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 Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?

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Lady Malys
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PostSubject: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 12:42

I realise that we can't exactly apply hard science to this, but genetics still seems about the right word Smile I'm not questioning whether the two can interbreed, because I don't think they are separate species, but are they now so different that they are distinct genetically as well as culturally?

Reading the latest Codex, the Dark Eldar have ruthlessly suppressed any tendency to develop psychic powers, while the Craftworld Eldar and their Exodite cousins all exhibit them to some degree. Not necessarily to the extent of taking a Seer Path, but they are known for having a psychic gift. In Commorragh one of the few forbidden things is the use of psychic ability, whereas on the Craftworlds it's a part of everyday life.

Both types are tall and athletic, but the Dark Eldar are said to be even more physically adept at combat and such manoeuvres.

Are these differences of culture, or of more than what their different upbringing provides? I'm not sure about the physical side of this - after all, Craftworld Eldar are certainly capable of training themselves to the height of readiness for war - though perhaps the focus on conflict in Commorragh has tended to select for greater physical fitness. Would the two be sufficiently different to be classed as subspecies of the original Eldar? I know that this is complicated a bit further by a few of the Dark Eldar actually being those original Eldar, but aside from those few, do any of the Eldar still represent the original Eldar strain?


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Beaviz81
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 13:39

From the little I have learned about genetics I'd say yay. That sort of stuff takes millions of years. Though what might happen is that if they copulate (not an obscene word I hope) they would likely suffer from being a tad infertile due to their differencing natures. But that would be minor issues, they would still be the same species despite everything.
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Shadows Revenge
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 15:27

Personally I think of how much time they have been seperated (if I remember right its been like 6M??? Has been long enough for them to be both a sub-species of the Eldar genus overall. The lack of Psychic potential, the paler skin, and all black eyes (although if I remember right some Eldar have all black eyes as well) should be enough to put them in a different catagory.

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Siticus the Ancient
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 15:53

I highly doubt the ten millenia apart have made them into two completely separate species. Even if it has, it shouldn't stop interbreeding. Old fluff Eldar/human offsprings aside, if a high standing Dark Eldar wanted an Eldar child, or something inbetween, a Haemonculus should be able to make it happen with no problems.

What kind of qualities the child would have... that's difficult to predict.

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Beaviz81
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 15:58

Sorry Shadow. A few Millennias doesn't make them a different race, simple genetics tells us that. What I actually personally find quite disturbing is how similar humans and Eldar DNA must be since half-Eldars are known to excist. A chimp has if memory serves 98% of our DNA, yet I have still to hear about a half-chimp.
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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 18:43

Funny that YET ANOTHER woman (no topics from guys) ask about that kind of stuff. This can't be coincidence...
http://www.thedarkcity.net/t765-question-about-dark-eldar-reproduction

Anyway from what I remember from Xenology book, Eldar have A LOT more complicated DNA than humans. I think that give them quite big resistance to "random screw-ups" (mutations, like Pariah Gene) that would produce unique elves. Add longer life cycle (so longer ) and fact that Eldar didn't changed too much since War in Heaven.
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 18:51

Local Ork, it just can't be that different, as falf-Eldars are known to exist. 99% of the strain at least must be the same. Of course that totally unsettles me.

As for your first point, it's brilliant, and well a tad chavunistic. Just tell Malys you are Gene Hunt and you would be just fine. Smile
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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 19:18

Actually I pointed out that with quite different intention, for some stupid reason I started to seek something more ambitious than this in art featuring females (warning, anatomically incorrect fanart done by frustrated male Razz).

I actually read several blogs, like "Boobs don't work that way", "Go make me a sandwich", "Border House" and other about female design. They are quite refreshing.

If I worded it badly, I'm guy that shave with circular saw, I'm as delicate as steam train Razz

As for half-whatevers, I also remember that Eldar are supposed to have genes compatible with any race.
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 19:29

No just with humans. Which quite seriously scares me.

And you failed miserably. You were supposed to tell Malys you were Gene Hunt. Smile
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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 19:37

I prefer Ymgarling Smile

And yes, possibilities of half-whatever are horrifyingly endless and endlessly horrifying. Which leads to even more "anatomically incorrect" fan arts.
Oh joy.
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 19:44

Now you are doomed Local Ork, you didn't claim to be Gene Hunt, so a woman from Britain will tear you apart over being a chauvenist. Smile Thwy never respect that from anyone but. .)
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Local_Ork
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 20:23

Oh... I didn't know You mean actual person, not Genestealer-related thing.
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 20:29

It's okay, she will understand (I hope). Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 21:03

Some of those picture were freakishly out of proportion or attached strangely, so were 3rd edition wych sculpts for that matter.

I think the difference is cultural, but given enough time that culture will selectively breed real differences. More like 2 breeds of dog then different species of canine, and wolves/dogs can interbreed so eldar could too after they are sub-species. With the long life of eldar, and the cloning it will still be some time till the races diverge. Haemonculi could speed up or slow this if they choose though, so some kabals could pay coven to make there clones 'more dark eldar then dark eldar" with each selective re-clone and have a sub-species pretty fast. Origin of mandrakes maybe similar?
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Phototoxin
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 06 2012, 22:48

I imagine that Eldar have something akin to 4 stranded DNA - offering much more complexity and options for power.
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Lady Malys
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PostSubject: Re: Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics?   Eldar / Dark Eldar Genetics? I_icon_minitimeTue Feb 07 2012, 01:08

Quote :
Funny that YET ANOTHER woman (no topics from guys) ask about that kind of stuff. This can't be coincidence...

Oi! Gene Hunt! Very Happy My question was specifically NOT about reproduction, I have no need to imagine how they get their jollies or their next generation, it was about science :p

Getting back to that, I think that the differences are primarily cultural, myself, with a little divergence. I used the term subspecies because they don't seem completely distinct Smile I like abjectus' point about the Mandrakes. I don't think we have an origin for them, exactly, but I can imagine them becoming saturated with some kind of shadowy energies until they become something other, because as distinct from say the Scourges, who are only physically modfied, they are not Eldar life as we know it. Or perhaps a Haemonclus distilled something in a jar for them ... the designers did say that DE technology is so far advanced as to be indistinguishable from magic some of the time. I wouldnt say the Mandrakes were mutations, precisely, in the sense of the 'whoops, random mutation' of something accidental, like exposure to regular radiation, but more a deliberate soaking up of darkness rays, or whatever the substance might be.

Mandrakes anti-sunbathing in darkness. They're really quite creepy. I like them ...




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