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 Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please

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Serpent Fly
Hellion
Serpent Fly

Posts : 40
Join date : 2019-03-03

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PostSubject: Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please   Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please I_icon_minitimeTue May 14 2019, 11:13

Greetings fellow Archons, Succubus, and Haemonculi.

I have here my 1500pt list that I am currently running at my local club, and wanted your opinions. I have played it once and plan to again this week. I enjoyed the speed that this list brings, especially the melee threat of the cult elements. Blast pistols on wyches are new, first game I had a Sslyth instead.

Flayed Skull Battalion +5CP

HQ
Archon, huskblade blast pistol obsidian veil soulthurst (warlord)

Dracon, huskblade splinter pistol

Troops
Kabalites x5, Blaster PGL
- Venom, 2 Splinter cannons

Kabalites x5, Blaster PGL
- Venom, 2 Splinter cannons

Kabalites x5, Blaster PGL
- Venom, 2 Splinter cannons

Hvy Support
Ravager, 3 dissies

Ravager, 3 dissies

Cult of Strife Patrol +0 CP

HQ
Succubus, A-Glave Blast pistol Helm of spite (Serpentin)

Troops
Wyches x8, agoniser blast pistol shardnet & impaler (Adrenalight)
- Raider, dissie shock prow

Wyches x8, agoniser blast pistol shardnet & impaler (Hypex)
- Raider, dissie

Fast Attack
Hellions x10, PGL (Grave lotus)

Reavers x9, 3 grav talons (Painbringer)

Battle forged +3 CP

Spending 1 CP for additional relic, which gives me 7CP to start. Archon and Succubus ride with wyches, Dracon starts with them but jumps out to support ravagers T1 (shudders at the ridiculousness of that).

Please let me know your thoughts.
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hydranixx
Wych
hydranixx

Posts : 545
Join date : 2013-11-26

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PostSubject: Re: Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please   Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please I_icon_minitimeWed May 15 2019, 02:27

So there's a lot to consider when building two subfactions together.

Firstly, you can share transports regardless of their subfaction pick - so in your list preferences I'd rather go with Flayed Skull Raiders rather than Cult of Strife Raiders, because you'd get +3 move and ignores cover on their guns.

@Serpent Fly wrote:

Flayed Skull Battalion +5CP

HQ
Archon, huskblade blast pistol obsidian veil soulthurst (warlord)

Dracon, huskblade splinter pistol


I don't really see the appeal of Obsidian Veil or Soulthirst - we have some strong Relics and Warlord Traits and neither of these are one of them. If you want a pure Dark Eldar melee beatstick Archon, there's only two choices to my mind:

- Archon with Djinn Blade with either Hatred Eternal (and optional Blaster).
- Archon with Djinn Blade with Famed Savagery.

He either shoots a BS2+ Blaster at 18", and swings 7 times in melee at Str 4 AP-3, with re rolls 1s to hit and full re rolls to wound for both, which is just a superb choice. Full rerolls to wound means that he can even hurt monsters and vehicles.

Or he swings 8 times at Str 5 AP-3, which minces infantry of all kinds and can still dent light vehicles.


@Serpent Fly wrote:

Troops
Kabalites x5, Blaster PGL
- Venom, 2 Splinter cannons

Kabalites x5, Blaster PGL
- Venom, 2 Splinter cannons

Kabalites x5, Blaster PGL
- Venom, 2 Splinter cannons

I think the PGLs and Splinter Cannons and 39 wasted points that could be better spent. Splinter Cannons on Venoms is a divisive subject. Some people love them, some hate them, I'm of the latter opinion. Your Kabalites want to be within 12" to maximise shooting, especially since you're Flayed Skull, but the dual cannon Venoms reward you for hovering at 18" so it just isn't good if you're looking for raw efficiency.


@Serpent Fly wrote:

Hvy Support
Ravager, 3 dissies

Ravager, 3 dissies

This is fine - but where's the third one?


@Serpent Fly wrote:

Cult of Strife Patrol +0 CP

Ok, panic stations everyone.

Patrols are generally terrible, and there's very few instances where taking a Patrol is the right decision.


@Serpent Fly wrote:

HQ
Succubus, A-Glave Blast pistol Helm of spite (Serpentin)

Don't auto-lock Helm Of Spite unless you know what you're against. That's 1CP you won't get back and could be totally useless.

@Serpent Fly wrote:

Troops
Wyches x8, agoniser blast pistol shardnet & impaler (Adrenalight)
- Raider, dissie shock prow

Wyches x8, agoniser blast pistol shardnet & impaler (Hypex)
- Raider, dissie

This could easily be split into 3 units of 5 Wyches, opening up the option for a full Battalion, giving more options for Combat Drugs and letting you be in more places at once.

Additionally, as I detailed above, you need not make these Raiders Cult of Strife. Flayed Skull Raiders are faster, Black Heart Raiders are tougher, and Red Grief Raiders are great aggression pieces (You can pair their 14" move with a 8" auto advance via Enhanced Aethersails and still charge which makes them excellent at tying up shooting units or getting your models up the board right into the enemy gunline instantly. I really rate Red Grief Raiders.)


@Serpent Fly wrote:

Fast Attack
Hellions x10, PGL (Grave lotus)

Reavers x9, 3 grav talons (Painbringer)

I cannot recommend Hellions for anything, as much as it pains me to say so. They're just terrible.

Reavers can be good, but they're best with Red Grief. They can fulfill the same function as the Red Grief Raiders that I outlined above, but they're even faster, and have drugs that give them even more speed, they don't have to use a strat to get 8" advance, and they're infinitely more expendable.

You can also split the Reavers into 3 units of 3 each, giving you more options to send them in waves, tie up multiple units at once, and morale won't be as big of an issue as it is for 9 of them. This way you can also run an Outrider detachment this way and earn 1 CP for your effort (though I still recommend going for a Battalion for +5)



Overall, here's my suggestions changes:

Cut:
Cut yours Hellions, cut your PGLs, cut your Splinter Cannons, cut your Blast Pistols, cut 3 of your Wyches, and split them into 3 units, *maybe* cut some of the Reaver count down to afford the third Ravager

Add:
Add a second Succubus so you can secure a double Battalion, add a third Ravager when you can.

_________________
A Song Of Vice And Liars: Cynic's Sect Kabal

"Of course you should fight fire with fire! You should fight everything with fire."
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Serpent Fly
Hellion
Serpent Fly

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PostSubject: Re: Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please   Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please I_icon_minitimeThu May 16 2019, 21:38

Thanks for the advice! I should have made it clearer but the raiders are going to be flayed skull. I'm afraid I'm in the twin cannon camp for the venoms, but I do understand where you're coming from. 18" away just makes it harder for melee units to catch them, if only a little. I agree with you about twin battalion. I should have stated that for this list we are running battalion + 1 other detachment. Will probably resort into outrider as you suggested.

Ahh hellions, I have had them do okay but as you say not competitive so will most likely be cut. I worry about small units of reavers giving away easy kills for victory points. Also a bug unit of 9 reavers is a tough unit to crack, and strife means a turn 2 charge can actually do something. I've ran them red grief before and when they connect it just seems lackluster. But I am willing to split them and try the 3x3.

As for the Archon I was trying to see if i could make a survivalist but I guess its probably better to kill quicker. And yes the helm of spite was in there as an extra as I face alot of psykers normally, but ofc it's the extra relic strat so I wouldn't pick it if I faced say Tau. And finally I do plan on getting that third ravager when I can afford it.

Thanks again
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hydranixx
Wych
hydranixx

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PostSubject: Re: Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please   Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please I_icon_minitimeFri May 17 2019, 02:03

Another option (if you have more reavers) would be to structure them as units of 2x3 and 1x9 to unlock your outrider. That way you can have a big blob like you'd like to use as well as smaller units to tie up things early on or take objectives.

_________________
A Song Of Vice And Liars: Cynic's Sect Kabal

"Of course you should fight fire with fire! You should fight everything with fire."
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Serpent Fly
Hellion
Serpent Fly

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Join date : 2019-03-03

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PostSubject: Re: Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please   Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please I_icon_minitimeFri May 17 2019, 08:38

Yea I really like that idea, I will be proxying some hellions as reavers in my next game I think.
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PostSubject: Re: Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please   Kabal/Cult 1500pts C&C please I_icon_minitime

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