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 The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.

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Spleen Hammer
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PostSubject: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 04:10

Heya,

I was curious as to whether or not any of you take any or the random entities that come in the Court? I can see a court being say, a unit of Incubi with some snazzy bits added on, but the medusa and company seem really out of sync with the rest of the list.

First of all, do they all make a unit that the Archon can then subsequently join, or are they a mere gathering of "DE pets" that have been unleashed for the hell of it?

Second, are any of them even worth the trouble? I've read a score of battle reports and visited the "lists" forum rather frequently and there is dang near zero mention of these things making the field of battle.

I guess in an aesthetic sense the Court could be pretty nifty, but I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around it.

Right on, thanks for any input.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 08:15

A minimum unit (one of each of the 4) is a very cheap unit with a nifty flamer and some durability. Plus its another way to get a 13 or even 14th vehicle in the list.

The problem comes from having to take a minimum of 1 of each of the types.

I have the minimum unit but want to grab 2 more ssylth so the T5 comes into play... but i need a raider for them then...

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 08:21

If the the ladies poison ability made any of the big guys weapons poisoned she would be useful... ahhr yeah poisoned husk blades.
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 08:29

For her cost and stats - the Lhamaean is great value. LD 9, poison 2+ weapons and making the archons basic pistol 2+ as well is great! Think about this - for a mere 1 point over a kabalite warrior you get a venom blade, LD9, and a better pistol plus a buff for the achon (albeit limited)

Not so bad now?

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 10:22

Oh, you have to take one of each minimum?

I thought the whole idea was that you could customise your own court. Lame.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 15:31

Look at the entry - they are all 1-X

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 15:56

I actually think best way to go with court is (unlike most people think) NOT go with shiny things first. Archon is Your shiny thing.

Ur-ghuls seems kinda like ripoff, but they aren't. Not with mass of S5 I6 attacks (on charge). Compare that with Sslyth.
Lhamaeans - exactly what Massaen said.

Actually, shooting elements kinda suck due to fact unit have fleet and is too good in CC to not assault from afar. Oh and they cost 2/3 of base cost.

GW really should FAQ it from "1-X" to "X-Y members" to make it "ok".
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 16:23

Whats interesting for me is that this unit could be exception with just a couple of minor tweaks.

All 4 models are good but the synergy they have is limited and the role they fill is better completed elsewhere

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 17:27

personally I see several ways to run the unit.

2 medusa, 1 of everything else- pretty much this is what you see in a venomspam list to get an extra venom. it gives you 2 extra flamers, which is nice

3 slyth, one of everything else. You let one thing die, and you got T5 against shooting... awesome.

alot of urguls... one of everything else. Alot of FC things

They are ok, and compliment each other well... The problem is the having to take 1 of everything (if you want an assaulty unit, the medusa is a wasted space...) and that they are outclassed by everything else

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 17:43

I love the court of the archon. For a while I was running a min court with an extra medusae, they were great for a counter assault unit and a good way to get another unit choice in when at a doubles tournament when the FOC would be restricted.

Lets just say that every time I have used one I have not been sad about it.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 18:06

@Shadows Revenge wrote:
2 medusa, 1 of everything else- pretty much this is what you see in a venomspam list to get an extra venom. it gives you 2 extra flamers, which is nice

Sadly, that unit isn't quite legal due to fact 5 member limit include Archon (he count as part of unit).
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 19:37

I use the court and I love it! More than once my Medusae has nuked a unit of 3+ armor saves models. More than once has this unit allowed me to tie something up or even finsih something off as my other units went about their business. They let me take an additional venom with is always fun. And the possibilities of a full court would just be a hoot to see on the table, all of those attacks would just make me giggle and an extra dark lance to boot. Oh yeah, not bad at all. Are they a face puncher like Incubi? No, but they sure are fun to use and they look cool!
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 20:44

@Local_Ork wrote:
@Shadows Revenge wrote:
2 medusa, 1 of everything else- pretty much this is what you see in a venomspam list to get an extra venom. it gives you 2 extra flamers, which is nice

Sadly, that unit isn't quite legal due to fact 5 member limit include Archon (he count as part of unit).

actually he isnt. The court is its own slot, there is no rule saying the Archon has to be deployed with them, or that he counts towards their squad size to buy a transport. They are not a retinue, as most retinues have been taken out of the game (sadly, the ability to not be picked out in combat is a great rule imho) the Court is like the command squad in the SM dex, it is its own extra squad on the battlefield. So theoretically you could have 10 members of the court in a raider, while the Archon runs around with incubi or wyches or what have you.
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 21:40

It's quite legal, on top of that it's our only way to get 2 Template weapons inside a Venom.

(EDIT: unless you're into Bloodstones.)

Which is one way to run them. The other would be to have a Raider chock full of Ur-Ghuls. I like the Sslyth models but feel their performance is outshined rather harshly by Grots.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Wed Dec 28 2011, 22:18

@Massaen wrote:
For her cost and stats - the Lhamaean is great value. LD 9, poison 2+ weapons and making the archons basic pistol 2+ as well is great! Think about this - for a mere 1 point over a kabalite warrior you get a venom blade, LD9, and a better pistol plus a buff for the achon (albeit limited)

Not so bad now?

She isn't bad per say but she isn't great... LD9? Big woop if I don't have the court I don't need that Leadership... Venom blades are ok... but then you need the unit to be big enough that it is actually useful in combat...

2+ poisoned weapon... isn't bad for the big boss if he has poisoned weapons of some sort... but has for the splinter pistol... My guy only ever gets a couple of shots before or between combats so the bonus isn't a big deal to me... I would say it is horrible for giving away a KPs but since DE armies normally have tonnes I guess it won't make a difference.

It is the unit as a whole that is the problem... I was just saying if I could make my husk blade poisoned it would be worth taking... BWAHAHAHAHAHA

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Thu Dec 29 2011, 01:38

@Raneth wrote:
It's quite legal, on top of that it's our only way to get 2 Template weapons inside a Venom.
(EDIT: unless you're into Bloodstones.)

You can go with 3 incubi inc klaivex with blood stone plus 2 haemy's with liquifer guns for some real laughs!

@hellios wrote:
She isn't bad per say but she isn't great... LD9? Big woop if I don't have the court I don't need that Leadership... Venom blades are ok... but then you need the unit to be big enough that it is actually useful in combat...

if your running a court, LD 9 is a big whoop... its easy to break them without it. Venom blades are fine at 5 points but for less than 1 point it is gold! Making the unit functional for combat involves ssylth and urghuls... not Lhamaean who is simply a combat bonus.

@hellios wrote:
2+ poisoned weapon... isn't bad for the big boss if he has poisoned weapons of some sort... but has for the splinter pistol... My guy only ever gets a couple of shots before or between combats so the bonus isn't a big deal to me... I would say it is horrible for giving away a KPs but since DE armies normally have tonnes I guess it won't make a difference.

Look, the 2+ bonus only works on his splinter pistol so yeah its not exactly WOW but its free and effective. As for the KP comment - not sure what you mean?

@hellios wrote:
It is the unit as a whole that is the problem... I was just saying if I could make my husk blade poisoned it would be worth taking... BWAHAHAHAHAHA

There is a reason it does not work with the husk blade... it would be too effective. The unit as a whole is not a problem - its actually very good. But the job it does is done at least as well by other units for cheaper points.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Fri Dec 30 2011, 16:11

That is interesting that the court does not have to be part of the archons unit. I guess I always thought it did. It does change up some things.

I might try out the court in a venom as a harassment unit...
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Fri Dec 30 2011, 17:20

So if Archon isn't part of unit, that make whole thing... interesting.
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Fri Dec 30 2011, 18:42

Meh. I've honestly given them a shot but found the basic FOC choices overpower them still.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Fri Dec 30 2011, 19:31

@Raneth wrote:
Meh. I've honestly given them a shot but found the basic FOC choices overpower them still.

same. At 2k if you MSU Venomspam, you still have a ton of points after 3 ravagers, 6 troop choices and 3 elite (plus archon HQ) imho though those points are better used for some of our great FA slots
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Fri Dec 30 2011, 21:09

Wondering - isn't the case so that lhamaeans only affect themselves and the archon, or do they give poison to the other members of the court?

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Fri Dec 30 2011, 22:40

Only their and Archon weapons. Kinda bummer considering Shard Carabine in unit that don't get 2+.
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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Sat Dec 31 2011, 01:10

As a firing platform the Sslyth is horribly overpriced anyway.

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PostSubject: Re: The Court of the Archon... I don't get it.   Sat Dec 31 2011, 06:50

Exactly why I would leave big guy in home... Not too shabby in CC either.
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