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Sky Serpent
Adrenalight Junkie
Sky Serpent

Posts : 2420
Join date : 2011-02-26
Location : Dais Of Administration

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PostSubject: THE SKY SERPENTS   THE SKY SERPENTS I_icon_minitimeFri Apr 20 2018, 21:09

Hello my fine Commorrites, I bring you a list for you to muse on. Please let me know your thoughts.

For me this feels quite fine tuned but almost soulless. I ponder on whether the Flayed Skull contingent is even needed and that I could move the three detachments into one and make space for Coven and Cult friends and hijinks. Staying away from Index choices.

THE SKY SERPENTS
 
Army Faction: Drukhari - Kabals
Command Points: 10
Deployment Drops: 14-22
 
~
 
SPEARHEAD DETACHMENT – Kabal Obsession: Black Heart, Keyword: Sky Serpents
 
HQ
Archon, Relic: Writ of the Living Muse, Huskblade, Warlord: Labyrinthine Cunning = 76pts
 
FAST ATTACK
5 Scourges, 4 Blasters = 128pts
5 Scourges, 4 Shredders = 92pts
 
HEAVY SUPPORT
Ravager,  3 Dark Lances = 140pts
Ravager, 3 Disintegrators = 125pts
Ravager, 3 Disintegrators = 125pts
Reaper, 150pts
 
~
 
BATTALION DETACHMENT – Kabal Obsession: Flayed Skull, Keyword: Sky Vipers
 
HQ
Archon, Agoniser = 74pts
Archon, Huskblade = 76pts
 
TROOPS
5 Kabalite Warriors, Blaster = 47pts
5 Kabalite Warriors, Blaster = 47pts
5 Kabalite Warriors, Blaster = 47pts
5 Kabalite Warriors, Blaster = 47pts
 
ELITES
Lhamean,  = 15pts
 
DEDICATED TRANSPORTS
Venom, 2 Splinter Cannons = 75pts
Venom, 2 Splinter Cannons = 75pts
Venom, 2 Splinter Cannons = 75pts
Venom, 2 Splinter Cannons = 75pts
Venom, Splinter Cannon = 65pts
 
~
 
AIR WING DETACHMENT – Kabal Obsession: Black Heart, Keyword: Sky Serpents
 
FLYERS
Voidraven Bomber, 2 Dark Scythes, Voidraven Missiles = 165pts
Razorwing Jetfighter, 2 Dark Lances = 145pts
Razorwing Jetfighter, 2 Dark Lances = 145pts
 
Army Total = 2,000/2,000pts

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Trueborn44
Kabalite Warrior
Trueborn44

Posts : 177
Join date : 2016-06-14

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PostSubject: Re: THE SKY SERPENTS   THE SKY SERPENTS I_icon_minitimeSat Apr 21 2018, 02:39

I have a few suggestions. For starters, I'd consider changing the huskblade on the warlord Archon to a Venom blade, he doesn't want to be anywhere near combat. I think the Huskblade can be fun but it's definitely best used with the Djinn blade AoC.

I'd also consider changing the blasters on the Scourges for Haywire Blasters. Haywire seems really good in terms of output but above all else, it's far less points invested in a unit that let's face it, is only just tougher than a guardsman. You have a lot of blasters and lances and generally anti heavy infantry throughout the list anyway, so changing these for something similar but less versatile seems fine. On the bright side as well, a lot of people will be less scared of Haywire compared to the str8 -4 d6 darklance shotguns.

I'll talk more about the transports later, but I would argue that the Lhamean in this list is here more or less to be the fall guy in the case that your Archon pimp-mobile gets popped. In which case, you might be better dropping the Lhamean and theArchon venom for a Raider. That way you can use your trusty Kabalites as fodder models in the event that your vehicle gets popped. You could then drop the now vacant Kabalite Venom to save yourself 75 points.

If you're considering taking the Djinn blade on one of the flayed skull Archons by spending a CP I would keep them as is right now, otherwise I would run both with the Agoniser or both with the venom blade depending on your preference.

Now, back to the Venoms. I don't rate the extra cannon at all. At 18" you get yourself an extra 4 shots for 10 points, which is admittedly much more points efficient than extra Kabalites, but at 12" the difference is only 2 shots. There's probably a certain amount of player preference in this, but by removing them you gain another 40 points and I don't think they're worth it.

So if you took my recommendations it would save you around 145 points I think. That's quite a lot of extra stuff you could fit in! If you want to go all out, you could delegate the heavy lifting entirely to the blasters and max out on the disintegrator cannons across the board. That would save you another 25 points. The logic for this is backed up by the math hammer someone on here did for lances vs. Disses, but obviously some level of preference comes in and I'm not sure if the DL performs better with the added rerolls to wound from WOTL.

If you were interested in taking some kind of alliance of Agony, the simplest way would be to drop one of the flyers and put the other two in with the spearhead detachment.

That should give you around 300 points to spend on another detachment. A couple options I can see would be to go for a vanguard detachment of Grotesques by dropping a unit of Scourges, or you could get 12 Reavers and a Succubus in a Red grief outrider by moving the 2 Scourges to the outrider. I would imagine theres a fairly simple way to get a fairly basic batallion of Coven or Cult with around 300 points. You'd be tight for points for upgrades in either case but you could probably shift things around enough to get it to your liking!

There's no denying that flayed skull is good. In fact all our obsessions are good. I'd argue though that having access to Vects agents is pretty key in competitive games though. So if you were to combine the detachments, Blackheart wins out in my eyes. However as the list stands and even with the changes I've suggested, you won't be able to include both Coven and Cult detachments without some pretty major surgery IMO.

Edited for spelling, grammar and too include the bit about flayed Skull.
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Scumbag
Slave
Scumbag

Posts : 13
Join date : 2017-08-29

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PostSubject: Re: THE SKY SERPENTS   THE SKY SERPENTS I_icon_minitimeSat Apr 21 2018, 10:32

Looks like a good list but in my opinion if you were to take Coven and Cult detatchments is class the flyers as Cult of Strife so if your void raven destroys a unit outright you can use the stratagem to shoot again
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Rodi Sikni
Kabalite Warrior
Rodi Sikni

Posts : 105
Join date : 2017-12-09

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PostSubject: Re: THE SKY SERPENTS   THE SKY SERPENTS I_icon_minitimeSat Apr 21 2018, 11:46

My opinion is that you should mix the weapons on the ravagers, 2 Disi and 1 DL each. In this way you can avoid that your opponent destroy 3 lances or 3 disi just destroying 1 ravager, he will have to destroy 3 of them to get rid of the threat, and besides this let you distribute better the shots by not having to choose the objetctives of the 3 DL or disi at the same time
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Crixalis
Hellion
Crixalis

Posts : 43
Join date : 2017-07-12

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PostSubject: Re: THE SKY SERPENTS   THE SKY SERPENTS I_icon_minitimeSat Apr 21 2018, 13:32

I don't know why opinions about Splinter Cannons have changed so drastically... when did it become a good idea to get your Venoms within 12" of other units? Even Imperial Flashlights can hose you down. Venoms want to skirt around at the tip of their range, 18" is as close as they should ever dream of getting. Their biggest boon is being able to cover each other with splinter fire even if spread out. If you have the points for the Splinter Cannons, keep them.

HWB Scourges are the most efficient load out imo, they're just as effective against most of the same vehicle targets. Also, the next time you face off against a Super Heavy or some Necrons you'll be thanking the Dark Muses that you brought some haywire along.

It does feel a little soul-less, but for my money this list (or something very close to it, at least) is about as competitive as we get. It's kind of sad that so much has changed and improved, but our 'best' list is still pretty much unchanged.

The easiest way to add a little variation is to follow Trueborn's advise and throw in a Cult. I can attest to the legitness of Red Grief Reavers.
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Trueborn44
Kabalite Warrior
Trueborn44

Posts : 177
Join date : 2016-06-14

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PostSubject: Re: THE SKY SERPENTS   THE SKY SERPENTS I_icon_minitimeSat Apr 21 2018, 16:49

@Crixalis There's a lot of reasons why the cannon fell out of favour, mostly the fact that we used to be able to fire 12 shots at 36" with no penalty. As it stands though, you don't lose a Heinous amount of firepower even if you do stay at 18" with the single cannon venom. The cannon is more points efficient than more Kabalites and sure it's a higher ceiling in terms of hits and wounds, but 40 points buys quite a bit with this codex. Not to mention that at 18" unless you kill what you're aiming at, they're getting a nigh on guaranteed return fire in rapid fire range. That doesn't change at 12 inches, it just gives them a better chance at assault. We aren't a durable army anyway, so 9/10 the unit being in assault range won't matter. And even if it does matter, you can hang back and not take that much of a loss. Cannons are points efficient in terms of poison, but is poison itself points efficient?
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