideals of the emperor(not necessarily the same as the imperium's ideals).
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gunnerboy1607
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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Thu Feb 23 2012, 12:24

@azdrubael - okay I just retread ur answers, and thank you again. It's an amazing answer. But I'm just wondering which books will help me support those stuff that you said.
1.) like the whole human lives are nothing compared to a resource or city.
2.) the whole exterminatus idea. (mostly this one, if a novel touches on the idea of the exterminatus an answer would be awesome!)
3.) one that shows about the conditions of Terra (earth) that u told me above Smile

Thanks! An answer would just be totally amazing!

@abjectus - ahhhhhhh thanks man!!! Really appreciate it. I just looked at the novel info at lexicanum...and wow, actually sounds like an enjoyable one to read and use for my assignment!
(out of subject, but Im a chaos player as well, and seeing Fabius starting out would be cool and also like Lucius would be awesome!! Very Happy)

Thanks again!! Smile

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Azdrubael
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PostSubject: Re: What book should I use?   Thu Feb 23 2012, 17:08

1 and 2 - read Ultramarines second book, about Nid invasion.
Graham McNiel - Warriors of Ultramar.

3 - something from Necromunda. Thats not nessasary Terra hive, just any hive.
Andy Chambers - Survival Instinct.

If specifically Terra - Outcast Dead by Graham McNiel.
Whole book take place on Terra, pretty rare for 40k.
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