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amishprn86
Dracon
amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 18:50

@withershadow wrote:
@TeenageAngst wrote:
As someone who's been using Scourge Shredder bombs for months I can say that easily half the games I play, my Scourges end up squeezed in places tighter than a watermelon seed in a frog's butt due to the 9" restriction. Compared to 5 25mm bases, Raiders are a brick and won't fit anywhere your opponent doesn't want them.

This only applies if you have ancient Scourges. They rock 32mm bases now. I find they take up as much space as a venom.

Also, clearly none of you have seen a toad crap. Watermelon seeds? Hahaha.

No they dont....

"The set includes five 25mm bases. These miniatures are supplied unpainted and require assembly - we recommend using Citadel Plastic Glue and Citadel Paints."

Ive seen the new boxes open and they have 25mm for more proof

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Cerve
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 19:01

@amishprn86 wrote:
@withershadow wrote:
@TeenageAngst wrote:
As someone who's been using Scourge Shredder bombs for months I can say that easily half the games I play, my Scourges end up squeezed in places tighter than a watermelon seed in a frog's butt due to the 9" restriction. Compared to 5 25mm bases, Raiders are a brick and won't fit anywhere your opponent doesn't want them.

This only applies if you have ancient Scourges. They rock 32mm bases now. I find they take up as much space as a venom.

Also, clearly none of you have seen a toad crap. Watermelon seeds? Hahaha.

No they dont....

"The set includes five 25mm bases. These miniatures are supplied unpainted and require assembly - we recommend using Citadel Plastic Glue and Citadel Paints."

Ive seen the new boxes open and they have 25mm for more proof

They lie: new Scourges are on 32mm, just bought them 2 months ago.




Anyway IT, for 103 points you get 5 Kabal w/Shredder, into a Venom Splinter/rifle.
Get the Flayed Skull Obsession....

This little buggers is all the anti-infantry I need
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 19:01

Yeah.... i have a new box also and its 25mm

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TeenageAngst
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 19:17

My Scourges are almost all from 3rd edition so 25mm it is. If anyone has beef they can buy me new Scourges.

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Cerve
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 19:27

@amishprn86 wrote:
Yeah.... i have a new box also and its 25mm

This is pretty weird. We are 3 players here who found 32mm on them
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amishprn86
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amishprn86

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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 20:52

@Cerve wrote:
@amishprn86 wrote:
Yeah.... i have a new box also and its 25mm

This is pretty weird. We are 3 players here who found 32mm on them

That is weird.

I actually would rather them be on 32's myself, as of right now i have washers on them to keep them upright lol, i'll email GW to see what they say.

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CombatDrugs4Life
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 21:29

I feel like it's shredders that benefit the most from Obsidian Rose obsession but scourges don't get that. Therefore Obsidian Rose trueborn outshine the scourges. Venoms move faster and the trueborn shredders shoot much farther. Plus, if I end up taking morale and lose, they can pop off a lot of shots compared to scourges which just die.
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Wed Oct 24 2018, 21:56

@CombatDrugs4Life wrote:
I feel like it's shredders that benefit the most from Obsidian Rose obsession but scourges don't get that.  Therefore Obsidian Rose trueborn outshine the scourges.  Venoms move faster and the trueborn shredders shoot much farther.  Plus, if I end up taking morale and lose, they can pop off a lot of shots compared to scourges which just die.

Shredder Scourges are 92pts, Trueborn in Venom is 152pts, thats a big difference, yeah you are getting turn 1 and a venom. But there is something to be said for cheap.

If you took 3 units of Scourges thats 276pts, thats cheaper than 2 Trueborn units in Venoms (304pts), 3 Trueborns are 456pts, thats a full Ravager and Kabal unit difference!


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Cerve
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 00:29

@amishprn86 wrote:
@CombatDrugs4Life wrote:
I feel like it's shredders that benefit the most from Obsidian Rose obsession but scourges don't get that.  Therefore Obsidian Rose trueborn outshine the scourges.  Venoms move faster and the trueborn shredders shoot much farther.  Plus, if I end up taking morale and lose, they can pop off a lot of shots compared to scourges which just die.

Shredder Scourges are 92pts, Trueborn in Venom is 152pts, thats a big difference, yeah you are getting turn 1 and a venom. But there is something to be said for cheap.

If you took 3 units of Scourges thats 276pts, thats cheaper than 2 Trueborn units in Venoms (304pts), 3 Trueborns are 456pts, thats a full Ravager and Kabal unit difference!


Who cares about expensive Trueborns, I'm talking about normal Kabals. 5 with 1 Shredder into a Venom. Cost/Value is one of the best setting if picked from Flayed Skull.
You have only 1 Shredder but it ignores cover + 18 poisoned no-cover shots and rerolls of 1 to hit.
For 103 points.
And it's another veichle (usefull for target saturation, we live with that).
And it is usefull in turn 1 (19"+12" of threatening range).


I'm just saying that the shredder bomb is too expensive and it's not as valuable as these guys. Not with Scourges nor Trueborns.




BUT....about Scourges, I was thinking about deploying them in turn1, with 2-3 extra wounds (I mean other than the 4 gunners), in cover. If we going first they can move and shot. If you go second, you will pop the +1 cover for 2CP anyway, and if someone wanna shoot at them, for another 1CP (just for them this time) you get another +1 for cover. So you'll likely save on 2+/6+++. Overall they're just Scourges, if the opponent decide to spend all that fire for them it should be a win for you anyway.
It is not a shredder bomb, but a completely differente use of ours birdmen Smile
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withershadow
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 09:20

I bought 4 boxes of scourges, and they all came with 32mm bases. Anyway, I arm mine with haywire and dark lances.

I like the Obsidian Rose Trueborn in Black Heart Venoms. They tend to draw a lot of firepower, so it's fun to troll with lightning reflexes for a -2 to hit. If left unmolested, they sting.

Not sure how Orks will change this equation, in either case shredders are fantastic against them.
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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 12:34

@Cerve wrote:
@amishprn86 wrote:
@CombatDrugs4Life wrote:
I feel like it's shredders that benefit the most from Obsidian Rose obsession but scourges don't get that.  Therefore Obsidian Rose trueborn outshine the scourges.  Venoms move faster and the trueborn shredders shoot much farther.  Plus, if I end up taking morale and lose, they can pop off a lot of shots compared to scourges which just die.

Shredder Scourges are 92pts, Trueborn in Venom is 152pts, thats a big difference, yeah you are getting turn 1 and a venom. But there is something to be said for cheap.

If you took 3 units of Scourges thats 276pts, thats cheaper than 2 Trueborn units in Venoms (304pts), 3 Trueborns are 456pts, thats a full Ravager and Kabal unit difference!


Who cares about expensive Trueborns, I'm talking about normal Kabals.

But i wasnt talking to you..... i was talking to CombatDrugs4Life as he said Trueborn outshine Scourges and i was showing the cost difference.


@withershadow wrote:
I bought 4 boxes of scourges, and they all came with 32mm bases. Anyway, I arm mine with haywire and dark lances.

I like the Obsidian Rose Trueborn in Black Heart Venoms. They tend to draw a lot of firepower, so it's fun to troll with lightning reflexes for a -2 to hit. If left unmolested, they sting.

Not sure how Orks will change this equation, in either case shredders are fantastic against them.


I have 1 of each unit (other than base Shardcarbines), that was my goal. Hopefully HL's will be good one day again.

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Skulnbonz
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 18:29

@amishprn86 wrote:
Hopefully HL's will be good one day again.

Again?

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amishprn86
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 18:57

@Skulnbonz wrote:
@amishprn86 wrote:
Hopefully HL's will be good one day again.

Again?

At one point their were good on reavers Smile

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withershadow
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 21:02

@amishprn86 wrote:

I have 1 of each unit (other than base Shardcarbines), that was my goal. Hopefully HL's will be good one day again.

My second unit of "haywire" uses the heatlance models. Can tell the units apart, don't have to hunt for bits, get to use cool heat lance guns. Never had a problem since there are no heat lances in my lists, and no one knows what our guns look like anyway.

I have one left squad on sprue, I am not sure if I want to just give them base carbines to be used as ablative wounds, or go another route.

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CombatDrugs4Life
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Thu Oct 25 2018, 22:20

You could always walk shredderborn up the field. What I will be trying in my next casual game is walking a squad of 7, 2 shredders and 2 cannons, up the field in front of a trio of blaster archons in an Obsidian Rose supreme command detachment.
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closecraig
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Fri Oct 26 2018, 09:14

A 20 man blob of kabalites is my go to Shredder bomb. 4 shredders, 2 splinter cannons and 14 splinter rifles. I webway them in on turn 2, using Obsidian Rose, so 18 inches away - All for the budget price of 176 pts.

I use Failure is Not an Option strategem and choose my shredders. This unit puts out so many shots and are surprisingly reliable, especially with an archon hanging nearby.
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lcfr
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Fri Oct 26 2018, 14:41

@closecraig wrote:
A 20 man blob of kabalites is my go to Shredder bomb. 4 shredders, 2 splinter cannons and 14 splinter rifles. I webway them in on turn 2, using Obsidian Rose, so 18 inches away - All for the budget price of 176 pts.

I use Failure is Not an Option strategem and choose my shredders. This unit puts out so many shots and are surprisingly reliable, especially with an archon hanging nearby.

I've found it's good to have a Blaster or Dark Lance in the unit for Failure Is Not An Option, it helps cinch the kill!
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withershadow
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Sun Oct 28 2018, 19:39

That seems quite counter-intuitive, since a darklight weapon is less likely to score an infantry (read easiest) kill than a shredder or even splinter cannon in rapid fire range.
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Red Corsair
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Tue Nov 20 2018, 04:25

@amishprn86 wrote:
Yeah.... i have a new box also and its 25mm

You got an old repack then, they DEFINITELY come with 32mm slotta bases now.

In response to the thread, I like the idea but it's too expensive. You are almost abler to afford a 3 talos unit. With chain flails it will murder a horde way more efficiently.
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CombatDrugs4Life
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PostSubject: Re: Shredder bomb   Tue Nov 20 2018, 16:52

I had a squad of kabalites in a cannon venom with a shredder. They killed a custodes vexilarius in one turn easy and got a couple of his friends too. I was using flayed skull so rerolls on rapid fire but the shredder was gold. Better than poison up to T5. Better AP than a splinter shot. Just roll high for the number of shots. Im definitely trying shredderborn next time. I like the talos idea, but they just aren't fast enough. There are a lot of slow moving armies who hang back in my meta and a lot of players too chicken to move up.
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