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Gizamaluke
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PostSubject: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 26 2019, 17:04

Ynnari Mini Codex! 15536110


Potential Ynnari Mini-dex like the assassin one in May White Dwarf? What could this mean for the rumours of an actual Ynnari Dex?
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krayd
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 26 2019, 18:57

It probably means that an actual codex is at *least* a year away.

I assume that the Index will have a page or two of stratagems, a warlord trait table, and a full psychic discipline table. Hopefully, they'll reorganize things so that you can take standard HQs for Ynarri detachments without having to include the Big 3.

I would *like* for there to be a table of revised points costs for all Aeldari units when  placed within a Ynarri detachment, so as to reflect their usefulness as Ynarri, so that there will be less of an inclination for GW to overprice them in their respective codices. However, I know that I shouldn't expect that.
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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 26 2019, 19:19

Anyone else seeing the incubi in the background? As sadly optimistic as I am ... Maybe this points to new plastic sculpts for them? And possibly better rules?
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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 26 2019, 21:37

i hope they dont change the yncarne teleport ability in any way... I started playing Ynnari recently and im having so much fun with her... really unique
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Gizamaluke
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 26 2019, 22:02

I may be being optimistic but if it is a mini dex I'd expect;
A warlord trait for each Ynnari Character.
3 more psychic powers.
3 relics; 1 for DE, CWE and Harlequin characters in an Ynnari list
A couple of stratagems.

I would also accept points decreases for the Yncarne and Visarch, potentially some kind of buff to Incubi by the Visaech would be cool.
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 27 2019, 01:08

I guess this is probably the most graceful way they could be dragged out behind the woodshed.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 27 2019, 07:06

There's a much simpler explanation. The index's are being phased out and the Ynnari currently have no rules in print other than the index.

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Squidmaster
Klaivex
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 27 2019, 09:53

@Count Adhemar wrote:
There's a much simpler explanation. The index's are being phased out and the Ynnari currently have no rules in print other than the index.

An excellent point. ANd how many FAQs has it been? Its hard to track down the current version of their rules now!

I really hope this is a rebuild too. The rules as is just aren't great. In my opinion it would make far more sense for <YNNARI> to be taken as a <CRAFTWORLD/KABAL/CULT/MASQUE>, and for Soulburst to be a Stratagem. In my opinion.
If this is just a reprint of the existing rule, I think that would be crap.

Although to a degree, this is also upsetting, because it feels like an admission that there isn;t much that can be done with the Ynnari concept right now, and there won't be an advance in the Eldar side of the story.
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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 27 2019, 11:33

I've said elsewhere that they need to rework the mechanics of the Ynnari from the ground up. There is simply no sense or need for every Ynnari detachment to include one of the Triumvirate. Soulburst is problematic, as shown by the sheer number of iterations of it since 8e came out. The interaction between existing faction rules and Ynnari units is even more of an issue.

Personally I'd say that Ynnari needs to be its own faction. You lose everything from your own faction when you are in a Ynnari detachment - so no stratagems, relics, warlord traits etc but gain access to Ynnari-specific abilities. I like Soulburst as a stratagem too.

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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 27 2019, 11:37

The update is on the May issue right?
My guess is they will nerf soulburst In the big faq next month and then buff them by giving them strata, warlord trait and relics in the white dwarf
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dumpeal
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 27 2019, 14:54

A nice way to use the power from death would be when a unit is killed, you gain a CP token that is only usable until the next phase. Soulburst is severals stratagems with different cost that can be used more than once per phase.
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 07:36

A better way to work soulburst would be old pain tokens from 5e. Or nerf its existing form so hard no one would ever use it. Locking it behind a 4CP stratagem or limiting it to once per type per game would do it.

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Count Adhemar
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 09:21

If it's going to be a stratagem then it either needs to be the current version of Soulburst at a low CP cost or the original version at a higher cost.

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Klaivex
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 10:47

I've had a thought.

What if Ynnari were a Specialist Detachment like those in the Vigilus books?
Apply it to any Aeldari Detachment (which does not contain the usual list).
As with normal Specialist Detachments, every unit gains a new keyword - Ynnari. This gives them a couple of Relics and a simple 1 or 2cp Stratagem for Soulburst.
You can still add the three characters, but they can only join Ynnari Detachments.

This would be a nice and simple solution for how to make them work.
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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 11:03

@Squidmaster wrote:
I've had a thought.

What if Ynnari were a Specialist Detachment like those in the Vigilus books?
Apply it to any Aeldari Detachment (which does not contain the usual list).
As with normal Specialist Detachments, every unit gains a new keyword - Ynnari. This gives them a couple of Relics and a simple 1 or 2cp Stratagem for Soulburst.
You can still add the three characters, but they can only join Ynnari Detachments.

This would be a nice and simple solution for how to make them work.

hmmm interesting... though i dont think they would want to make them feel like a "special force" rather than a complete army...
Tbh i would be happy if they removed their craftworld/kabal/masque keyword completely and gained Ynnari and then we could include units from all aeldari factions in the same detachment with thei own relics and stratagems... could make for really cool compositions but maybe would be considered op?
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Klaivex
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 11:12

@DevilDoll wrote:
hmmm interesting... though i dont think they would want to make them feel like a "special force" rather than a complete army...
Tbh i would be happy if they removed their craftworld/kabal/masque keyword completely and gained Ynnari and then we could include units from all aeldari factions in the same detachment with thei own relics and stratagems... could make for really cool compositions but maybe would be considered op?


Interesting, because a "special force" rather than a complete army is exactly how I've always considered them. Because they just pick from three other armies, I've always considered them outside of that and just a special way of taking other things.
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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 11:35

@Squidmaster wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:
hmmm interesting... though i dont think they would want to make them feel like a "special force" rather than a complete army...
Tbh i would be happy if they removed their craftworld/kabal/masque keyword completely and gained Ynnari and then we could include units from all aeldari factions in the same detachment with thei own relics and stratagems... could make for really cool compositions but maybe would be considered op?


Interesting, because a "special force" rather than a complete army is exactly how I've always considered them. Because they just pick from three other armies, I've always considered them outside of that and just a special way of taking other things.

yeah i understand what you mean the thing is that fluffwise they arent a special force of existing Aeldari factions they are an entirely different faction often in war with the rest of the Eldar factions (its always hilarious seeing Ynnari and black heart detachments in the same army thats like putting chaos and imperium together)
But yeah when did GW care about fluff and tabletop mechanics working together huh?
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krayd
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 16:10

@DevilDoll wrote:


yeah i understand what you mean the thing is that fluffwise they arent a special force of existing Aeldari factions they are  an entirely different faction often in war with the rest of the Eldar factions (its always hilarious seeing Ynnari and black heart detachments in the same army thats like putting chaos and imperium together)
But yeah when did GW care about fluff and tabletop mechanics working together huh?

Well, if you really want to get down to semantics, it's generally not an actual 'black heart' kabal detachment, but a kabal that uses the same obsession as black heart. I don't think I've ever actually seen an army on the tabletop in person actually painted as actual black heart.
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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeThu Mar 28 2019, 18:25

@krayd wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:


yeah i understand what you mean the thing is that fluffwise they arent a special force of existing Aeldari factions they are  an entirely different faction often in war with the rest of the Eldar factions (its always hilarious seeing Ynnari and black heart detachments in the same army thats like putting chaos and imperium together)
But yeah when did GW care about fluff and tabletop mechanics working together huh?

Well, if you really want to get down to semantics, it's generally not an actual 'black heart' kabal detachment, but a kabal that uses the same obsession as black heart. I don't think I've ever actually seen an army on the tabletop in person actually painted as actual black heart.

ok touche ^^
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Gizamaluke
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeFri Mar 29 2019, 21:30

I've heard through the grapevine, so take it with a pinch of salt, that the index is going to be a Soulburst rework along the lines of Acts of Faith I.e units kill award tokens that can be used to perform soulburst techniques like +1 to hit, +3" to move, improved FNP.
Not sure how that would hold up against the other eldar books but could be interesting, setting up some kind of +1 to hit stacking buffs. Who knows!
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Squidmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 30 2019, 19:06

That would be interesting.
Especially seeing as GW decided that the beta Acts of Faith didn't work and are completely reworking it.
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Vailex
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 31 2019, 14:24

@Gizamaluke wrote:
I've heard through the grapevine, so take it with a pinch of salt, that the index is going to be a Soulburst rework along the lines of Acts of Faith I.e units kill award tokens that can be used to perform soulburst techniques like +1 to hit, +3" to move, improved FNP.
Not sure how that would hold up against the other eldar books but could be interesting, setting up some kind of +1 to hit stacking buffs. Who knows!

Sounds good to me. I'm not a fan of out of sequence events in this system. They can work if there is a downside such as -1 to hit via auspex scanner strat.
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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeMon Apr 01 2019, 00:43

@Gizamaluke wrote:
I've heard through the grapevine, so take it with a pinch of salt, that the index is going to be a Soulburst rework along the lines of Acts of Faith I.e units kill award tokens that can be used to perform soulburst techniques like +1 to hit, +3" to move, improved FNP.
Not sure how that would hold up against the other eldar books but could be interesting, setting up some kind of +1 to hit stacking buffs. Who knows!

That's a step in the right direction. Now all they have to do is actually give them limitations on what units they can bring, and give those units specific points adjustments, and it might be a functional army variant rather than the go-to must have option.

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AzraeI
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Apr 02 2019, 19:53

all the (slightly confirmed) rumors aside, what do you think about this:
They get all the units they had previously, their schtick is they can advance/, shoot and charge,
points costs adjusted, taken from their very own codex, no craftworld/dark eldar/harleuqin stratagems on the units avaailable and restrictions with the battle brother rule, ie no covens and black heart detachments (for fluff and balancing reasons)
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krayd
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PostSubject: Re: Ynnari Mini Codex!   Ynnari Mini Codex! I_icon_minitimeTue Apr 02 2019, 20:14

@AzraeI wrote:
all the (slightly confirmed) rumors aside, what do you think about this:
They get all the units they had previously, their schtick is they can advance/, shoot and charge,
points costs adjusted, taken from their very own codex, no craftworld/dark eldar/harleuqin stratagems on the units avaailable and restrictions with the battle brother rule, ie no covens and black heart detachments (for fluff and balancing reasons)

I'd be fine with no Prophets of Flesh allies for fluff reasons, but allowing other covens would be fine (for fluff reasons, considering that there is supposed to be a subfaction of haemonculi devoted to Ynnead). Hell, it might actually mean non-PoF covens actually seeing use on the tabletop.
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