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Silverglade
Sybarite
Silverglade

Posts : 441
Join date : 2012-12-30

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PostSubject: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 04 2019, 22:34

I don't know if it's worth bothering to ask the question, as I think the Webway gate is waaaaay to many points for what it gets you. BUT.

Rules question for you.

With the change to have Reserves come in on Turn 2.

If I deploy the Webway gate and it is destroyed on Turn 1. Can I play the strategem (can't remember what it's called right now) that allows me to deploy one unit that was waiting in reserves?

My thinking is yes. But I don't have much of anything to back me up other than the fact that the rules on the strategem (specific) would trump the reserves rule (general) in this instance.

What say you all?

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dumpeal
Hekatrix
dumpeal

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 04 2019, 23:02

I don't think, no. There is no writting allowing this exception. If that happens, you would lose your units.
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Squidmaster
Incubi
Squidmaster

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeTue Feb 05 2019, 09:41

Unfortunately, when you set up using the Webway Gate, you explicitly deploy them in a "Webway Spar".

THe rules for the Webway gate then say:
"If all friendly Webway Gates have been destroyed, any units that have not yet arrived from a webway spar are considered to be slain."

So if the gate is destroyed turn one, the unitds coming through it are destroyed.
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Silverglade
Sybarite
Silverglade

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeWed Feb 06 2019, 02:46

@Squidmaster wrote:
Unfortunately, when you set up using the Webway Gate, you explicitly deploy them in a "Webway Spar".

THe rules for the Webway gate then say:
"If all friendly Webway Gates have been destroyed, any units that have not yet arrived from a webway spar are considered to be slain."

So if the gate is destroyed turn one, the unitds coming through it are destroyed.


True. But there is the Harlequin strategem that allows you deploy one unit that was in the Webway spar before the gate is destroyed.

that's really my question. it is the use of the strategem that i'm wondering if we can jump to Turn 1 in using.

Do others agree with Dumpeal's take on it? Not saying he's wrong. Just looking for opinions.
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dumpeal
Hekatrix
dumpeal

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeWed Feb 06 2019, 04:51

After investigation on several forum, this is a very contested point. Somes says as I did that since it's a first turn deep strike, it isn't allowed and the unit is destroyed. BUT, somes others says that if the gate is destroyed, it's because the opponent shot at it, meaning it's during the OPPONENT first turn. It's not your first turn anymore. BUUUTTTT !!! Thanks to GW perfect wording, the sentence of the deep strike rule can be interpreted as "The first turn of any player" AND "Your first turn only".

In conclusion, it's a mess.
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Squidmaster
Incubi
Squidmaster

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeThu Feb 07 2019, 08:58

Hmm.

"The Labyrinth Laughs" is the one you mean I believe.
The Stratagem doesn't make any explicit limitations, so on reading it I would say that you CAN use it in the first turn. Unless eventually errataed. Errated?
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dumpeal
Hekatrix
dumpeal

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeThu Feb 07 2019, 17:24

@Squidmaster wrote:
Hmm.

"The Labyrinth Laughs" is the one you mean I believe.
The Stratagem doesn't make any explicit limitations, so on reading it I would say that you CAN use it in the first turn. Unless eventually errataed. Errated?

The problem doesn't lie in the Labyrinth Laughs stratagem. It lies in the Deep Strike rule. To bypass the limitation of the Deep Strike rule that forbid turn 1 deep strike outside our zone, you need a special rule that explicitly allows it. There is no such rule in the Labyrinth Laughs stratagem.
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Squidmaster
Incubi
Squidmaster

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 08 2019, 09:41

@dumpeal wrote:
@Squidmaster wrote:
Hmm.

"The Labyrinth Laughs" is the one you mean I believe.
The Stratagem doesn't make any explicit limitations, so on reading it I would say that you CAN use it in the first turn. Unless eventually errataed. Errated?

The problem doesn't lie in the Labyrinth Laughs stratagem. It lies in the Deep Strike rule. To bypass the limitation of the Deep Strike rule that forbid turn 1 deep strike outside our zone, you need a special rule that explicitly allows it. There is no such rule in the Labyrinth Laughs stratagem.

I think it could be argued that the whole rule is a special rule which overrides it, based on Codex trumps Rulebook.
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Count Adhemar
Dark Lord of Granbretan
Count Adhemar

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 08 2019, 10:51

Is 'codex trumps rulebook' a thing in 8e? I forget.

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dumpeal
Hekatrix
dumpeal

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 08 2019, 15:06

@Squidmaster wrote:
@dumpeal wrote:
@Squidmaster wrote:
Hmm.

"The Labyrinth Laughs" is the one you mean I believe.
The Stratagem doesn't make any explicit limitations, so on reading it I would say that you CAN use it in the first turn. Unless eventually errataed. Errated?

The problem doesn't lie in the Labyrinth Laughs stratagem. It lies in the Deep Strike rule. To bypass the limitation of the Deep Strike rule that forbid turn 1 deep strike outside our zone, you need a special rule that explicitly allows it. There is no such rule in the Labyrinth Laughs stratagem.

I think it could be argued that the whole rule is a special rule which overrides it, based on Codex trumps Rulebook.

It only overrides if there is a rule that overrides it. It's sad, but we would lose our model. The good part, though, is that it's the same with the necrons and their emergency invasion beam.
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amishprn86
Dracon
amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: Webway Gate   Webway Gate I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 08 2019, 19:58

Please email this is the rules team. Not joking, please do.

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