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 Grots vs Talos

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Frowny
Hellion
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Posts : 38
Join date : 2017-08-27

PostSubject: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 16:13

Hey there,

I was considering a large block of something scary to rush up the center of the board. Seems like it might distract fire from squishier targets on the fringes. But in order for such a force to work synergistically with the rest of the army, it has to be relatively fast so they can't just deal with it on Turn 2-3 after shooting down all my raiders/venoms/reavers.

10 Grotesques +Urien, in WWP
10 Grotesques+ Urien, move, advance, ?fire and fade foward
3 Talos + Urien, Move, advance, fire and fade forward.
30 Wracks + Urien or a Heamunculus-Clearly the most attacks, definitely the slowest, works poorly with strategems, not multiwound so less likely to distract heavy weapons, but they are troops.

All are about 400pts.

First question: Can you fire and fade something that doesn't have a gun?

Grots have more attacks, more wounds, and are probably sturdier (100 pts buys you 12 T6 4++ wounds, 100 pts in talos only buys you 7 T7, 4++ wounds), but you lose out on the ranged weapons.

Has anyone had any luck with a coven heavy-list like that, possibly using them as a distraction or a must-deal-with mid-board threat?

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Voidhawk
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Join date : 2017-05-20

PostSubject: Re: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 16:28

@Frowny wrote:
First question: Can you fire and fade something that doesn't have a gun?

No. You can only Fire and Fade if you actually shoot something, so if you have no gun (or are out of range of your Liquifier) you're out of luck.
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Lord Asvaldir
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Join date : 2015-12-06
Location : Washington DC

PostSubject: Re: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 16:49

Yeah problem with fire&fade is you're going to get yourself outside of the haemonculus aura which is not great.

I have limited experience with coven units, I only just ran my first talos this past weekend and it didn't do a whole lot. I can definetly say though that it felt slow, by the time it was up in range to assault anything the game was already swinging in my favor, and my opponent didn't waste any firepower on it as he was much more scared of raiders full of warriors and ravagers. WWP might be a good way to bring them in, you may not make your charge on the turn they show up but you can drop them right up in your opponent's face where he's going to have to deal with them. I usually hate charging from deep strike, but grots can actually fail their charge and not die immediately unless your opponent throws a lot of firepower on them.

10 sounds like a very big unit to deep strike though. I'd go down to somewhere around 6-8.

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Martyr
Slave
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Join date : 2018-04-12

PostSubject: Re: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 17:30

Whats about:

Heamonculus with Mask
Urien
4 Grots

all in a Raider?

385 points
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withershadow
Sybarite
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Join date : 2018-04-02

PostSubject: Re: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 18:24

@Lord Asvaldir wrote:
Yeah problem with fire&fade is you're going to get yourself outside of the haemonculus aura which is not great.

This isn’t really true. You can still keep them in range of the aura due to the Talos base sizes, you don’t even have to advance if you don’t want to.

Given the gun restriction, you can try a trio of Talos rushing forward with a Haemonculus (and maybe Cronos?) behind. To avoid being outflanked and getting the Haemonculus sniped out, you can anchor this formation on both sides with a Raider of Wracks or Grots. The raiders would also get the T bonus, so it’s one big beefy block.
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Cerve
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Join date : 2014-10-05
Location : Ferrara - Emiglia Romagna

PostSubject: Re: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 21:57

Agree, Talos with Fire&Fade move of 8+D6+7", where Haemi is 7"+D6". If you have 3 Talos you can just leave one behind two and keep the 6" buff-range from the Haemi.
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withershadow
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Join date : 2018-04-02

PostSubject: Re: Grots vs Talos   Mon Apr 23 2018, 22:36

The Talos uses the large flying base, right? So that’s 2.34 inches, plus the 6” aura range means you still catch them as long as they didn’t advance further. Move he Haemonculus first, the Talos can fly over him now.
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