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Garion
Kabalite Warrior
Garion

Posts : 113
Join date : 2011-12-10

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PostSubject: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 28 2018, 00:05

The new Orks Codex just dropped bringing along something that could really hurt us: the mek gunz with trackor beam

Heavy 1, 48" S8 Ap -2 DD6 that AUTO HIT
Against models that FLY, it switch to melta damage (roll 2D6,pick hightest) and if a veichle (with FLY) is destroyed it automatically blows up

Three models per unit at the cost of 9 impalers each

Should we move all our transports / flyers to Black Heart?
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Cerve
Wych
Cerve

Posts : 799
Join date : 2014-10-05
Location : Ferrara - Emiglia Romagna

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 28 2018, 00:33

@Garion wrote:
The new Orks Codex just dropped bringing along something that could really hurt us: the mek gunz with trackor beam

Heavy 1, 48" S8 Ap -2 DD6 that AUTO HIT
Against models that FLY, it switch to melta damage (roll 2D6,pick hightest) and if a veichle (with FLY) is destroyed it automatically blows up

Three models per unit at the cost of 9 impalers each

Should we move all our transports / flyers to Black Heart?

Honestly? I'll hope into an Orks who run these things. That means that he have less room for the terrifing amount of fast CC a new Ork can run right now!
Seriously, that Codex can build serious lists that can simply close you into a corner!

I guess Grotesques will be even more valuable right now Smile



If you think about those Traktors: 6 of them are 270 points, 6 autohits, 4 wounds (3+), you still save at 5++ which mean 3 wounds (sometimes just 2). 3 D6 damages.
But you need to split your fire before firing, because they are all single units (like Carnifex), so it's even easier to fall into overshooting a veichle.
All in all, they're not such a threat for an army that can field like 7-10 veichles easy.

I fear more a great MadMax/Horde army from EvilSunz. A lot of bodies, really fast, with a good hit and large amount of shoots.
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Lord Asvaldir
Hekatrix
Lord Asvaldir

Posts : 1060
Join date : 2015-12-06
Location : Washington DC

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 01 2018, 06:19

It sounds like they are still reasonably expensive, you might see 1-2 in a Ork list to deal with fliers, but for an army like ours where we easily have lots of flying vehicles no ork list is going to have enough traktors to deal with.

I agree with Cerve, I think the greater threat will be this new speed orks have. All the new buggies seem very cheap and they can match our first turn charge potential with warbikes. Evil suns armies in particular will be pretty much equal to our fastest units so it will be a lot harder to kite orks with warriors in raiders/venoms when orks are moving so fast. It will probably be necessary to take some more melee threats against orks to keep their faster melee units tied up, which fortunetly isn't really a problem for us.

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Garion
Kabalite Warrior
Garion

Posts : 113
Join date : 2011-12-10

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 01 2018, 12:27

So, for a pure or semi-pure Kabal list, you guys fell the need of some dedicated CC units to stop or counter charge those fast Orks (30-60 Boyz could also Jump or teleport in our back field) like Grots or maybe some big blobs of Wyches (maybe a Red Grief battalion)?

So far the I've only run a big 12-man Reavers unit along side my Kabals but I'm not sure it will be enough to keep the Orks at bay
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Cerve
Wych
Cerve

Posts : 799
Join date : 2014-10-05
Location : Ferrara - Emiglia Romagna

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 01 2018, 14:25

@Garion wrote:
So, for a pure or semi-pure Kabal list, you guys fell the need of some dedicated CC units to stop or counter charge those fast Orks (30-60 Boyz could also Jump or teleport in our back field) like Grots or maybe some big blobs of Wyches (maybe a Red Grief battalion)?

So far the I've only run a big 12-man Reavers unit along side my Kabals but I'm not sure it will be enough to keep the Orks at bay

It depends. Grots and Talos still good against them (but carefull: I saw two units of Lootas becomes one, roll a 3 for the number of hits, rerolling 1s for BadMoonz, getting DakkaDakka at 5+...and they can even shoot twice with another stratagem: it can shred your Talos easy if they manage to shoot at them) but it's not mandatory. If you're good with chaff units, using your veichles for that, I think you can manage them anyway.
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Elfric
Hellion
Elfric

Posts : 95
Join date : 2018-03-04

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 04 2018, 19:30

I also run Orks and played them with the new Codex against a friend who runs Blood Angels and Grey Knights. I won the game 14-9.

My initial thought so far, is that Freebooters are really powerful. Everyone on Dakka keep talking about the others and I can't believe how overlooked Freebooters are. To be fair, I do own 15 flashgitz which I imagine a lot of people don't. The Freebooters Army rule is:

"Add 1 to hit roles for attacks made by models with this kultur if any other friendly unit with this kultur within 24' has destroyed an ememy unit"

Flashgitz have BS4, and Snazzgunz are 24', Heavy 3, Str 6, -2AP, Dmg 2. This is an insanely powerful weapon. And Baddrukk allows re-rolls 1's to hit. Combine this with DDD rule of exploding 6's, and you have a very powerful fire platform. Basically Flashgitz hitting on 3's if they don't move and something else in the detachment makes a kill that turn. The Kaptin in a squad of FG, which is like a sergeant, gets a +1 to hit if he has a Gitfinda. So, does this stack with their army rule? Because that means he would be getting +2 to hit under the right circumstances. I was just sticking 2 squads of two FG with a squad of Shootaboyz in a battlewagon with 4 big shootas, open topped, in the middle of the Board, with Badrukk sitting to the left of it in cover.

Weirdboyz buffed to Warpheads are very good now, and count as HQ's. Ghazskull with the right powers and stratagems is just a monster now.

I also used Evil Sunz and +1 to move, advance and charge is no joke either.

Battlewagons with Deffrollers (Bonebreakers) are just amazing now.

Traktor Kannon spam is going to be a problem for Aeldari races. Auto hits, and has melta damage on Flyers. If it destroys a vehicle, that vehicle automatically explodes. 48' range, Strength 8, -2AP, D6 damage. A Traktor Kannon is 45 points, and you can have 6 in a unit.
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Burnage
Hekatrix
Burnage

Posts : 1073
Join date : 2017-09-12

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeSun Nov 04 2018, 23:54

@Elfric wrote:
Traktor Kannon spam is going to be a problem for Aeldari races. Auto hits, and has melta damage on Flyers. If it destroys a vehicle, that vehicle automatically explodes. 48' range, Strength 8, -2AP, D6 damage. A Traktor Kannon is 45 points, and you can have 6 in a unit.

Yeah, on paper that almost sounds like it's approaching hard counter territory for some Eldar lists.

Like, what's a Harlequin army going to be able to do against 18 of those?
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Elfric
Hellion
Elfric

Posts : 95
Join date : 2018-03-04

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 05 2018, 01:16

@Burnage wrote:
@Elfric wrote:
Traktor Kannon spam is going to be a problem for Aeldari races. Auto hits, and has melta damage on Flyers. If it destroys a vehicle, that vehicle automatically explodes. 48' range, Strength 8, -2AP, D6 damage. A Traktor Kannon is 45 points, and you can have 6 in a unit.

Yeah, on paper that almost sounds like it's approaching hard counter territory for some Eldar lists.

Like, what's a Harlequin army going to be able to do against 18 of those?

That's 810 points (18 total) but yeah. 2D6 picked the highest and exploding. So you pop one vehicle, the vehicle next to it takes a MW and then focus on the next one, rinse and repeat. This is going to be bad for Kabals, Quins and some Craftworld lists.

But there is so much more horrible stuff. You can teleport a unit up to 20Power Level in the deployment. So yes, that is Turn 1 set up something 9 inches away. This could be a Morkanaut, 3 Deff Dredds, Bonebreaker battlewagons with MANZ, etc. And then theres strats giving your vehicle 3D6 on the charge. There's relics that give Warbosses Power Klaws with flat 4 damage. Deathskulls army trait gets army wide 6++, every unit gets troop obj secured and cannot be outnumbered on an objective, plus every unit gets 1 free re-roll in the fight or shooting phase.

Honestly this Codex is really, really powerful.
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Garion
Kabalite Warrior
Garion

Posts : 113
Join date : 2011-12-10

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 05 2018, 10:54

@Elfric: the Gitfinda does stack indeed. How good are Shootaboyz and Battlewagons with the Freebooters kulture?

Evil Sunz and Skarboyz teleporting/jumping in are the other thigs that worries me at the moment. I feel we really need to up the disposable chaff units in our lists
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Elfric
Hellion
Elfric

Posts : 95
Join date : 2018-03-04

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 05 2018, 13:38

@Garion wrote:
@Elfric: the Gitfinda does stack indeed. How good are Shootaboyz and Battlewagons with the Freebooters kulture?

Evil Sunz and Skarboyz teleporting/jumping in are the other thigs that worries me at the moment. I feel we really need to up the disposable chaff units in our lists

I liked Shootaboyz in the battlewagon. I ran a unit of Ten with a Nob and Kombi Rokkit launcha and upgraded one boy with a big shoota. I was using them combined with the four bigshooters on the battlewagon to generate a kill that would then boost the Flashgitz up to +1 (+2 for the Kaptins).

I have to say I preferred Shootaboyz to Slugga Boyz. My Sluggaboyz and Stormboyz were just meat shields effectively. I did take 1 slugga boy freebooter squad, just to protect the Battlewagon if anything.

I get the impression this Codex has done everything it can to say "look, there are lots of powerful stuff here that you don't need to spam Boyz anymore". I am going to run Freebooters and Goffs this saturday, as the strat that gives Boyz Str5 seems too good to pass up. Plus Goffs all get exploding 6's in close combat as well as shooting thanks to DDD.
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mynamelegend
Kabalite Warrior
mynamelegend

Posts : 153
Join date : 2015-04-05

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PostSubject: Re: New Orks menace   New Orks menace I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 06 2018, 14:45

The new ork codex is going to be fun. My overall impression is that we've got competition in the "actually competitive" Xenos territory.

Defensively, most of their things rely on high toughness and decent wound counts both in numbers and multi-wound models, alongside enough leadership rules that they might as well have just written "orks are immune to the morale phase" and saved us all the bother.

Their offensive output is very varied and should be able to handle most problems, and you should expect solid profile coverage in both melee and shooting. And if they want to be they can be *FAST*. Some units can just casually stroll up to 22'' up the table and reroll anything they want to charge. Add a stratagem for 3d6 range and Mortal Wounds on the charge for their vehicles, just for fun. Tactical deployment will be A and O for surviving against speed lists.

All in all I'm excited, these guys look like they'll be fun to fight.
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