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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 16:17

So 12 CP for 5 HQs.

If you want to go for 5 HQs, you can go Battalion, Battalion, Outrider/Vanguard/Spearhead. It gives you 14 CP

Or Briguade + Outrider/Vanguard/Spearhead*2 for 17 CP.

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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 16:27

spearhead coven is a pain. 3x3 talos is like 900 points thats half your army... on the other hand a unit of one or even two talos is not worth it since you dont get full benefits from your stratagems
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GreyArea
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 16:48

@DevilDoll wrote:
spearhead coven is a pain. 3x3 talos is like 900 points thats half your army... on the other hand a unit of one or even two talos is not worth it since you dont get full benefits from your stratagems

To say they are not worth it just for a strat is a bit extreme in my view. You gain the the extra cp, have more freedom of movement and get the extra hq you want. Which strats are you building your 3 Talos units around that are worth it?

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SarisKhan
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 16:53

Seems my new primary list has turned out to be future-proof. I even get 2 additional CPs now!

I've been thinking about a variant where I add a Prophets of Flesh Spearhead to a Black Heart Battalion, a unit of 3 Talos and 2 individual ones with a Haemy (or a Urien counts-as). They'd be the distraction and anvil to the Kabalite hammer.
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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 16:57

@GreyArea wrote:
@DevilDoll wrote:
spearhead coven is a pain. 3x3 talos is like 900 points thats half your army... on the other hand a unit of one or even two talos is not worth it since you dont get full benefits from your stratagems

To say they are not worth it just for a strat is a bit extreme in my view. You gain the the extra cp, have more freedom of movement and get the extra hq you want. Which strats are you building your 3 Talos units around that are worth it?

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architects of pain (to get WS2 before turn 3), fire and fade and the torturers craft... all very crucial stratagems imo that arent worth spending for one talos but make a huge difference for three...


Last edited by DevilDoll on Tue Apr 17 2018, 17:29; edited 2 times in total
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Imateria
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 16:58

@DevilDoll wrote:
spearhead coven is a pain. 3x3 talos is like 900 points thats half your army... on the other hand a unit of one or even two talos is not worth it since you dont get full benefits from your stratagems
Thats a minor quibble as most of the stratgems that you can use on a Talos aren't that great.
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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 17:03

So with the new beta rules ... Isn't it impossible for us to even make a brigade that has an obsession? As we only have 1 troop choice per sub faction, and we need 6 troops minimum and being limited to three data sheets per army (I can't tell if this applies to transports too) we would be forced to mix in cult or coven to even meet the requirements for brigade ... But I suppose that isn't really a concern for us
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Mppqlmd
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 17:05

@Archon_91 wrote:
So with the new beta rules ... Isn't it impossible for us to even make a brigade that has an obsession? As we only have 1 troop choice per sub faction, and we need 6 troops minimum and being limited to three data sheets per army (I can't tell if this applies to transports too) we would be forced to mix in cult or coven to even meet the requirements for brigade ... But I suppose that isn't really a concern for us

Troops and transports aren't limited to 3.

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Burnage
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 17:05

@Archon_91 wrote:
So with the new beta rules ... Isn't it impossible for us to even make a brigade that has an obsession? As we only have 1 troop choice per sub faction, and we need 6 troops minimum and being limited to three data sheets per army (I can't tell if this applies to transports too) we would be forced to mix in cult or coven to even meet the requirements for brigade ... But I suppose that isn't really a concern for us

It doesn't apply to troops or dedicated transports.

A Kabalite Brigade could quite happily be something like 3 Archons, 6 x 5 Kabalite Warriors, 3 x 5 Mandrakes, 3 x 5 Scourges, 3 Ravagers, 3 Raiders.
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Archon_91
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 17:13

Thank you, I couldn't get a good read of the new beta rules, so I assumed wrongly it was blanket applied to all units.
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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 17:29

@Mppqlmd wrote:
So 12 CP for 5 HQs.

If you want to go for 5 HQs, you can go Battalion, Battalion, Outrider/Vanguard/Spearhead. It gives you 14 CP

Or Briguade + Outrider/Vanguard/Spearhead*2 for 17 CP.

Well no I don't think it's a case of I want to go 5 HQ's...

I would like Kabal, Cult and Coven
I do not want x3 heavy or elite from Coven
I do not want x3 fast attack from Cult
I would prefer to spam Kabs over other troop choices

I guess what I really want is a Raiding Party Wink

I really should just get back my Raiding Party list and accept I might have less CP than my opponents.
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inevitable_faith
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:01

I agree with you Dark Elf Dave. The raiding party was a great solution to running mixed Drukhari particularly in lower point battles and the CP it gave you was competitive with other peoples investment in a battalion. Now we pay more in the form of an extra HQ and are shorted 1 CP from others. Largely for me as well I don't want to run multiple clone HQ's, I don't want or need 2 archons/succubi/haemonculi. If we got mini-HQ's like Dracons and Syrens that would lessen the blow but GW won't do that. Would have been so easy to add 1 line of text in our FAQ bumping our raiding party CP to 6 or hell even 5 to match a battalion but apparently GW just can't let us have nice things.
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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:22

I think the Raiding Party should now be 6 CP. Why didn't they wait a week with the DE FAQ? Wait to see the reaction for the main FAQ and then address our issue.

Then again they would have known about this change coming in the FAQ...so perhaps this was always what they intended.


Last edited by Dark Elf Dave on Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:29; edited 1 time in total
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The Strange Dark One
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:27

For Coven I like taking the Vanguard detachment. I like that I can fit a unit of Grotesques along with their Haemonculus in a Raider for that nice T6. The 2 other elite slots will be filled with 2 units of Mandrakes or 1 Mandrake and another Grotesque unit.

I am not a great fan of Wracks, but I could take them if I wanted to. Similarly, I can get Pain Engines without a problem.

Similarly, the Outrider detachment works great for Cult. Take some Hellions with Cursed Blade or Reavers with Red Grief and fill your spare slots with Scourges. And if I am desperate on filling FA slots with cheap money, I'll just take Shardcarbine Scourges.

For Kabal I'll be using the Batallion. I could also see myself trying to run 2 Batallions in the future. One being Kabal one being Cult.

@Dark Elf Dave wrote:
I think the Raiding Party should now be 6 CP. Why didn't they wait a week with the DE FAQ? Wait to see the reaction for the main FAQ and then address our issue.

Then again they would have known about this change coming in the FAQ...so perhaps this was always what they intended.

I think so too. It really seems stupid that they didn't change that
If I may quote parts of the articles theyjust posted weeks ago:

GeeDubs wrote:
Each of these groups has its own set of Warlord Traits, faction rules and artefacts, and a Drukhari army is often made up of a collection of smaller Detachments from each faction – you’ll even be rewarded with more Command Points for doing so.

GeeDubs wrote:
This Stratagem allows you to protect a key unit from being shot off the table (or cut to pieces), and while the Command Point cost may seem steep, you’ll be able to pack loads into your Drukhari list with ease.

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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:42

Thinking about it now...Kabal battalion, Cult spearhead and Coven patrol should be fine for what I wanted.

+3 CP battle forged
+5 CP battalion
+1 CP spearhead outrider
+0 CP patrol
-1 CP alliance of agony
+D3 CP Soothsayer

Should give me an average of 10 CP am I right?


Last edited by Dark Elf Dave on Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:49; edited 1 time in total
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Keast Kannegaard
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:44



What are ppl's take on the last part? Kinda ruining Harlie Bombs, but i dont see it affecting DE?
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DevilDoll
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:45

@Dark Elf Dave wrote:
Thinking about it now...Kabal battalion, Cult spearhead and Coven patrol should be fine for what I wanted.

+3 CP battle forged
+5 CP battalion
+1 CP spearhead
+0 CP patrol
-1 CP alliance of agony
+D3 CP Soothsayer

Should give me an average of 10 CP am I right?

cult spearhead? im curious what you put in there...
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Barking Agatha
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:46

Well I dunno. We weren't even halfway through complaining about the new codex, and now we have to complain about these changes to it. How many hours of the day does GW think we can devote to complaining? We need our sleep!

On the other hand, please please please someone correct me if I'm wrong, but there's this:



Distances are measured from the bases of models (unless they are Hovering), and our Raiders and Venoms float over 1 inch above the ground, so... doesn't that mean that our vehicles can't be charged?

I've either missed something obvious because my poor brain is hopelessly addled or this is probably unintentional, but if we have to take the unintentional negative consequences of GW's fiddling about, surely it's only fair that we benefit from the positive ones? Smile

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Dark Elf Dave
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 18:48

@DevilDoll wrote:
@Dark Elf Dave wrote:
Thinking about it now...Kabal battalion, Cult spearhead and Coven patrol should be fine for what I wanted.

+3 CP battle forged
+5 CP battalion
+1 CP spearhead
+0 CP patrol
-1 CP alliance of agony
+D3 CP Soothsayer

Should give me an average of 10 CP am I right?

cult spearhead? im curious what you put in there...

I'm sorry yes I will amend that...I meant Outrider
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SarisKhan
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 19:11

@Dark Elf Dave wrote:
Thinking about it now...Kabal battalion, Cult spearhead outrider and Coven patrol should be fine for what I wanted.

+3 CP battle forged
+5 CP battalion
+1 CP spearhead outrider
+0 CP patrol
-1 CP alliance of agony
+D3 CP Soothsayer

Should give me an average of 10 CP am I right?

This is basically what I intend to try out at 2k as well. Should be fun.
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yellabelly
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 19:23

Yup I'm in with exactly that detachment selection. I figure a cheap coven patrol can earn its CPs with diabolical soothsayer, and a wrack unit can bodyguard my combat archon up the table with the haemie carrying the helm of spite, keeping close enough to deny but out of the worst fighting. I'd like to throw a unit of grotesques in too, but I'm properly put off by the mono-pose model. But a lone talos really doesn't offer much for the same points.

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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 19:31

@Keast Kannegaard wrote:


What are ppl's take on the last part? Kinda ruining Harlie Bombs, but i dont see it affecting DE?

It looks like it interacts with Fire and Fade, meaning you can't deepstrike units that F&F them into cover.
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Ragnos
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 20:09

@Barking Agatha wrote:
Well I dunno. We weren't even halfway through complaining about the new codex, and now we have to complain about these changes to it. How many hours of the day does GW think we can devote to complaining? We need our sleep!

On the other hand, please please please someone correct me if I'm wrong, but there's this:



Distances are measured from the bases of models (unless they are Hovering), and our Raiders and Venoms float over 1 inch above the ground, so... doesn't that mean that our vehicles can't be charged?

I've either missed something obvious because my poor brain is hopelessly addled or this is probably unintentional, but if we have to take the unintentional negative consequences of GW's fiddling about, surely it's only fair that we benefit from the positive ones? Smile


I think I will repost this in the rule section as I am also not sure how this is resolved.
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Soulless Samurai
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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 20:33

I'm not seeing the issue. How does charging a unit on the upper floor of a ruin relate to charging one of our skimmers?

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PostSubject: Re: New FAQ Out Today   Tue Apr 17 2018, 20:53

@Soulless Samurai wrote:
I'm not seeing the issue. How does charging a unit on the upper floor of a ruin relate to charging one of our skimmers?

The hover rule state you use the hull to calculate the distances from the raider. Since the hull is more than 1'' from the ground, the base of a model charging a raider is more than 1'' away. Hence, couldn't charge.
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